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  1. #201
    Guns should only be owned by people who:

    1. Pass a mental health check. No nut jobs.
    2. Pass a proper background check. (Does not have a crime/felony on them.)
    3. Has take a course regarding safety, usage, etc.
    4. Be over the age of 18.

    (This should apply regardless of whether your gun owning is because of hunting, work or just-for-home-defence.)
    Quote Originally Posted by Lochglen View Post
    I am wondering if Blizzard are going to give the Alliance the 5 mounts because the worgen have running wild, the horde have 5 new mounts , i just think they should balance it out, how say you all.
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    hows about you give half your money to africa because you have more than them, and it's not balanced
    no? didn't think so

  2. #202
    Immortal Luko's Avatar
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    I'm also from the US and am an avid gun owner. I have 9 firearms to my name, three of which I regularly take to the range and take my grouping quite seriously. I, of course, clean them as soon as I'm home before they make it back into the case. I load my own rounds for everything but the 12 gauge and have a small press/setup in the garage.

    I refuse to dive into the debate about gun safety, however. Its sort of like getting a piss test for work. I know millions of people around the world have screwed up bad enough to make this mandatory, but to me it's just another hiccup we have to go through. Just like gun safety / laws. I've always had an extreme care and respect for firearms, ever since I shot my first one at 5 years old. To me, it was never a question of safety but more one of common sense. But as many have said, that's not always the case.

    Just about anything in the hands of a careless/stupid person can be considered dangerous.
    Mountains rise in the distance stalwart as the stars, fading forever.
    Roads ever weaving, soul ever seeking the hunter's mark.

  3. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by PizzaSHARK View Post
    Tanks are completely irrelevant and in fact counter-productive against people on foot and especially in dense, urban areas. Tanks are designed to fight other tanks and attack convoys in wide, open areas across several miles, not blast buildings twenty feet away in the streets.

    And before you say a bunch of amateurs with guns and improvised explosives can't do jack... well, what the fuck do you think we've been fighting against for damned near the entire past decade? Sure, they aren't winning... but they ain't lost, either.
    No, they are not. What many armored vehicles are though, is clunky and some times bad at urban warfare.
    They are good for holding an area or pushing a front. Infantry needs armored vehicles and the armored vehicles need the infantry.

    Gerilla warfare is effective only when the force you are fighting is unwilling to kill civilians. It's become an effective way of fighting because the rules of war can be exploited to your advantage.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-28 at 05:56 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryngo Blackratchet View Post
    I'm also from the US and am an avid gun owner. I have 9 firearms to my name, three of which I regularly take to the range and take my grouping quite seriously. I, of course, clean them as soon as I'm home before they make it back into the case. I load my own rounds for everything but the 12 gauge and have a small press/setup in the garage.

    I refuse to dive into the debate about gun safety, however. Its sort of like getting a piss test for work. I know millions of people around the world have screwed up bad enough to make this mandatory, but to me it's just another hiccup we have to go through. Just like gun safety / laws. I've always had an extreme care and respect for firearms, ever since I shot my first one at 5 years old. To me, it was never a question of safety but more one of common sense. But as many have said, that's not always the case.

    Just about anything in the hands of a careless/stupid person can be considered dangerous.
    If there's anything I've ever learned about people, it's that you cannot count on them to be responsible and have sense. If they were, we wouldn't need laws at all.

    Yes but the difference is that a gun has no other purpose that to kill. That anything COULD be used to kill with, doesn't make a gun look any better.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-28 at 05:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Lily Crowley View Post
    Guns should only be owned by people who:

    1. Pass a mental health check. No nut jobs.
    2. Pass a proper background check. (Does not have a crime/felony on them.)
    3. Has take a course regarding safety, usage, etc.
    4. Be over the age of 18.

    (This should apply regardless of whether your gun owning is because of hunting, work or just-for-home-defence.)
    Isn't all of that, stuff that they check and that you have to go through to own one as it is?

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarashan View Post
    What makes you think that the military (or more likely a sizable portion thereof) would not refuse to fire on the populace? Or not join said rebellion? Depends on the reasons for the rebellion.
    The same reason they kill innocent civilians in any other part of the world... they're told they're the enemy, and are trained to put morality aside while on active combat missions.

