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  1. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by Kasierith View Post
    Alright one last response... wouldn't that kind of change the entire concept of the statute of limitations?
    Not the same. If you rob a store, the other party stops being wronged as soon as you leave the store. Someone who's been imprisoned doesn't stop being wronged until they're released.

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    No because the statute of limitations on perjury has passed on this case.
    then we'll agree to disagree, I think she should be punished, and I think the DA should be punished.

  3. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haarvald View Post
    then we'll agree to disagree, I think she should be punished, and I think the DA should be punished.
    Why the hell would you charge the DA?

  4. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    No, I think the statute of limitations on perjury should start when you actually commit the crime of perjury. And your threshold for when the statute of limitations should start is so vague it would literally never start.
    Then it seems the only thing we could both agree on is that the standards need to be raised for a conviction.

  5. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by Haarvald View Post
    then we'll agree to disagree, I think she should be punished, and I think the DA should be punished.
    See, I support the rule of law. You apparently don't.
    Not the same. If you rob a store, the other party stops being wronged as soon as you leave the store. Someone who's been imprisoned doesn't stop being wronged until they're released.
    You said "stopped being affected" which is so vague it would never happen.

  6. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Not the same. If you rob a store, the other party stops being wronged as soon as you leave the store. Someone who's been imprisoned doesn't stop being wronged until they're released.
    http://legal-dictionary.thefreedicti...of+Limitations

    Statutes of limitations, which date back to early Roman Law, are a fundamental part of European and U.S. law. These statutes, which apply to both civil and criminal actions, are designed to prevent fraudulent and stale claims from arising after all evidence has been lost or after the facts have become obscure through the passage of time or the defective memory, death, or disappearance of witnesses.

    It specifically applies to the criminal act itself. Not the harm caused by it.

  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    No, I think the statute of limitations on perjury should start when you actually commit the crime of perjury. And your threshold for when the statute of limitations should start is so vague it would literally never start.
    Actually, the statute of limitation for perjury begin at discovery of the offense. It wouldn't make any sense for it to begin when the lie is committed since, at the time, no one is aware of the perjury.

  8. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by nazrakin View Post
    Actually, the statute of limitation for perjury begin at discovery of the offense.
    Citation?

    Most start ticking on the date of harm, the only common exception is contract fraud.

  9. #409
    Good news.

    Not everyone thinks you should let criminals go free just because you're afraid of discouraging others from coming forward.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lested-10.html

  10. #410
    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Good news.

    Not everyone thinks you should let criminals go free just because you're afraid of discouraging others from coming forward.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lested-10.html
    This girl was 17.

  11. #411
    If people got put in jail for false rape claims... this man would still be in jail right now.. cause she sure as hell wouldn't have admitted it.

    She might not get jail time.... but everyone that knows her will now look at her differently and she'll always be that woman that lied about getting raped and got her father put in jail for 9 years.

  12. #412
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    This girl was 17.
    So we shouldn't have expected the girl in the OP to come forward when she reached 17?

  13. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Good news.

    Not everyone thinks you should let criminals go free just because you're afraid of discouraging others from coming forward.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lested-10.html
    Maybe you should get sources besides the daily mail; going off of sensationalism instead of news isn't the best tactic. From all I can find, she is still facing a judge and no decision has been finalized.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-24 at 01:11 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    So we shouldn't have expected the girl in the OP to come forward when she reached 17?
    17 when she committed perjury

  14. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by Maoli View Post
    If people got put in jail for false rape claims... this man would still be in jail right now.. cause she sure as hell wouldn't have admitted it.

    She might not get jail time.... but everyone that knows her will now look at her differently and she'll always be that woman that lied about getting raped and got her father put in jail for 9 years.
    Oh yeah, trusting society to adequately punish 9 years of wrongful imprisonment.

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    So we shouldn't have expected the girl in the OP to come forward when she reached 17?
    What I'm saying is this case is a horse of a different color. Girl was much much older when she lied and the crime was committed far more recently.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-24 at 12:13 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Oh yeah, trusting society to adequately punish 9 years of wrongful imprisonment.
    Well considering she wasn't locking her dad in a basement for 9 years she didn't commit wrongful imprisonment. Worst thing I can thing of is perjury or obstruction of justice. The wrongful imprisonment is on the back of the state here.

