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  1. #21
    I am Murloc! Grading's Avatar
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    Okay, time for some for "counter-commenting":

    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    Rumble game
    You are right on everything. I'd just like to explain a few things: I went Sorc Boots because they never went any MR until really late, so I went for the "true damage". Though I went for MR way too late myself. I stood at the fountain considering getting an Amp Tome, but opted for map vision.

    Also the "random ult" was because I managed to press R instead of E! That was like "oh god why". I told the Teemo "you didn't see that!". That was just... wow.

    Rumble is definitely one of my most experienced tops, so ironing out my mistakes is something I would like to do. Thanks for your comment!

    Quote Originally Posted by Isrozzis View Post
    Alright. There were a lot of things that went wrong here.
    You are absolutely right. Darius jungle was pretty much a "rush pick", so I went in without really being too experienced with him at all in jungle. I think that also contributed to my slow jungle speed. However, I hear he is very good there, so I want the experience.

    On red: I was thinking of stealing Malphite's red, but he really took a lot of time to get there and I got really nervous. Hence why I ended up wasting a lot of time.

    I always, for some reason, forget to buy HoG/Philo Stone on more "aggressive" junglers. I always think "Wriggles/Phage LOL!" and then realize my mistake once I've bought the other items. D'oh!

    But yeah, all I can say to defend myself is that I picked him in a rush, and he's not a jungler I am experienced with, so I only picked items I thought would be good (and I say "thought" very loosely here). I have experience as a jungler overall, but I am not experienced as Darius.

    However, the tunnel-vision, map presence and teamwork comments are greatly appreciated. I realize my mistakes now that you mention them. I didn't mull over them at the time since I was really, really annoyed at the Nidalee in our game. She was complaining a LOT.

    So yeah, thanks to both of you. I really appreciate your comments. And I think it's great that you guys are doing this. You have my respect.
    /salute
    Last edited by Grading; 2012-11-27 at 10:25 AM.

  2. #22
    Uh, I like this thread. I probably won't post any the next 24 hours, but I'm planning to do so. I'm lvl 28(.5) and I'm working on my preperation to go ranked. Yes I do fully intend to just experience it right when I get to 30, because so far most streams or observation games don't really show a distinct difference in skill level compared to what I do. Besides, you only learn to play better by playing against better opponents.

    This is my page, or see my sig:
    http://www.lolking.net/summoner/na/35172588#profile

    Things I know about myself;
    - Need more last hits. Need to know what the health treshold is for an autoattack.
    - Need more jungling practice.
    - Need to learn more about good team-comps and hard counters.
    - Need to make better choices as a support when it comes to warding. My Lulu game is all about the wards, while my Leona games focusses more on frontal assault and "neglects" warding far too much.

    About me:
    I'm a play-safe kind of guy. I prefer to pull back, instead of tower dive, unless I see an opportunity that's almost a 100% certainty. And even then, I occasionally completely flunk. Most of my win games end with my deaths paling compared to my kill or assist ratios. As a (Lulu)support, my endgame is actually all about wards. I buy them first before buying anything else. I grab the 5 speed boots and escape death countless of times. I poke, protect my carry, use my R defensively if it keeps them alive. I'm in love with Lulu.

    I play Jayce with that same mindset. Poke, Q + E caster minions, switch and melee the melee minions. Only go in when you know you can get the kill. Top lane seems to snowballs a lot, so not dying is an advantage for me. Eventually I deal so much damage with (ranged)W combos that any jungler gank automatically succeeds.

    I hate Teemo. On all counts.

    And I have a Yellow Ribbon /bwahahahaha ../shrug :P

    Champs I tend to play okish;
    - Lulu
    - Jayce
    - Leona
    - Diana (fairly new, mid or jungle)
    - Amumu (don't own)
    - Nunu
    - Annie

    Other champs are more of an occasional thing.
    Last edited by Vespian; 2012-11-27 at 10:31 AM.

  3. #23
    A really good idea, tnx for the effort, I'm trying to download and see how this work.

  4. #24
    @Vespian.

    I would advise against jumping straight into ranked. You have something called a "Hidden" normal elo - Basically it decides the standard of player you play against in normal games (although this fizzes out the longer the queue, as it tries to put you in a game).
    The reason I say this is because your runes are very mismatched. You need a solid 3 runepages for ranked (you can get away with less if you specialize a role and get that every time, but its rare).