    I hate to break this to you, but the American Military trains the soldiers to simply obey orders and are taught to separate personal morality from on-duty activities - the reason being that thinking morally causes delayed reactions in mission-critical moments, and a split-second moral conflict causing you to pause could mean the difference between not only your own life or death, but the life/death of your fellow soldiers as well - not to mention the success/failure of a mission.

    ...and before anybody starts white-knighting me saying "I/My soldier friend/relative have morales!", please read that I'm talking about ACTIVE on-duty situations. They're taught to set morality aside for THOSE situations only... not their lives as a whole. :P
    Last edited by mvaliz; 2012-11-28 at 05:00 PM.

  5. #205
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    Quote Originally Posted by Creamy Flames View Post
    \

    Yes but the difference is that a gun has no other purpose that to kill. That anything COULD be used to kill with, doesn't make a gun look any better.
    What difference does that make? A round from my rifle hasn't hit anything but my targets in over a decade. Seems pretty safe to me. As you pointed out, people are unpredictable and cannot be counted on. Why would I waste my time wondering what they're doing with their firearms? I know mine are safe when I have them and safely locked up when I don't. Even if the laws were tightened and became more strict, the same criminals who illegally own and use guns now would still be owning the same guns and using them to hurt people. Criminals are pretty well known for associating with crime, last I checked.
    Mountains rise in the distance stalwart as the stars, fading forever.
    Roads ever weaving, soul ever seeking the hunter's mark.

  6. #206
    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    . Because of those stories, I do wholeheartedly believe that gun owners in America have gotten a pretty bad rap across the board.
    It's not because of those stories, it's because the fact that you keep killing each other with them. For the rest of the world it shines out as a perfect example of why we shouldn't let everyone have a gun, because it leads to people killing other people, something we would like to avoid. And it has nothing to do with the morons doing stupid and tragic things. They remind us of the stupidity of man, but it is fact that reminds us why giving guns to everyone and anyone doesn't work. Because if it actually worked and made it a safer place, then it wouldn't be over 14 times as probable for me to get shot in the US as it is in my home country, or over 4 times as likley as it is in Sweden where I live, and we are having a massive gun problem, yet it isn't even on the same scale as the US one.

  7. #207
    the wild west was 250 years ago, the only "need " people have today for guns is so that corporations to continue profit from this billion dollar industry , everyone owning guns will always do more harm than having none .

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Creamy Flames View Post
    Guns have one purpose: To kill.
    I hold no illusions about guns.

    But you're right, discussion is always the way to go to create insight, understanding and perhaps help change something.
    I do feel that the argument that guns are for self-defence is a weak one, seeing as how guns are used for crime 99.99% of the time. I have yet to see a single news report about a valid self-defence situation in which a gun owner protects his home/family or others that are in danger. Infact I've seen news reports that show how BAD people are at the latter, and how it's much more of an added risk to have every day Joe's have a gun, because in most cases they have insufficient training and will panic in a dangerous situation.
    My family's guns have been used 100% for hunting and practice.

    The presence of a gun is a deterrent to crime. It's hard to accumulate statistics on that, because people don't report "Well, I decided to steal from that guy instead of the hunter across the street." I have however, seen many stories about guns used in self defense. I did a quick google search and found a website from a guy who collects these stories (hasnt been updated in a year). http://www.thearmedcitizen.com/

    I understand your discomfort with guns, but it's not fair to skew the truth to fit your argument.

  9. #209
    Quote Originally Posted by Auloria View Post
    My family's guns have been used 100% for hunting and practice.

    The presence of a gun is a deterrent to crime.
    Then how come the gun-crime in the US is incredibly unproportionaly huge? 14 times more per 100.000 habitants than Scotland for example?

    Also when you hunt, you kill things.

  10. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keske View Post
    Then how come the gun-crime in the US is incredibly unproportionaly huge? 14 times more per 100.000 habitants than Scotland for example?
    Because criminals commit crimes. How do you suggest they fix that?
    Mountains rise in the distance stalwart as the stars, fading forever.
    Roads ever weaving, soul ever seeking the hunter's mark.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryngo Blackratchet View Post
    Because criminals commit crimes. How do you suggest they fix that?
    Well I would suggest not handing out weapons to everyone, since well... facts says, that makes you kill each other. We are not free from criminals over here yet we manage to not kill each others. Or are you saying that your average American would just be 14 times as murderous than your Average Brittish bloke?

