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  1. #161
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    That's not good enough.

    Replicate the results a few hundred thousand times with a qualified sample (preferably random people from all walks of life who are honest about it) then I'll believe it.
    "A few hundred thousand times"? You might as well have said 10 billion.

  2. #162
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    A sample size can be a few thousand and still be pretty accurate if done right.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  3. #163
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    A sample size can be a few thousand and still be pretty accurate if done right.
    Exactly. I don't understand why Garian is demanding an x00,000 sample size.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Exactly. I don't understand why Garian is demanding an x00,000 sample size.
    Because it would be the equivalent of saying that all those people who disliked the Mists of Pandaria trailer spoke for everyone.

    They don't.

    This is something that I love about politics: you will take something that fits your argument but ignore it if it doesn't, or benefits the other side. You only care about winning an argument.

    The truth of the matter is you don't have a representative sample and therefore have no right to state this as a fact. It's just convenient for your worldview to believe that everyone is bisexual. It's an argument that's designed to undermine traditional values. I'm sorry, but you guys all still have both a mother and a father whether you like it or not.

    Why does it even matter that this politician is bisexual anyway? Honestly, who cares? Well apparently you guys do. It shouldn't matter but you've made it matter.

    I want real science. Replicate these facts to a satisfactory degree otherwise stop claiming that something is a fact when it isn't. Sorry to burst your bubble, but we don't live in a genderless world.


    In 100 years time, assuming that humanity is still here, men and women will still be having children together.
    "These people, Adam, they're like ghosts. Always in the shadows. Always hiding behind lies and proxy soldiers. I need you to find them. They cannot stop us. They cannot stop the future".

  5. #165
    Garian, I don't remember anyone here saying that EVERYONE is 100% bisexual.

    Also, there's a lot of people here that don't care if she's bi or not.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Majad View Post
    Garian, I don't remember anyone here saying that EVERYONE is 100% bisexual.

    Also, there's a lot of people here that don't care if she's bi or not.
    Here:

    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    The fact that sexual orientation is no longer considered a dichotomy but rather a spectrum where very few people actually falls exactly at the extreme ends?
    Semaphore believes that most of us exist between the extremes. Based on a biased unrepresentative study.

    I believe that the majority of people exist as extreme heterosexuals while a significant number of people are all over the map or exclusively gay.

    History is on my side here. Even as less and less people are having children and sex doesn't revolve around having children, heterosexual couples vastly outnumber everyone else.

    So which side of the argument stands up the most?
    "These people, Adam, they're like ghosts. Always in the shadows. Always hiding behind lies and proxy soldiers. I need you to find them. They cannot stop us. They cannot stop the future".

  7. #167
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    Here:



    Semaphore believes that most of us exist between the extremes. Based on a biased unrepresentative study.
    I already linked how about half of men fit "somewhere in that spectrum" and how about the other half fit "at the extreme end". However I was not able to find data for women.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  8. #168
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    Because it would be the equivalent of saying that all those people who disliked the Mists of Pandaria trailer spoke for everyone.

    They don't.
    Maybe, if you only asked those people that disliked the trailer. If you went to a WoW convention and asked a few thousand people there, you'd get a perfectly fine representative sample. Same as if you asked a few thousand people on the streets or over the phone about their sexual orientation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    The truth of the matter is you don't have a representative sample and therefore have no right to state this as a fact.
    No, the truth of the matter is you've fixated on a silly representative sample number and have decided to dismiss anything else as not a big enough sample. Sorry, but that just goes against science. The margin of error in a 1000 sample is, if i remember correctly, plus or minus 3. So why in the heavens would you need a 100 000 sample? You're the one who only cares about winning the argument, and you're doing that by making stuff up and lying.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    It's just convenient for your worldview to believe that everyone is bisexual. It's an argument that's designed to undermine traditional values. I'm sorry, but you guys all still have both a mother and a father whether you like it or not.
    I don't even believe everyone is bisexual. I'm not. I believe there's the heterosexual extreme and the homosexual extreme, and i believe anyone who is straight and even slightly attracted to their own gender or gay and even slightly attracted to the opposite gender could be defined as bisexual. I believe this is where the spectrum matters.