    Standard AP Page:
    9x Magic Pen reds
    9x AP per level / Flat Armor / Mana Regen (or per level) yellows
    9x AP per level / MR per level / Flat MR blues
    AP Quints (Although you can use Movespeed as well)

    Standard AD Page: (This can work on a select few tops/junglers)
    9x Flat AD / Armor Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat AD / Flat Armor Pen reds

    The last page, I'd argue should be something centred around support, as you will support in Soloqueue. Support runes are more diverse, depending on your playstyle / masteries. I use either:
    (Taric):
    9x Flat Armor Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Movement Speed quints

    (Sona):
    9x Magic Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor Yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat Armor Quints

    Check out my profile @StylesClashv3

    I use a lot of these different rune-pages for different match ups / jungling / counter jungling.

    For example, I have a Mpen/Armor page. This doubles as my Malphite page (Top), and my Mundo page (When I'm playing against a jungler who doesn't start red)

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    @Vespian.

    I would advise against jumping straight into ranked. You have something called a "Hidden" normal elo - Basically it decides the standard of player you play against in normal games (although this fizzes out the longer the queue, as it tries to put you in a game).
    The reason I say this is because your runes are very mismatched. You need a solid 3 runepages for ranked (you can get away with less if you specialize a role and get that every time, but its rare).

    Standard AP Page:
    9x Magic Pen reds
    9x AP per level / Flat Armor / Mana Regen (or per level) yellows
    9x AP per level / MR per level / Flat MR blues
    AP Quints (Although you can use Movespeed as well)

    Standard AD Page: (This can work on a select few tops/junglers)
    9x Flat AD / Armor Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat AD / Flat Armor Pen reds

    The last page, I'd argue should be something centred around support, as you will support in Soloqueue. Support runes are more diverse, depending on your playstyle / masteries. I use either:
    (Taric):
    9x Flat Armor Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Movement Speed quints

    (Sona):
    9x Magic Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor Yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat Armor Quints

    Check out my profile @StylesClashv3

    I use a lot of these different rune-pages for different match ups / jungling / counter jungling.

    For example, I have a Mpen/Armor page. This doubles as my Malphite page (Top), and my Mundo page (When I'm playing against a jungler who doesn't start red)
    Wait...I've been playing support with gold runes....was I completely wrong?
    Cause I really like this setup,i just change the masteries depending on the champion.
    Can u give some feedback on my rune pages?
    http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/27936570#runes

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by bennyrosso View Post
    Wait...I've been playing support with gold runes....was I completely wrong?
    Cause I really like this setup,i just change the masteries depending on the champion.
    Can u give some feedback on my rune pages?
    http://www.lolking.net/summoner/euw/27936570#runes
    As I said, the support masteries allow for greater variance. The reason I play with mine is because I duo queue with an AD. We play very aggressive, usually picking up a kill at level ~2, but if not, definately 6.

    I have a mastery page set up for Taric, for example, which is a 1/15/14 - It allows me the tankiness from the start of the Defence tree, and the gold per 5 from the Utility tree. You can see it here: Taric Masteries Page 6

    My AD also doesn't mind if I take a CS here or there for gold.

    Another thing I will say is, when playing as Taric, I usually go for Heart of Gold first (Although that's set to change s3 - RIP sweet prince) So it means a Boots, ward, +2 HP pots start.

  7. #27
    U start with 1 ward? only?
    When u put it?
    Don't u have to go shop too early?

  8. #28
    Legendary! Falco Lombardi's Avatar
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    Think I'll play a Shaco game and lets decipher what I might have done wrong.

    To make it fair, it will the be the first game I play with him today, so it won't be like I waited for a perfect game.
    Last edited by Falco Lombardi; 2012-11-27 at 01:37 PM.
    I'll take the sky any day.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by bennyrosso View Post
    U start with 1 ward? only?
    When u put it?
    Don't u have to go shop too early?
    Yup, 1 ward. Depending on which side we're on it depends when I put it. It also depends on the jungler at hand. If I know they have a weak <6, i'll put it down at like 3~ mins.

    For example, say we're blue, I only have 1 ward spot if my mid lane / jungler has the sense to ward our wraith camps. At that point, I'll put the ward at Dragon pit, so I can see their blue ramp, and anyone roaming down river.

    If I'm purple, it's a little trickier. If they start blue, I know they won't be reaching bottom until 3:10-3:30 depending on who it is. So I'll try to ward as they're coming, but put it at the bottom of dragon pit, so I can see ganks from River, and also catch them if they come through the tri-bush. (Won't see into the tribush, so you're trusting on reactions)

    I do have to go back early if we want to play aggressive, but it just gives my AD the faster level 6 for the flash + stun + Shatter with his combo (He's played Graves every game so far, so ya, he has high burst)

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Axethor View Post
    -SNIP-
    Thanks a lot for the advice!