  12. #212
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    You do not need handguns for any reason.
    You only need a rifle/shotgun for hunting.
    You do not need them for home protection.
    Get a security system. Can't afford one? Get a sticker/sign that says you do. Works just as good.

  13. #213
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Istaril View Post
    I don't really have qualms with American's having guns. I think it's pretty fucking stupid, but at this point everyone has them, so trying to take them back would be completely pointless. I wouldn't support any introduction of guns into Scotland however, we've got enough knife crime without gun crime adding up.
    This is pretty much how I see it, the idea of everyone having guns is stupid, but its too late to stop it now, its at the point where taking them away will only cause more problems.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Keske View Post
    Then how come the gun-crime in the US is incredibly unproportionaly huge? 14 times more per 100.000 habitants than Scotland for example?

    Also when you hunt, you kill things.
    The existence of guns opens the door for gun crime. I do not argue against that. I think gun laws in urban areas should be much stricter, where they are more likely to be used illegitimately, than in rural areas (except accidental deaths, which are equally common, sadly). Crime rates are extremely low in rural areas (per capita), even though gun usage is very high. A national gun ban doesn't make sense for rural areas, so it's unfair that these areas are punished for what is primarily an urban problem. 20% of the US population lives in rural areas.

    Here's an interesting paper on the differences between urban and rural crime: https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles/rcrp.pdf
    From the article:
    It is sometimes assumed that the availability of guns is relevant to gun-related violence, but the case of rural areas shows that the relationship is far more complex. While rural residents are more likely to own guns, it appears they are less likely to use guns in the commission of crimes. It has also been found that crime was lowest in counties with the highest rates of legal firearm ownership. Similarly, a 1990 report by the Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) found that the rate of crimes committed with handguns was more than three times as great in urban areas—5.9 per 100,000 in central cities versus 1.7 per 100,000 in nonmetropolitan areas.
    The point of hunting is to kill things. I don't know anyone who hunts and doesn't intend to eat their kill. Growing up, the great majority of my meals came from what my dad hunted. When I visit my parents for Christmas, I'm going to have deer pizza, deer pasta, deer sausage, deer burgers... >.>

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Phookah View Post
    You do not need handguns for any reason.
    You only need a rifle/shotgun for hunting.
    You do not need them for home protection.
    Get a security system. Can't afford one? Get a sticker/sign that says you do. Works just as good.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7pGt_O1uM8

  16. #216
    Quote Originally Posted by Phookah View Post
    You do not need handguns for any reason.
    You only need a rifle/shotgun for hunting.
    You do not need them for home protection.
    Get a security system. Can't afford one? Get a sticker/sign that says you do. Works just as good.
    Where do you live? I think I'd like to break into your house and steal your things. How's that sticker helping you now?

  17. #217
    its kinda funny.. the only reason i bought a gun is because i lived in Reading, PA and was robbed twice and once at gun point.. so yeah, heres a question you all should be asking.. why does Chicago, IL which has some of the strictest gun laws in the nation have more violent crime then any city in Texas which has very lax gun laws? heres a hint.. gun laws do not prevent bad guys from getting guns, hell walk a few blocks in brooklyn and you can get a glock 9 for 400 bucks with ss number scratched off..

  18. #218
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    Quote Originally Posted by sorix View Post
    its kinda funny.. the only reason i bought a gun is because i lived in Reading, PA and was robbed twice and once at gun point.. so yeah, heres a question you all should be asking.. why does Chicago, IL which has some of the strictest gun laws in the nation have more violent crime then any city in Texas which has very lax gun laws? heres a hint.. gun laws do not prevent bad guys from getting guns, hell walk a few blocks in brooklyn and you can get a glock 9 for 400 bucks with ss number scratched off..
    A firearm which was stolen from a legit owner that did not secure it properly. Having gun control does not mean banning them, it means owning them responsibly.

  19. #219
    It's a really sad time in the world when freedoms for the sake of freedom are under debate.
    Make sure they're secure, absolutely, but don't make them illegal for honest citizens.

  20. #220
    What's your stance on trigger locks or whatever they're called? Being that you don't have kids you said they aren't in a safe. If you HAD a kid, would you change that?

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