    I believe there are varying degrees of bisexuality, but i also believe there are purely straight people and purely gay people. Hell, I'm the latter, and i wont let anyone online tell me that research was done that somehow makes it impossible for someone like me to exist (which would mean I'm either lying or subconsciously deceiving myself).

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    Why does it even matter that this politician is bisexual anyway? Honestly, who cares? Well apparently you guys do. It shouldn't matter but you've made it matter.
    I care a lot, it shows the world is improving. I'm not happy for her, I'm happy something like this could happen in the first place.


    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    In 100 years time, assuming that humanity is still here, men and women will still be having children together.
    I don't think me or Semaphore have said there wont be. What's your point?

  9. #169
    Rukentuts: I don't buy it. If you can prove it beyond all doubt like we can prove that gravity is real then I'll believe it. I'll believe it when I see it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    Maybe, if you only asked those people that disliked the trailer. If you went to a WoW convention and asked a few thousand people there, you'd get a perfectly fine representative sample. Same as if you asked a few thousand people on the streets or over the phone about their sexual orientation.
    You know, I argued at the time that the trailer was a representative impression of the game, but the fan boys shot down the argument claiming that it only represented a small minority, and you know what? They weren't wrong. It was a representative sample of a different fanbase (namely real gamers), not the majority.

    1000 people is not enough to be representative. If you asked 1000 Creationists whether they believed that God created the Earth in 7 days, just because they'd say yes does not mean that they speak for the rest of us.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    No, the truth of the matter is you've fixated on a silly representative sample number and have decided to dismiss anything else as not a big enough sample.
    That's right. And sorry, but unless you can replicate the results over and over again, it's not a fact. It's not science. Science finds proof through repetition.

    Go outside and jump up and down 100 times. Now ask a million people to do it. Gravity will bring them all back down to Earth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    I don't even believe everyone is bisexual. I'm not. I believe there's the heterosexual extreme and the homosexual extreme, and i believe anyone who is straight and even slightly attracted to their own gender or gay and even slightly attracted to the opposite gender could be defined as bisexual. I believe this is where the spectrum matters.

    I believe there are varying degrees of bisexuality, but i also believe there are purely straight people and purely gay people. Hell, I'm the latter, and i wont let anyone online tell me that research was done that somehow makes it impossible for someone like me to exist (which would mean I'm either lying or subconsciously deceiving myself).
    If you believe that, then why let someone tell you that we mostly exist between the extremes as a fact (based on an unrepresentative biased study)?

    It's not a fact. It's a way to shut down the debate.

    Also, I agree. I accept degrees of sexuality, but people need to accept that a lot of people fall into the extreme categories. And that's not going to change.



    Now here is my position on politicians: we should elect the best people for the job regardless of their sex, race or sexuality. It simply shouldn't matter. This is being wielded as a weapon in a war of ideas in order to buy votes.

    What if it turns out that she is a terrible politician? People overlooked that because of her gender and sexuality. Sorry, but that just won't work.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wikiy View Post
    I don't think me or Semaphore have said there wont be. What's your point?
    My point is, we don't live in a genderless world.
    Last edited by Garian; 2012-11-25 at 10:30 PM.
    "These people, Adam, they're like ghosts. Always in the shadows. Always hiding behind lies and proxy soldiers. I need you to find them. They cannot stop us. They cannot stop the future".

  10. #170
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    Rukentuts: I don't buy it.
    Well, that sounds like a personal problem then.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    Well, that sounds like a personal problem then.
    No, just prove it to me beyond all doubt.

