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  1. #1

    Noob Rogue Question - What two specs for raiding?

    I have not raided with a rogue in ages, and unfortunately I can't seem to find a guide that will answer by basic question:

    What two specs should a PVE focus on? I have been going with Assassination for Single Target fights (feng, garajal, spirit kings) and Combat for Multi-target (stone guards, will). I haven't actually started MV on this alt, so I'm sort of just winging it thus far in terms of figuring out an approach.

    Does this seem accurate?

    Which of the two should I focus my reforges/gemming on?

    Thoughts?

  2. #2
    Combat has the best cleave (blade flurry) in the game (as far as i know) so if you have 2 targets at once that need DPSing - Combat is probably it.

    For a standard single target i guess assassination is easier to play than subtlety, with combat being easy in any case.

  3. #3
    Scarab Lord Viridiancity's Avatar
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    Combat is a given, for any fight where there's any cleave.

    Sub and Assassination are top for single target. It's close enough that it's your choice. I personally defer sub for the awful positioning requirements.

  4. #4
    on top of being easier to play (sub is MUCH harder to be perfect with) assasination is also higher single target DPS at every currently achievable gear level.

    There are addons that make reforging take like a minute (hearth back, click addon, summoned back) but if youre in a raid where this would not be achievable, mut and combat are pretty much opposites for stats. I only go combat for SG and galaron at this point, so i spend 100% of non progression time reforged for mutilate

  5. #5
    Assassination doesn't only have superior single target damage, but also AoE damage. The addon you are looking for is called ReforgeSaver. ReforgeSaver allows you to swap back and forth between reforging profiles so you can change everything in a heartbeat. Just be aware that it can get rather costly, I normally spend about 1.5k per raiding night on reforging.
    Bovan.9481
    Completed legendaries: Twilight, Sunrise, (Eternity), Incinerator, Bolt, Quip, Frostfang, The Dreamer, The Moot, The Juggernaut, Howler.
    Current projects: Frenzy, mini Llama.

  6. #6
    Combat for cleave fights, Mut for single target fights. Subt isn't nearly as good as Mut at low gear levels. Even at BiS, Mut may still be better (but it will be much closer).

  7. #7
    Try something that offer enjoy.
    Atm saddly not funny playing rogue.

  8. #8
    Stood in the Fire Kyok's Avatar
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    On the side note - I do not want to create new thread for such a silly question
    Will reforges from Combat will fit enough to Subtlety? Becasue Shadowcraft showing that Mastery is a bit over Haste where it is totally different in Combat.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyok View Post
    Subtlety
    *Cringe*

    Quote Originally Posted by Kyok View Post
    Will reforges from Combat will fit enough to Subtlety? Becasue Shadowcraft showing that Mastery is a bit over Haste where it is totally different in Combat.
    It'll be fine. In T14 BiS gear Haste is actually better than Mastery. The better your gear becomes to smaller the gap between Haste and Mastery becomes.
    Bovan.9481
    Completed legendaries: Twilight, Sunrise, (Eternity), Incinerator, Bolt, Quip, Frostfang, The Dreamer, The Moot, The Juggernaut, Howler.
    Current projects: Frenzy, mini Llama.

  10. #10
    Stood in the Fire Kyok's Avatar
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    Thanks Bovan
    What does the first "emote" under quotation means?

    Edit: And is Sub really worth if I dont have daggers? I mean Hemo spam.

    Edit2: @ down - got it
    Last edited by Kyok; 2012-11-25 at 07:03 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyok View Post
    What does the first "emote" under quotation means?
    Uh, well English is not my first language so it's a bit difficult to describe. You know that feeling when someone nearby scratches a chalkboard with his/her nails? Basically the reaction humans get when someone does that is a cringe.

    I for one hate Subtlety with a passion. Just hearing about someone wanting to play the spec makes me cringe.
    Bovan.9481
    Completed legendaries: Twilight, Sunrise, (Eternity), Incinerator, Bolt, Quip, Frostfang, The Dreamer, The Moot, The Juggernaut, Howler.
    Current projects: Frenzy, mini Llama.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovan View Post
    Uh, well English is not my first language so it's a bit difficult to describe. You know that feeling when someone nearby scratches a chalkboard with his/her nails? Basically the reaction humans get when someone does that is a cringe.