    I know my last hitting is pretty poor, I have difficulty judging the one hit threshold for a lot of champs, especially AP mids, and end up either losing the creep to my wave or AAing a couple of times.

    Standing at the fountain for so long is because my PC is a PoS and lags me out for the first 15/20 seconds of a game and I don't really like risking shopping and possibly buying the wrong thing because it hasn't updated. :P

    Yeah my Q placement is very, um, wonky to say the least. After a while I got used to using it with the closest edge of the tip just behind the champ I'm aiming for which gave me a much bigger target area to possibly hit with the debuff for my free ult.

    Yeah, blind pick, I'd called mid and locked in Diana after a few seconds with nobody saying anything then people started raging and telling me to go jungle which I was having none of, so people picked crazy champs.

    I've had that problem a lot, I go for whoever is low health/closest to me and although I'll usually get a kill, it doesn't leave me open to go for anyone else since my abilities are on cooldown 'cause I've had to spam them to take a tank down.

    ne porvivajo nur mortigi tempo

  11. #31
    Legendary! Falco Lombardi's Avatar
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    https://www.dropbox.com/s/9htzn6rcrv...0-%20Shaco.lrf

    Shaco game. I'd say it was an average game, I made sure Jax was living in a nightmare.

    Tizzlefix @ EUNE
    Shaco Jungle
    29:57
    Love to hear some issues.
    Last edited by Falco Lombardi; 2012-11-27 at 02:43 PM.
    I'll take the sky any day.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    @Vespian.

    I would advise against jumping straight into ranked. You have something called a "Hidden" normal elo - Basically it decides the standard of player you play against in normal games (although this fizzes out the longer the queue, as it tries to put you in a game).
    The reason I say this is because your runes are very mismatched. You need a solid 3 runepages for ranked (you can get away with less if you specialize a role and get that every time, but its rare).

    Standard AP Page:
    9x Magic Pen reds
    9x AP per level / Flat Armor / Mana Regen (or per level) yellows
    9x AP per level / MR per level / Flat MR blues
    AP Quints (Although you can use Movespeed as well)

    Standard AD Page: (This can work on a select few tops/junglers)
    9x Flat AD / Armor Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat AD / Flat Armor Pen reds

    The last page, I'd argue should be something centred around support, as you will support in Soloqueue. Support runes are more diverse, depending on your playstyle / masteries. I use either:
    (Taric):
    9x Flat Armor Reds
    9x Flat Armor yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Movement Speed quints

    (Sona):
    9x Magic Pen Reds
    9x Flat Armor Yellows
    9x MR per level blues
    3x Flat Armor Quints

    Check out my profile @StylesClashv3

    I use a lot of these different rune-pages for different match ups / jungling / counter jungling.

    For example, I have a Mpen/Armor page. This doubles as my Malphite page (Top), and my Mundo page (When I'm playing against a jungler who doesn't start red)
    Wow, such an indepth response. I'm very grateful for it. I am. I would like to note that my rune pages are not mismatched, or rather, they are purposely jumbled. This is due to changing between champions a great deal and rarely having enough IP to supplement all changes. In other words, I'm taking the middle of most of my champion choices and build around them, untill I am able to get more pages and have enough IP to go Tier3 on all runes.

    I won't enter ranked without a dedicated, committed runepage. Although, depending on the changes in S3, a mix of AD/ARP could work, assuming that the Flat over Percentage reduction makes it through.

    For example; I've played Annie -> Orianna -> Kat -> Diana mid/jungle. So I kept swapping between certain choices. At some point I didn't have enough IP fast enough to keep up with the changes and just decided to slowly expand with what I had going and would replace all runes once my primary choices were clear.

    So yes, they are mismatched, but I'm very much aware of it. It's not in place to be final, it's in place by lack of proper replacements. Currently, that is. Once more, thank you very much and I will definitely apply what you told me, for the greater part.

  13. #33
    This is a great thread. Props to Styles and Axe for their contributions.

    "There are two types of guys in this world. Guys who sniff their fingers after scratching their balls, and dirty fucking liars." -StylesClashv3
    "Elo Hell is where the Ego is greater than the Elo." -Bystekhilcar

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Duronos View Post
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/9htzn6rcrv...0-%20Shaco.lrf

    Shaco game. I'd say it was an average game, I made sure Jax was living in a nightmare.

    Tizzlefix @ EUNE
    Shaco Jungle
    29:57
    Love to hear some issues.
    How old is the replay? I'm having troubles with it not adhering to the spectator mode.

    So far, I'd say you had the junglers wet dream. Nasus top with no ghost, and a Mordekaiser middle. They both lack any sort of escape outside of summoners, but you didn't take advantage of it. Don't be scared against lanes like this, to live in the river going between the two.