    I can prove to you that micro-evolution is real with fruit flies, so asking for proof isn't asking too much.
    "These people, Adam, they're like ghosts. Always in the shadows. Always hiding behind lies and proxy soldiers. I need you to find them. They cannot stop us. They cannot stop the future".

  12. #172
    Why are democrats so fixated on sexual orientation and race? Who cares? I read this and all I can say is, who gives a crap?

  13. #173
    The Unstoppable Force Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    No, just prove it to me beyond all doubt.
    That would require a survey of every single human being on Earth. Statistical surveys have a margin of error for a reason. They can be pretty damn confident with a general result.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    I wouldn't expect someone who thinks science provides proof to know that.

  14. #174
    Why does anyone care?

    Anyone who isn't past the stigma of non-straight sexuality is ignorant and their opinion doesn't matter anyway. Everyone else has no reason to give a shit.

  15. #175
    Mechagnome beneholio's Avatar
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    Good for her but honestly what does her sexuality have to do with anything?
    Take A Walk On The Wild Side

  16. #176
    As long as she gets her job done without corruption, idc what she does in the bedroom
    I play many games. WoW, Rift, D3, PoE, SC2 I will not criticize your game choice if you don't mine.

  17. #177
    The Lightbringer Mandible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dd614 View Post
    Why are democrats so fixated on sexual orientation and race? Who cares? I read this and all I can say is, who gives a crap?
    And you claim your republicans aren't? or did you just need to bring your discontent towards your democratic party?
    "Only Jack can zip up."
    The word you want to use is "have" not "of".
    You may have alot of stuff in your country, but we got Lolland.

  18. #178
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Correction, first porn star to be elected. >_>

  19. #179
    Her sexuality shouldn't matter. She shouldn't be treated better or worse than a hetero person. Did people vote for her based on sexuality? Thats just stupid.

  20. #180
    Fluffy Kitten Wikiy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    1000 people is not enough to be representative. If you asked 1000 Creationists whether they believed that God created the Earth in 7 days, just because they'd say yes does not mean that they speak for the rest of us.
    By that logic, you'd need to ask the entire Earth to prove something. Seriously, what kind of an argument is that? You might as well have said: "If you asked 100 000 Creationists whether they believed that God created the Earth in 7 days, just because they'd say yes does not mean they speak for the rest of us." And guess what, you'd have had the magical sample number you approve of. Again, you're just fixating on silly values that no living scientist on Earth uses when conducting research that requires polling people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    That's right. And sorry, but unless you can replicate the results over and over again, it's not a fact. It's not science. Science finds proof through repetition.

    Go outside and jump up and down 100 times. Now ask a million people to do it. Gravity will bring them all back down to Earth.
    Huh? Find me 1000 people, I'll ask them the same question 100 times and you'll have your proof and your repetition.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    If you believe that, then why let someone tell you that we mostly exist between the extremes as a fact (based on an unrepresentative biased study)?

    It's not a fact. It's a way to shut down the debate.
    I'm not letting Semaphore tell me anything, I'm just too scared of her to debate her.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    Now here is my position on politicians: we should elect the best people for the job regardless of their sex, race or sexuality. It simply shouldn't matter. This is being wielded as a weapon in a war of ideas in order to buy votes.

    What if it turns out that she is a terrible politician? People overlooked that because of her gender and sexuality. Sorry, but that just won't work.
    What makes you think she was voted for because of her sexual orientation or gender? I'd say it was in spite of both.


    Quote Originally Posted by Garian View Post
    My point is, we don't live in a genderless world.
    If we lived in a genderless world we'd all be hermaphrodites. I still don't get your point.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-26 at 01:35 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Krolikn View Post
    Her sexuality shouldn't matter. She shouldn't be treated better or worse than a hetero person. Did people vote for her based on sexuality? Thats just stupid.
    I doubt that. Chances are, there were more people who decided not to vote for her exactly because of her sexual orientation even though she seemed like a viable candidate to them than those that voted for her because she was bi.

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