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  1. #61
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    you are wrong sir im former Military and my wife is a Police officer and on the swat team. Holmes used a S&W MP15 which is a variant of the AR 15 the MP in the name stands for Military and Police and it is an ASSAULT RIFLE even though it is not fully automatic you can shoot it as fast as you can pull the trigger and i can empty a semi auto assault rifle about as fast as a fully automatic one. That gun also hold 30 round magazines and up to 100 rounds from a drum magazine. Assault rifles are mainly used in the Military and Police and they are used to kill people hence why they are called Assault rifles
    Sorry, I refuse to believe what you say over what pretty much every internet definition says, an assault rifle is needs to be able to fire more than one round per trigger pull.

    I am willing to bet you were not Infantry during your time in the military, they go crazy if you get stuff like this wrong.

    The bolded bit is also a flat out lie.
    Last edited by RICH816; 2012-11-27 at 09:20 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    you are wrong sir im former Military and my wife is a Police officer and on the swat team. Holmes used a S&W MP15 which is a variant of the AR 15 the MP in the name stands for Military and Police and it is an ASSAULT RIFLE even though it is not fully automatic you can shoot it as fast as you can pull the trigger and i can empty a semi auto assault rifle about as fast as a fully automatic one. That gun also hold 30 round magazines and up to 100 rounds from a drum magazine. Assault rifles are mainly used in the Military and Police and they are used to kill people hence why they are called Assault rifles
    im in no way trying to start a pissing match but i will fully disagree with your opinion that you can pull a trigger and fire a semi automatic rifle as fast as someone can unload a clip in a fully automatic one.

    also the ar that holmes used was not a select fire rifle, which is one of the criteria required for it to be considered an assault weapon.
    Last edited by dokilar; 2012-11-27 at 09:20 PM.

  3. #63
    Pandaren Monk Auloria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quick Ben View Post
    You seem to be a bit defensive and I am a little confused why. I am not making a statement one way or the other, just pointing out the obvious. We are not having a discussion on the benefits of arming everyone. We are not engaging in a discussion of why its a good idea to engage in a gun fights. We are starting from a point of view that guns are a part of american culture and that culture has its roots from an age long gone. Everything else is just rationalization and rhetoric. Also, it seems necessary to point out how America differs starkly from pretty much all other civilized nations in this regards. There is a difference, and one way must be better than the other. You decide what indicators you want to use.

    Also, to the cop posting in this thread:
    I am not sure how you feel about it, but ever thought about going to work in a situation when EVERYONE is armed?
    Maybe you are reading too much into it. He doesn't strike me as defensive at all, I thought it was a thoughtful response to your post. I think you are looking for a fight that isn't there.

    I also thought his approach to the thread topic was fine. He wanted to open a discussion with everyone about what he (and many gun owners) believes and why, while you seem to take issue with him for lack of information on gun control.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-27 at 09:22 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Anevers View Post
    I'll leave this here as food for thought. It is kinda sad and sickening.

    http://www.duluthnewstribune.com/eve...cle/id/250877/
    And exactly the point of this thread is to show that most gun owners have a lot of respect for the power of their weapons and also for human life. This man clearly did not have the long talks with his father that I did about weapon safety, nor the strict discipline that I got when I failed to respect it.

  4. #64
    Scarab Lord Lenonis's Avatar
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    I didn't read the whole thread but I think the problem is that people like to put everyone into a single bucket. Not all gun owners are crazy. Not all gun owners are responsible. Not all gun owners are sane. Not all gun owners are going to kill people.

    Even in my own social circle there is an amazing difference.

    Exhibit A: Friend is an avid hunter. Owns more guns than anyone else I know...probably combined. Also has a sidearm for personal protection. He keeps his guns and ammunition is a gun safe. Would never ever pull his weapon except in defense of his life or family. Would attempt to dissuade and wound rather than kill if threatened and had the ability to choose. Very responsible gun owner who is aware of the ramifications of taking another life and doesn't want that on his conscience.

    Exhibit B: Friend noted that someone had their Romney/Ryan sign stolen off their lawn. She said she would shoot that person. When pressed and questioned about it she felt fully justified to shoot anyone who came onto her property uninvited or who stole anything of hers, even if it was low value, and even if it did not represent a threat to her. She did not think that there was any problem taking another person's life over a $2 sign.

    These are two different people's attitudes towards guns. One is clearly a responsible, mature gun owner. The other...well...I'll leave it up to interpretation, but suffice it to say that is part of the bad rap some gun owners get.

  5. #65
    Mechagnome draganid's Avatar
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    ive always been a fan of having 2 giant dogs that bark at everything that walks past our house instead of a gun. all of my neighbors houses probably seem much easier to break into. i also have the added benefit of knowing when the mail comes because they do the weirdest bark at him and only him.

  6. #66
    Titan Kalyyn's Avatar
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    I personally possess an AR-15 that my father gave me, and a Taurus 9mm that my grandfather left me. I keep both in a locked safe, and I keep the ammunition in a couple of metal ammunition boxes left over from the Gulf War.