    Also, something I picked up from watching a guy called "Perfects" - Who mains Shaco at 2.3k rating on EU-W - cut off their escape when you gank. Box where they have to run first off (even if you deceive to do it) and then fight them. He also starts red (smiteless) then get's blue for the fast level 3 then gank / counter-jungle.

    Perfects Stream - Watch some of his videos. I'll be honest, I haven't played Shaco in about a year, but am tempted to start up again after doing so.

    A tip for you though; after getting a kill, and you're level 6+ with Wriggles, you can solo Dragon with your Clone. Auto attack it with the clone, then stand behind it. The other way I've seen is to have you attack it first, when you go to 40-50% hp. Deceive so that your Clone takes aggro, and keep attacking from behind.

    As a second item, I'd advise Brutalizers, as it gives very nice stats (Ad/ArP/CDR) and builds into a great item (Ghostblade). From there go Wits End and then what you need.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    Yup, 1 ward. Depending on which side we're on it depends when I put it. It also depends on the jungler at hand. If I know they have a weak <6, i'll put it down at like 3~ mins.

    For example, say we're blue, I only have 1 ward spot if my mid lane / jungler has the sense to ward our wraith camps. At that point, I'll put the ward at Dragon pit, so I can see their blue ramp, and anyone roaming down river.

    If I'm purple, it's a little trickier. If they start blue, I know they won't be reaching bottom until 3:10-3:30 depending on who it is. So I'll try to ward as they're coming, but put it at the bottom of dragon pit, so I can see ganks from River, and also catch them if they come through the tri-bush. (Won't see into the tribush, so you're trusting on reactions)

    I do have to go back early if we want to play aggressive, but it just gives my AD the faster level 6 for the flash + stun + Shatter with his combo (He's played Graves every game so far, so ya, he has high burst)
    Mmmm I see.
    I guess this can't fit my game experience as I solo queue, and even if we suppose I support every game I can't coordinate that kind of aggressivity, I have to be ready for every situation, often to let the AD feel safe I double ward with one in the lane brush so he can poke the enemies in case they stay in there too long.
    I'm not so expert to know every jungler route and timing so usually I take 2 green and 1 pink and I try to remove their first green with my pink.
    If my AD push too much after the 3 minutes then I was with a green really high, probably same place as u at the entrance of enemy blu (top).
    Btw I was used to play taric a lot but now I prefer Leona, I know she doesn't heal but...so many cc and gap closer and aoe stun ultimate, cc is never too much in my opinion.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Vespian View Post
    Wow, such an indepth response. I'm very grateful for it. I am. I would like to note that my rune pages are not mismatched, or rather, they are purposely jumbled. This is due to changing between champions a great deal and rarely having enough IP to supplement all changes. In other words, I'm taking the middle of most of my champion choices and build around them, untill I am able to get more pages and have enough IP to go Tier3 on all runes.

    I won't enter ranked without a dedicated, committed runepage. Although, depending on the changes in S3, a mix of AD/ARP could work, assuming that the Flat over Percentage reduction makes it through.

    For example; I've played Annie -> Orianna -> Kat -> Diana mid/jungle. So I kept swapping between certain choices. At some point I didn't have enough IP fast enough to keep up with the changes and just decided to slowly expand with what I had going and would replace all runes once my primary choices were clear.

    So yes, they are mismatched, but I'm very much aware of it. It's not in place to be final, it's in place by lack of proper replacements. Currently, that is. Once more, thank you very much and I will definitely apply what you told me, for the greater part.
    I understand, and should've asked first if you were doing that due to numerous champion playstyles. I should say that I've seen a lot of people who had mis-matched runepages and didn't understand how some were more optimal than others, so I jumped straight to the "negative" thought process - I apologize.

    Other than that, I'd say you're well on your way, although I do advise against playing ranked until you're ready. There's no secret number where you can go "ok, I've played xxx games, I am now ready"

    In terms of advice, get comfortable with 2-3 champions in 3-4 of the roles.