  16. #416
    I stopped reading at page 8. I don't think they should punish the woman who lied. In addition to the statute of limitations, she was 11 years old and had no way of being culpable for her actions. I do think the man deserves major civil recompense for false imprisonment - I lay the blame at the feet of the courts for convicting him on unreliable evidence.

    If a woman lies about rape and is an adult, or old enough to be tried as an adult, there should be a trial, and if there is enough evidence to prove that she lied, she should go to prison. I think there is an outcome possible (or even likely) wherein neither party would be convicted: There is not "beyond a shadow of a doubt" evidence to convict the man, nor is there enough evidence to convict the woman of lying.

    As far as fear of reporting rapes, the fear goes far beyond not being sure you'll be believed. A raped person whose victimization is made public faces a lot of potential social problem that are completely outside the justice system. And that goes for both genders, though the social problems manifest in different ways.

  17. #417
    Quote Originally Posted by Herrenos View Post
    I stopped reading at page 8. I don't think they should punish the woman who lied.
    I disagree. There needs to be punishment for this sort of thing, to stop women doing it carefree just because they dislike someone or think its funny. Age shouldn't matter on whether you get punished or not, it should just effect the nature of the punishment.

    She confessed as an adult, after several years being an adult. She should know right or wrong, so she needs to be shown her actions aren't without consequence.

    But should it be jail? No, there's too much of that already. She needs to be fined, and the money needs to be given to her victim. And if she can't pay up the required amount over the required time, she gets community service for a charity/organisation of his choice. Fair's fair, I think.

  18. #418
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    I disagree. There needs to be punishment for this sort of thing, to stop women doing it carefree just because they dislike someone or think its funny. Age shouldn't matter on whether you get punished or not, it should just effect the nature of the punishment.

    She confessed as an adult, after several years being an adult. She should know right or wrong, so she needs to be shown her actions aren't without consequence.

    But should it be jail? No, there's too much of that already. She needs to be fined, and the money needs to be given to her victim. And if she can't pay up the required amount over the required time, she gets community service for a charity/organisation of his choice. Fair's fair, I think.
    The issue I take with your argument is that she lied when she was 11, when she was incapable of being rational. Punishing her now will just tell anyone in the same situation that they should never tell the truth and instead should just let the falsely accused person rot in jail lest they risk punishment. You are in effect advocating punishing her for confessing.

    I think the situation would be different had it been an adult who had lied about being raped.

  19. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Herrenos View Post
    The issue I take with your argument is that she lied when she was 11, when she was incapable of being rational. Punishing her now will just tell anyone in the same situation that they should never tell the truth and instead should just let the falsely accused person rot in jail lest they risk punishment. You are in effect advocating punishing her for confessing.

    I think the situation would be different had it been an adult who had lied about being raped.
    Ah, so if an 11 year old commits murder, that's okay too?

    Yes, I took it to the next level. But its the same principle, where do you draw the line? If you've commited a crime you need to be punished for it, otherwise it encourages more crime. Age doesn't matter, claiming to 'not know better' doesn't matter. Mentally handicapped people don't get away with crimes, even if they have the minds of young children - they just have adjusted sentences in accordance with their status.

    At the VERY least she needs a criminal record. Getting away with it scott free is an insult to not only her father, but also other victims both of false accusations and rape. Its an affront to the concept of justice if it can be twisted like that, and then be defended by people!

  20. #420
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    You know if this discussion opens with a strawman I'm really not interested in talking about it with you.
    SO you just pop in, flame bait, and carry on? That's a pretty lame move. Ah well, just report for flame baiting I guess and move on.

    OT: this right here, this is what's fucking wrong with the world. But no, it doesn't stop there. Not if it was me. If it was me, I'd go after the government, we're talking at least 30 million AT LEAST, and there had better be some cops, court employees, a judge, and a few lawyers all losing their jobs, their pensions, and their licence to do the job.
    "There are other sites on the internet designed for people to make friends or relationships. This isn't one" Darsithis Super Moderator
    Proof that the mmochamp community can be a bitter and lonely place. What a shame.

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