    My firearms are only for the purpose of defending against America's enemies. For home defense, I prefer one of my various knives. I also have a bardiche. That's mostly for show, but if shit gets really serious, I do know how to fight with it.

  7. #67
    Pit Lord HBpapa's Avatar
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    I'm a gun owner and have been for almost two decades now and ex-military before that and I think most of the gun ownership laws and restrictions are completely retarded.

    Handguns- They are poor for home defense compared to a shotgun and actually do not have a shorter body-to-barrel like many believe (handgun extended out form the body has a similar distance as a home defense shotgun held at the shoulder). Handguns are a quick deployable and easily concealed weapon which is great for police but it also makes it the weapon of choice in most criminal activities.

    If just handguns were removed then firearms wouldn't even be the most common weapon for murders in the US...that would belong to knives. That's right, shotguns and rifles are used less in murders than knives are. But as it stands right now they are all a distant second to the handgun. Seems pretty clear to me where the problem lies.


    Assault Rifles- They serve no practical use and depending on the state and the caliber you can't even hunt with them. They are designed with no other intention other than to kill another human being and any other devise with the same design is illegal for civilians to own.

    I wont back any pro-gun organization till these issues are addressed.
    Last edited by HBpapa; 2012-11-27 at 09:38 PM.
    Atheist, pro-gun, pro-Constitution, anti-racism, pro-equal rights for e...v...e...r...y...o...n...e

  8. #68
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I personally possess an AR-15 that my father gave me, and a Taurus 9mm that my grandfather left me. I keep both in a locked safe, and I keep the ammunition in a couple of metal ammunition boxes left over from the Gulf War.

    My firearms are only for the purpose of defending against America's enemies. For home defense, I prefer one of my various knives. I also have a bardiche. That's mostly for show, but if shit gets really serious, I do know how to fight with it.
    Arent you airforce? Why would you need a rifle to fight americas enemies? You are issued one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by dokilar View Post
    im in no way trying to start a pissing match but i will fully disagree with your opinion that you can pull a trigger and fire a semi automatic rifle as fast as someone can unload a clip in a fully automatic one.

    also the ar that holmes used was not a select fire rifle, which is one of the criteria required for it to be considered an assault weapon.
    semi auto gun here not full auto being bump fired which u use the recoil to fire the weapon faster than a full auto gun. Yes you guys are Technically right as technically it is not True Assault rifle because it isnt fully auto but i can be made fully auto very easily and you can shoot it as fast as fully auto with trigger mods and technique. So an Assault rifle is fully auto and the same exact gun but semi auto isnt is like saying a Porsche with a manual tranny isnt a Porsche if it has a automatic tranny guess what its still a Porsche and by definition it isnt an assault rifle but it still basically is its made to kill people

  10. #70
    Titan Kalyyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HBpapa View Post
    Assault Rifles- They serve no practical use and depending on the state and the caliber you can't even hunt with them. They are designed with no other intention other than to kill another human being and any other devise with the same design is illegal for civilians to own.

    I wont back any pro-gun organization till these issues are addressed.
    I'll solve this issue for you right now.

    No crime is ever committed with a rifle. Go ahead, try to find some. You'll find maybe 1 in the last 10 years. Crimes are exclusively committed with handguns. Now, handguns are worthless against armored targets. Rifles, however, are needed for defense against an invasion or to stage a rebellion. Therefore, people with rifles are no threat to the public, but a great asset to the nation.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I personally possess an AR-15 that my father gave me, and a Taurus 9mm that my grandfather left me. I keep both in a locked safe, and I keep the ammunition in a couple of metal ammunition boxes left over from the Gulf War.

    My firearms are only for the purpose of defending against America's enemies. For home defense, I prefer one of my various knives. I also have a bardiche. That's mostly for show, but if shit gets really serious, I do know how to fight with it.
    /brofist
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  12. #72
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I'll solve this issue for you right now.

    No crime is ever committed with a rifle. Go ahead, try to find some. You'll find maybe 1 in the last 10 years. Crimes are exclusively committed with handguns. Now, handguns are worthless against armored targets. Rifles, however, are needed for defense against an invasion or to stage a rebellion. Therefore, people with rifles are no threat to the public, but a great asset to the nation.
    eh? James Holmes is the latest one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  13. #73
    Brewmaster Darkis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RICH1471 View Post
    eh? James Holmes is the latest one.
    I think what was meant are "mainstream" crimes, like robberies, and so on.
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  14. #74
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkis View Post
    I think what was meant are "mainstream" crimes, like robberies, and so on.
    If that is the case, I agree with him. There is little reason for the average citizen to own a handgun, Shotguns and Rifles can do most of what a handgun can do without the concealability criminals needs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

  15. #75
    seriously to most of the EU countries the republican part of the USA(that would include the majority of the gun owners,not stereotype just statistics) you're alien species.

    you say that everyone rages against gun owners for a few lunatics who went killing spree on public,if the guns weren't so easy to acquire they might have never gotten them

    you say it's your responsibility to protect your home? i say it's not a responsible attitude to keep lethal weponry at your house,accidents happen,misunderstanding too

    and who the fuck do you think you are John Rambo? you watch too many cop movies i'd say...if a gang of armed burglars invade your house there's absolutely nothing you can do, if a single armed burglar invades your house you're playing your life at a coin flip and for what? your money? your TV? your wife's jewlery? they're all replaceable,except the people in the house,let the police do it's job,trust me they;re much better on the shooting department than any of us.