    Although, depending on the changes in S3, a mix of AD/ARP could work, assuming that the Flat over Percentage reduction makes it through.
    I have one of those already on my profile which I use for Jayce which is 6 Armor Pen reds, 3 AD reds, with 3 AD quints.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-27 at 05:08 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by bennyrosso View Post
    Mmmm I see.
    I guess this can't fit my game experience as I solo queue, and even if we suppose I support every game I can't coordinate that kind of aggressivity, I have to be ready for every situation, often to let the AD feel safe I double ward with one in the lane brush so he can poke the enemies in case they stay in there too long.
    I'm not so expert to know every jungler route and timing so usually I take 2 green and 1 pink and I try to remove their first green with my pink.
    If my AD push too much after the 3 minutes then I was with a green really high, probably same place as u at the entrance of enemy blu (top).
    Btw I was used to play taric a lot but now I prefer Leona, I know she doesn't heal but...so many cc and gap closer and aoe stun ultimate, cc is never too much in my opinion.
    Yeah, I should note that this was with a duo partner, and there was even a game yesterday where I went the Charm/2 green/1 pink/1 pot start. We were against Sivir/Taric (As he has a slightly higher elo than me I'm always last pick QQ) so the stun > boomerang combo was deadly. However, we hit 6 and outpoked them with 2 x Q and my powerchord, I also deviated that match and maxed my heal over harass, so that we could "brute force" them down, if that makes sense.

    In soloqueue, I'll always play passive until I've established what kind of AD I'm playing with, so 99% never boots start

  17. #37
    Legendary! Falco Lombardi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    How old is the replay? I'm having troubles with it not adhering to the spectator mode.

    So far, I'd say you had the junglers wet dream. Nasus top with no ghost, and a Mordekaiser middle. They both lack any sort of escape outside of summoners, but you didn't take advantage of it. Don't be scared against lanes like this, to live in the river going between the two.

    Also, something I picked up from watching a guy called "Perfects" - Who mains Shaco at 2.3k rating on EU-W - cut off their escape when you gank. Box where they have to run first off (even if you deceive to do it) and then fight them. He also starts red (smiteless) then get's blue for the fast level 3 then gank / counter-jungle.

    Perfects Stream - Watch some of his videos. I'll be honest, I haven't played Shaco in about a year, but am tempted to start up again after doing so.

    A tip for you though; after getting a kill, and you're level 6+ with Wriggles, you can solo Dragon with your Clone. Auto attack it with the clone, then stand behind it. The other way I've seen is to have you attack it first, when you go to 40-50% hp. Deceive so that your Clone takes aggro, and keep attacking from behind.

    As a second item, I'd advise Brutalizers, as it gives very nice stats (Ad/ArP/CDR) and builds into a great item (Ghostblade). From there go Wits End and then what you need.
    I know the dragon trick, I just never got too it. Morde was iffy, he played close to the tower and I was always wondering if Lux would follow up which most of the time she did. I've done the box trick on the escape a few times, kind of weird that I figured that out myself and never watched anyone else. That game was an average game for the most part, favorite part of it was at the beginning where I auto attack Jax and he follows me into the bush haha. The reason I didn't gank as much as I could have is because of the lanes being pushed a bit and I was loving the Jax.

    EDIT: You can do the dragon trick with the razor, you don't need wriggles.
    I'll take the sky any day.

  18. #38
    Also, forgot to add in response to Axethor:

    My wards are pretty poor yeah, but the weird blue ward was because my jungle Xin didn't really pay attention at all or check his buff after it was taken so I dropped the ward in and pinged just to show him it was back up. What he said in chat afterwards: "OMG DIANA I DIDN'T EVEN GET FIRST BUFF AND YOU WANT 2ND FFS NOOB"

    I don't think he realised I was doing him a favour.

    ne porvivajo nur mortigi tempo

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Duronos View Post
    I know the dragon trick, I just never got too it. Morde was iffy, he played close to the tower and I was always wondering if Lux would follow up which most of the time she did. I've done the box trick on the escape a few times, kind of weird that I figured that out myself and never watched anyone else. That game was an average game for the most part, favorite part of it was at the beginning where I auto attack Jax and he follows me into the bush haha. The reason I didn't gank as much as I could have is because of the lanes being pushed a bit and I was loving the Jax.

    EDIT: You can do the dragon trick with the razor, you don't need wriggles.
    Yeah, I understand the point of not trusting your team mates, I suffer the same in soloqueue. I can't really gather a lot from that game as you said, the lanes were pushed a lot, which is counter-productive to Shaco. Perhaps try to utilize lane ganks more often. Again, I'm not great with Shaco, just drawing off what I've seen from that guy.

  20. #40
    Legendary! Falco Lombardi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by StylesClashv3 View Post
    Yeah, I understand the point of not trusting your team mates, I suffer the same in soloqueue. I can't really gather a lot from that game as you said, the lanes were pushed a lot, which is counter-productive to Shaco. Perhaps try to utilize lane ganks more often. Again, I'm not great with Shaco, just drawing off what I've seen from that guy.
    Yeah, the bot lane seemed to be doing fine, so I didn't focus to much down there. At level 6 I probably could have turret dived with the ultimate a few times.
    I'll take the sky any day.

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