1. #1
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    LF friend advice

    I see stuff like this pop up all the time. So...why not, I say. I'll give it a go. I've got an issue with a friend of mine.

    This internet friend of mine (who, yes, is a woman) very recently left our guild after being a part of my healing team for two years plus (I am the healing CL here...or rather was, the guild is now since dead). I was perfectly happy and things were stable until she left, then complete chaos erupted. I don't deal well with chaos (for many reasons from my past, of which are not entirely relevant to this particular discussion). I became very attached to that stability and, as such, having it removed really took me for a turn for the worse. I think my obsession with that stability got misdirected more towards her, as I just wnated to raid with her again because it actually made raiding something enjoyable and not just something to do three nights a week.

    Now, before anyone says it, no. I'm not in love with her or anything. We are just friends and that is all I ever would want to be. Besides which, she is married to a very great guy and has two children. I'm not a person who really contemplates trying to wreck homes or anything.

    Anyway, back to my point, I just felt the need (or desire, I'm not sure which really transpired) to show her what her presence meant for me. When asked on her new guild's application "What makes you enjoy raiding", I told the truth. When I started playing this game, I started to raid with my friends. As I left them behind, I raided for myself. Now that I have new friends, I raid for both...and really most of that can be contributed to one person (being her, of course). She helped me to really open up again, something I have not done with other people in a very long time.

    Well, her husband saw what I said and did not approve. Though I thought I was careful in my word selection, maybe I wasn't careful enough with how I was expressing myself and he has the notion that I am obsessed with her directly (which isn't really the case, it's more what she represents to me). He's mad really at both of us. I want to smooth out this situation, but I'm not sure how to go about it. I have not asked her what she thinks I can do to help, though I likely will at some point.

    Anyway, that's my story. Advice team, commence...um, dispensing advice?

  2. #2
    Constructive advice: Rephrase this post into an email and send it to him. Elaborate more on the fact that you don't see her as anything but an excellent raiding team member and find it difficult to sync with other teams.

    Honest advice: Acquire a basic social filter and insert it immediately. Seriously, use some common sense in future and don't rush into things. You'll avoid many of these situations in the future.

  3. #3
    Mechagnome Osyrus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UncleSilas View Post
    Constructive advice: Rephrase this post into an email and send it to him. Elaborate more on the fact that you don't see her as anything but an excellent raiding team member and find it difficult to sync with other teams.

    Honest advice: Acquire a basic social filter and insert it immediately. Seriously, use some common sense in future and don't rush into things. You'll avoid many of these situations in the future.
    I agree.

    You are what woman call 'stalkerish'. Youre coming off strong and making her uncomfortable- or at least her husband. This seems one of those instances you spill your guts to the cat/dog/pillow and move on. Even if youre crazy you never say it....lol

  4. #4
    Sorry to say it, but I would be in the same boat as her husband. Word it however you want, you clearly have some form of obsession for her and some people issues. I honestly mean no offense by this, but this really comes off as stalker mentality. Just about any man would be uncomfortable with that, and she probably is too. Just back off and find new people to play with, and make an attempt not to complicate things.

  5. #5
    Don't see why people are saying it's obsession. You enjoy raiding with her, as a friend, if it was a guy you probably would have made the same application. You seem to have troubles with changes and that's fine, just don't hold on to old things in the form of a person. Join the guild if you actually want to be there and not just because of her.

    I got plenty of male friends who purely applied to guilds I was in because we were good friends and I never experienced that as stalkerish :/.
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  6. #6
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    No, she wasn't bothered by it. She thought it was very sincere (those were her exact words). Though she did see why her husband (and you three, as additional examples) could misconstrue the message.

    She knows (though he doesn't, I suppose) that I greatly respect her husband. There's reasons for that of which aren't important, but honestly all I really enjoy is (as previously pointed out) having a fun and entertaining and, most importantly, friendly person to raid with.

    I'll be a bit more upfront. I have trust issues with people. I do not trust people. I have been hurt many times by friends, family, romantic interests...and, more to the point, I've never had a stable atmosphere surrounding me. However, once I begin to trust someone, yes. I do get connected. It's not something that I will talk about, though, until said connection is severed or threatened, especially if the connection is stable beforehand. Ours definitely was. Until she left the guild, I don't even think I had really talked to her about how I view her as a friend. I didn't ever think I needed to. We would just talk and have fun and even an occasional disagreement (like any friends would) followed by someone apologizing to someone else for being dumb and everything being hunky dory.