    I for one hate Subtlety with a passion. Just hearing about someone wanting to play the spec makes me cringe.
    You correctly described your feelings with the emote.

    Im the opposite, i would actually love to play sub, but only if playing sub will be worth the work. if you have to work 200% harder to play it but you get 150% of the DPS increase it would be worth it for me. But then again, my feelings about sub are from when sub had great survivability, unique playstyle and amazing toys and so on that has slowly been taken away from it to give it higher dps.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by eijin View Post
    You correctly described your feelings with the emote.

    Im the opposite, i would actually love to play sub, but only if playing sub will be worth the work. if you have to work 200% harder to play it but you get 150% of the DPS increase it would be worth it for me. But then again, my feelings about sub are from when sub had great survivability, unique playstyle and amazing toys and so on that has slowly been taken away from it to give it higher dps.
    The irony is that, comparatively to other specs, when we lost all of the "boosts" (passive healing over other specs, ability to spec survival, etc.) we ALSO lost single-target DPS compared to other specs, and didn't really keep up on the on-demand target-swapping the others have at the same time.

  14. #14
    Yeah as opposed to sub having like 5 extra survivability things (6 maybe) they made it where ALL specs get to choose 2 of them. atleast sub still has on call burst dps as its claim to fame.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by eijin View Post
    Yeah as opposed to sub having like 5 extra survivability things (6 maybe) they made it where ALL specs get to choose 2 of them. atleast sub still has on call burst dps as its claim to fame.
    except unless there is another spine like burst phase sub is to far behind in the rest of the fight at prity much everything baring a 3-4 ad fight where Crimson tempest ticking from sub on 4 mobs 100% of the time would posibbly make it beter than combat due to sub's super buffed tempest after the first refresh, otherwise it's lower than assasination on single and worse on 2 target to combat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Obelodalix View Post
    What the fuck did you just say.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by eijin View Post
    You correctly described your feelings with the emote.

    Im the opposite, i would actually love to play sub, but only if playing sub will be worth the work. if you have to work 200% harder to play it but you get 150% of the DPS increase it would be worth it for me. But then again, my feelings about sub are from when sub had great survivability, unique playstyle and amazing toys and so on that has slowly been taken away from it to give it higher dps.
    i;m sorry what? higher dps since when Sub is higher dps Muti just smash sub on all the fights

  17. #17
    I loved Sub back in Cataclysm because of the on-demand burst, despite target swapping. When the spec lost that, it lost its main raiding purpose, I feel, and now it's just a slightly worse/better version of Combat, with a horrible positional requirement and without the cleave.

    I would love for Sub to be a viable option for switch-heavy fights again; the burst and the quick swap was really what made the spec(and coincidentally, made me love and enjoy the spec).

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-26 at 03:07 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kezuma View Post
    i;m sorry what? higher dps since when Sub is higher dps Muti just smash sub on all the fights
    You misunderstood him.
    He didn't say "Sub does 200% more damage" or anything of that sort; He said IF Sub did 200% more damage than the other specs, THEN it would be good, because right now, it's not.

  18. #18
    well, said 200% the work for 150% the reward and id play it. what i basically ment is even if the work/reward ratio is still off, as long as you have to work noticeably harder but get a noticeable reward i would like it. but sadly they have moved away from that.

  19. #19
    If you're looking to save money and still be effective go for Mut/Combat and reforge for Mut. There are like only 3 fights were combat really shines (Doggies, Bug, Bug Doc). It will do really okay with mastery>haste>crit reforges too there, and in every other fight Mut is really gonna shine. (Heck, I even got ranked top50 with my LFR mainhand and Assa reforges as combat :> )

    There are even some execute bosses (Elegon, Empress, even maybe Tsulong) where it's really awesome.
    You may see some higher Combat DPS at Worldoflogs at some other bosses, but that's only because, yes, there are sometimes cleave opportunities, but that doesn't mean you really should cleave in that moment. Empress for example: The singletarget damage on her is much more important than killing the adds quickly. If the adds die to quickly you can even mess up your raid.
    Last edited by Bluegirl91; 2012-11-26 at 03:38 PM.

  20. #20
    Go with the specs whose you have weps for.

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