    and most importantly: if you have the right to arm yourself so does everyone else,do you really trust everyone out there with a gun?

    i don't know anyone who has ever owned a gun(except a police officer friend of mine),nothing has ever happened to us,what are you afraid of? why are you so scared?

    ps:if someone does invade my house,well he can just have the 200E i have on my shelf and whatever else he can carry, i don't give a shit+i'm quite confident that he will get caught in a couple of weeks top.and if you think that someone will invade in a house with the sole purpose of killing/raping/torturing...well you watch too much tv...
    The constructive troll!

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by vassilisz View Post
    seriously to most of the EU countries the republican part of the USA(that would include the majority of the gun owners,not stereotype just statistics) you're alien species.

    you say that everyone rages against gun owners for a few lunatics who went killing spree on public,if the guns weren't so easy to acquire they might have never gotten them

    you say it's your responsibility to protect your home? i say it's not a responsible attitude to keep lethal weponry at your house,accidents happen,misunderstanding too

    and who the fuck do you think you are John Rambo? you watch too many cop movies i'd say...if a gang of armed burglars invade your house there's absolutely nothing you can do, if a single armed burglar invades your house you're playing your life at a coin flip and for what? your money? your TV? your wife's jewlery? they're all replaceable,except the people in the house,let the police do it's job,trust me they;re much better on the shooting department than any of us.

    and most importantly: if you have the right to arm yourself so does everyone else,do you really trust everyone out there with a gun?

    i don't know anyone who has ever owned a gun(except a police officer friend of mine),nothing has ever happened to us,what are you afraid of? why are you so scared?

    ps:if someone does invade my house,well he can just have the 200E i have on my shelf and whatever else he can carry, i don't give a shit+i'm quite confident that he will get caught in a couple of weeks top.and if you think that someone will invade in a house with the sole purpose of killing/raping/torturing...well you watch too much tv...
    those rose colored glasses you have are beautiful but you should really take them off and why hasnt anyone responded after i showed them you can fire a semi auto faster than full auto when they told me i was crazy and a flat out liar lol

  17. #77
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    And yet if you look at the number of legal gun owners, compare that to the number of gun crimes commuted by that populace, you'll find is extremely low. Also, as it will be clearly pointed out, Cars are involved in more deaths in the US each year over guns. In face, Tobacco is related to more deaths than fire arms. Yet, the perception, is that we have a huge problem. Of the deaths, a heavy % are due to suicide. If those are included, should Asia, the Middle East, and Europe get rid of trains? (gross comparison but you understand the point I hope)
    Its not extremely low, where the hell are you getting that from, its extremely high when you look at statistics, I shouldnt really need to explain the difference between cars and gun deaths, I mean its clear they have no relevance to each other when compared statistically.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    My firearms are only for the purpose of defending against America's enemies.
    This is what I dont understand about a lot of the posters on these forums, why do you think that terrorists are coming to shoot you in your houses, America has NEVER had a threat on their soil, you bring the threat to yourselves forcefully so its no surprise a few scumbag bombers get through the woodwork, but other than that no one is coming to get you, its just unnecessary paranoia you have.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by hakujinbakasama View Post
    I both agree and disagree with your point of view. I believe that the necessity for guns is bad. I do not believe a gun itself is anymore or less bad than a car. Although, statistics and the planet might side against the car.
    I can't argue with this, sadly the earth could use some more gun related deaths but only if this would reduce the world population by 2/3 :/

    (I am against genocide btw, before someone takes this to serious)
    ∞=0
    0/2 = 0 , ∞/2 = ∞
    2/0 = error , 2/∞ = error
    0*2 = 0 , ∞*2 = ∞

  19. #79
    Scarab Lord Collegeguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalyyn View Post
    I'll solve this issue for you right now.

    No crime is ever committed with a rifle. Go ahead, try to find some. You'll find maybe 1 in the last 10 years. Crimes are exclusively committed with handguns. Now, handguns are worthless against armored targets. Rifles, however, are needed for defense against an invasion or to stage a rebellion. Therefore, people with rifles are no threat to the public, but a great asset to the nation.
    Horrible music, but it's a rifle.

  20. #80
    The Unstoppable Force RICH816's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skandulous View Post
    those rose colored glasses you have are beautiful but you should really take them off and why hasnt anyone responded after i showed them you can fire a semi auto faster than full auto when they told me i was crazy and a flat out liar lol
    So illegally modifying a weapon makes it a legit assault rifle? James holes' rifle jammed, did you also know that? Sure was an awesome job he did.....
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobbes View Post
    I do sympathize with these so called terrorist organisations. As far as I'm concerned, at least they are fighting for something they believe in, and for what they see to be the greater good. They're not fighting to line the pockets of statesmen, governors and oil barons. I wish we could the same about the people on this side of the planet.
    Hobbes talking about Al Qaeda and ISIS.

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