    Yeah, I'll be the first person to admit I'm a bit screwed up. Life didn't hand me a great deck of cards to play with. I just want things back to the way they were when I was happy and not acting like a total basketcase and my friend wasn't in trouble with her husband because of me. That's all. I dunno what to do to fix that.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-25 at 06:06 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ayarea View Post
    Don't see why people are saying it's obsession. You enjoy raiding with her, as a friend, if it was a guy you probably would have made the same application. You seem to have troubles with changes and that's fine, just don't hold on to old things in the form of a person. Join the guild if you actually want to be there and not just because of her.

    I got plenty of male friends who purely applied to guilds I was in because we were good friends and I never experienced that as stalkerish :/.
    As a side note, I think this much better communicated the point I was trying to get across. Thank you. Yes, we are just friends and I do like raiding with her. We make a great team and yes, I do not take change very well. I mean there are other friends of mine that are in that guild, as well, and they are the only remaining 25-man guild Alliance side on our server. There are obvious other reasons that I would like to join that guild, but I won't lie and say that playing with my friend who I am glad to call such isn't one of them.

  7. #7
    I started playing MMO's in 2002. I have met and played with many many people I liked/respected/had a great time with. Over those years, I have learned that guilds break up, people move on and sometimes the people you really like leave the guild/game. I recently had two long time WoW friends stop logging on. He had just joined a HC raiding guild and was excited to raid. Suddenly they both stopped logging on. His gf came back, said they got married and he would be back soon. So far, nothing, he has been offline for over 6 months now. I played with him a lot, much more than I did with his GF. He was a nice person and fun to play with.

    Your friend is an in game friend and those friendships change over time. There will come a day when she or you quit and then no longer have WoW in common. I would honestly work on your trust issues and find more people irl to be friends with. You might want things to be the way they were, but that will never happen.
    Last edited by Seirith; 2012-11-26 at 01:23 AM.

  8. #8
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    I can see that point, but we also talk outside of the game. I know it might sound crazy but we aren't really "in-game friends", we're more like "friends who met in-game". We have each other's phone numbers and have exchanged friendly texts (yes, just friendly :P ) and called each other on occasion just to talk.

    I think that's the biggest reason I'm having such a difficult time with this. It's not the feeling of losing an in-game friend, that would actually not really upset me. I have been in this game long enough to know that guilds and guild members come and go.

    I mean, right now I'd do just about anything to make this situation right, no matter what the cost might be. The last thing I wanted to ever happen is this. She thinks of me as a real friend, too. I told her one day if I ever got married I'd invite her to the wedding and the first thing she said was "Oh! I could be your best man!". I mean...you don't just say that to someone unless you are good friends with them. It's actual friendship. But her husband being mad at her over me, of all things, just makes me feel even worse than I did when I was struggling with what to do without being able to raid with her.

    One of my friends says I should just ask her what I should do. Does that seem a good course of action? My friend says that this should just blow over at some point, and I'm hopeful that by then I've at least found a good place to raid where I can enjoy someone else's company. Another friend of mine is going to maybe join a guild's second 10-man group, and she's also a healer. That would likely be fun, I think.

  9. #9
    It kind of sounds like he might have some trust issues also. I think if I was ever in that position I would be blunt with the husband by saying that she is my friend nothing more nothing less. I do not want to marry, have sex, or have any romantic type of relationship whatsoever. I may even offer to stop talking to her a token of good will. If that doesn't work I'm not sure anything would.

    I would be curious to read what exactly you wrote if possible.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Skippy88 View Post
    It kind of sounds like he might have some trust issues also. I think if I was ever in that position I would be blunt with the husband by saying that she is my friend nothing more nothing less. I do not want to marry, have sex, or have any romantic type of relationship whatsoever. I may even offer to stop talking to her a token of good will. If that doesn't work I'm not sure anything would.

    I would be curious to read what exactly you wrote if possible.
    what? stop talking to you friend because your husband can't control himself? Hell no.

    OT: Email her husband paraphrases and telling him what you meant, try to talk to him, and if he cant see that you really didn't mean any harm then there is no use. I have been in a similar situation as you and talking to him really helped.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." -Friedrich Nietzsche

  11. #11
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    Maybe you are right, both of you. I know it might not be the best course of action for me to stop talking to my friend entirely, but I'd be willing to do it at the expense of my friend if it meant that her marriage was in a better state than it has been lately.

