1. #1

    [General] Why not gemming +320 Expertise ?

    Since stats weights are approximatively this (depending on your stuff) :

    3.78 Int
    2.95 SP
    2.36 Hit
    1.98 Crit
    1.36 Haste
    1.34 Mastery

    Why not gemming +320Expertise/Hit instead of 80Int +160Crit for example or 160Hit + 160Crit ??

    Just asking cauz i dont get it.

  2. #2
    If you really need the hit, then there's nothing wrong with gemming the expertise. If you're in full 463 gear then you might still find it hard to get hit capped, so go nuts. But do the math and make sure it's the best combination of gems and reforges to get to where you want to be. Maybe it's better to not gem expertise and reforge other stats to hit or expertise?

    Do the calculations to find the best route to get capped.

  3. #3
    Well you dont gem 320 Expertise or even 320 Hit because hit you need is FINITE, there is only so much hit that you can actually put to use at 2.36 stat weight.
    After 15% you get capped and the value drops to 0 and you reforge any surplus hit you can to Crit/Haste/Mastery so I usually give Hit about the same stat weight as haste for gemming purposes.

  4. #4
    The real reason for it is, because Hit has a hard cap, which is 15%.. And we got this thing called reforge. And as it happens gear has enough secondary ratings to get you fully capped(after around ilevel 475). So gemming hit in these cases would increase not hit, but the stat you would other wise reforge to hit, which for fire mages are mastery and haste. And thats why you should not gem hit.

  5. #5
    Ok, thanks for your answer, i was just wondering if Gemming Hit to be capped was better than reforging stuff to get hit (im currently at 480ilvl so i have no pb getting hit capped with reforge).

    Asking this also cauz i watched Blatty stream yesterday (Mage of team method) who said it was better to gem +160Hit +160Crit than +80Int +160Crit (cauz of stats weights).

    Same question for enchanting gloves for example +170Exp VS +170Haste.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by wupavz View Post
    Ok, thanks for your answer, i was just wondering if Gemming Hit to be capped was better than reforging stuff to get hit (im currently at 480ilvl so i have no pb getting hit capped with reforge).

    Asking this also cauz i watched Blatty stream yesterday (Mage of team method) who said it was better to gem +160Hit +160Crit than +80Int +160Crit (cauz of stats weights).

    Same question for enchanting gloves for example +170Exp VS +170Haste.
    Well after you are hit capped it comes a bit messy, cause you still might be able to gain crit by gemming exp, but as for 160 hit + 160 crit gems.. there just is no other option for blue slots if the slot bonus is good. as for the exp vs haste for gloves, it really depends on your gear, if you can gain crit by enchanting exp, go for it, but there is not much difference bethween the 2 enchants, allthough with 170 exp you can gain mastery, and its better than haste later on..

  7. #7
    The steadfast rule has always been don't gem for hit (except in blue slots) because while you can always reforge a weaker stat to hit, you can never reforge to intellect, which is generally the best stat.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by houndstooth View Post
    The steadfast rule has always been don't gem for hit (except in blue slots) because while you can always reforge a weaker stat to hit, you can never reforge to intellect, which is generally the best stat.
    Except for the fact that with gems, that is no longer true for Fire Mages.

    Simple rule, if you can get hit capped without sacrificing any Crit, gem Intellect. If you're losing out on a significant amount of Crit in order to reach hit cap, the Expertise gem could be viable.

    Gloves you definitely want to enchant Expertise.

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-29 at 10:58 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by mrgreenthump View Post
    with 170 exp you can gain mastery, and its better than haste later on..
    There has been nothing thus far to show that Mastery will pull ahead of Haste, and certainly not during T14, if ever.

  9. #9
    You gem for Hit/Crit in blue slots because both of the stats are more important than 0.5 normalized value of intellect.
    These two stats are the only two stats that actually ahve this value though, so once you go and get so much hit that you cannot reforge hit to Crit but instead find yourself reforging to haste/mastery .... Then you are in the woods....

    Overall the difference between a Hit/Crit and a Intellect/Crit change is going to be 10% extra from the GEM and the GEM alone. so you will gain approx the equivalent of 10 intellect on the gem, compared to roughly 15.000 intellect on your gear it will change a grand 0.1%.
    Gem the right stats in the right place and you shouldnt really notice much difference overall, keeping Invokers up 80% instead of 70%, LB 90+% instead of 75% are going to have far greater and much more long lasting effects than chaning a gem here or there.

    Proper gems:
    320 Crit Yellow
    80 Int/ 160 Crit Orange (Red or Yellow)
    160 Int Red
    80 Int/ 80 Hit Purple (I believe, for blue slots only)
    160 Hit/ 160 Crit Green (I believe, for blue slots only)

    Unless you are starving for hit rating in 450 gear, in which case go run 5 man HC dungeons

  10. #10
    can someone shed some light on the subject of gemming?

    i have been using askmrrobot.com for optimising my gear reforges and gemming, but i have been wondering why it tells me to gem full expertise gems and hit, but at the same time reforge away from hit?

    For me it makes more sense to go with intellect gems (if the bonus is <60 intel) and reforge into hit/expertise (atleast it's a lot cheaper).

    On the same note, since i'm in the process of gearing askmrrobot completely changes the reforges/gems everytime a single new gear peace is added - which makes it very expensive changing all the gems every single time sometimes even after a single peace is added, every single gem is shown as a different one

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...eam/Bba/simple

  11. #11
    As long as you are refoging Hit > Crit, adding more hit is not an issue because 2 Crit > 1 Intellect accoording to simcraft.

    Once you end up reforging Hit to Haste or Mastery is when you get in trouble though because 2 haste < 1 intellect, my advice above (for firemages) still stands, obviously frost or arcane will not go for Crit on their gems but rather haste or mastery.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by fujima View Post
    can someone shed some light on the subject of gemming?

    i have been using askmrrobot.com for optimising my gear reforges and gemming, but i have been wondering why it tells me to gem full expertise gems and hit, but at the same time reforge away from hit?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...eam/Bba/simple
    Because if you were to reforge to hit and use a gem without hit or expertise you might end up to far above or below the hitcap. Being above is bad because every rating above hitcap is wasted since it wont help your dps at all and being far below is obviously bad because you would miss with your spells. Changing around gems will put you as close to 15.00% as possible. I hope this makes any sense to you.
    Last edited by Pyrion; 2012-11-30 at 03:28 PM.

  13. #13
    Mechagnome jtmzac's Avatar
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    Tools that auto reforge you will use any means necessary (hit/expertise gems/enchants) to get you to about 0.1% either side of the hit cap.

    If you have the minimum gear to get to the hit cap (460-470) you'll probably get hit gems and enchants because you'll be struggling to get enough hit. Once you get better gear you'll be reforging out of hit simply because you have too much.

    Wether you gem hit at all with better gear is more likely to be because of a socket bonus.

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