    She's hopeful that things will blow over. Perhaps I should just lay low. I dunno about talking to him right now, I think he would just ignore me and what I had to say would fall on deaf ears.

  12. #12
    The Insane Reeve's Avatar
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    Honestly, you sound like a good person who was just trying to be friendly and genuine. So please understand that my comments aren't coming from a place of meanness.

    Without reading the comments you made, I can't be sure how it came off, but my suspicion is that it came off as a declaration of love, whether romantic or platonic. That's an inappropriate declaration to make to a married woman. There are social boundaries, and that kinda shatters them and makes you appear to be a bit of a creepy stalker. You can show appreciation for people through your actions and simple direct compliments. Pouring your heart out on a public forum to a married woman though is not OK. Not only does it make you look stalkerish, but it also makes her and her husband uncomfortable and has the potential to wreck the friendship.

    I understand that you may have background issues in your life, but the world doesn't care about that. It cares that you respect the social norms and integrate as a normal adult. Part of that is not acting too close to someone who is in a relationship. I have a woman friend right now who I go over to her house every Sunday night after we share a curry, and we watch a TV show. I have a lot of fun with her, and she dates different guys and I date different girls. The minute that dating turned into a boyfriend for her or a girlfriend for me, it would become inappropriate for me to come over to her place for our TV night without his presence or at least his explicit approval, and I wouldn't be able to ask for that approval; it would have to come from her. It's about respecting the relationship.

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  13. #13
    The Lightbringer Whitey's Avatar
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    I'm down with what Reeve said, pretty much described my thoughts exactly. OP, you came off as socially awkward at best no matter how innocent your intentions, and beyond explaining this stability issue you have to the husband I see no other solution.
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  14. #14
    I am Murloc! Fenixdown's Avatar
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    Thank you for the replies. It gave me some additional perspective. However, the situation is resolved according to her. We spoke at length about it and many other things earlier this morning. We are still friends, and she says that will never change.

    I feel much better knowing that.

  15. #15
    The Insane Reeve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenixdown View Post
    Thank you for the replies. It gave me some additional perspective. However, the situation is resolved according to her. We spoke at length about it and many other things earlier this morning. We are still friends, and she says that will never change.

    I feel much better knowing that.
    I'm glad to hear it worked out.
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  16. #16
    The Lightbringer Kerath's Avatar
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    What Reeve said.
    It's difficult to tell from that outside, but maybe explaining your motivation to her husband would help - maybe give him a little time to simmer down first.
    I've no doubt in my mind that you genuinely feel nothing more than friendship and you were simply trying to express your gratitude to your friend, but I can understand how her husband got the wrong idea.
    It can be difficult to correctly interpret the words someone writes when you cannot see facial expressions or hear their tone of voice (see it happen here often enough!), and given that the man loves his wife (I hope!) it's not too much of a stretch for him to imagine another man loving her too.

    Edit: Never mind - glad that the situation is resolved
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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Skippy88 View Post
    It kind of sounds like he might have some trust issues also. I think if I was ever in that position I would be blunt with the husband by saying that she is my friend nothing more nothing less. I do not want to marry, have sex, or have any romantic type of relationship whatsoever. I may even offer to stop talking to her a token of good will. If that doesn't work I'm not sure anything would.

    I would be curious to read what exactly you wrote if possible.
    Yea because guys are supposed to believe other guys, especially ones on the internet, when they're acting really obsessive around their spouse.

    I'd be suspicious too if I were the husband. You really shouldn't have put them in that situation, man. I don't know what you wrote specifically, but it was probably something big (going by how you described it here), and even if you didn't say you were attracted to her, it still would be creepy for the husband to see something like that.
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  18. #18
    I truly believe that there are other issues between your friend and her husband that go way beyond you Fenixdown.

    Not sure if you can tell by my username or not but I am female. I am also married and my husband plays WoW as well. I cannot imagine my husband becoming that mad/jealous to the point it caused us issues over a friend in game. In fact, right now I have a good male WoW friend. He and I are in different guilds but our guilds raid together. I talk to him a lot in game and on vent, even when not raiding. We are just friends. He also talks to my husband but not nearly as much as he talks to me. My husband is not jealous or upset because I talk to a guy. He knows he is just a friend I like to talk to and play WoW with.

    Glad to know things have worked

  19. #19
    Hope you work everything out.

  20. #20
    I'd say go for an unreserved apology and said you were babbling about trying to find a girl because of how lucky the mad husband actually is, and didn't mean to make it seem like you were lusting over her.

    But I wouldn't trust myself.

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