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  1. #641
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swolltitan View Post
    They have said you dont have to do dailies to progress in raiding, you dont have to raid to progress in pvp and all that junk. They are correct, you don't. You also don't have to play if you are bored, unless under a contract. I tell you though since I can only get on a few hours, I spend more time doing old world stuff just for the fact that I cant devote enough time to progress in current content.
    Right.

    But the main problem is WoW is too gear based. Chasing gear that is useless in 4 months isn't very compelling for long.

    Which is why Blizzard needs to diversify content, so players can choose what they want to pursue with SIMILAR outcomes. Making all the good gear raid based is the old system that the devs understand, but in a day and age where raiders aren't raiding for 15hrs a day, that system no longer is viable.

    Anyone claiming they're some hardcore epic raider now sure didn't put in their dues.

    I rather get my gear for time spent in the game on a variety of pursuits (sampling all) than just a tiny segment, that gets old quick.

    This is why I would love for WoW to have a Signature style quest-line, that by the time the expansion is a 8 months or so from the end, players can get some epic gear for putting effort in on their own schedule. Raiders will hate it, but more people will have hope that there's some light at the end of the tunnel where there's something good that awaits for effort over time.

    We need to start rewarding patience.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
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  2. #642
    This 'WoW is dying' thread has been masterfully disguised!

    Actually though, it's not. WoW is doing great and there are a myriad of RL complications that can lead to a steady decline in player population. I myself haven't noticed one whatsoever.

  3. #643
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idoru View Post
    I have played (and payed for) this game for 8 years now. But the second I stop enjoying it I'm out, time and money be damned.
    Why on earth would you keep paying for (and force yourself to play) something you don't enjoy......
    That's you. Do you realize there's 10+ million others?
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  4. #644
    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Yes. As predicted, we have reached the point in this expansion where Cataclysm was a brilliant, wonderfully designed expansion. Just like Cata sucked and Wrath was perfect and Wrath sucked and TBC was perfect.
    Happens every time, without fail.

    Kind of funny how the doomcriers were the ones saying something about history repeating itself earlier.
    I mourn the loss of a man of true vision and talent. You were my idol, Mr. Giger.
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  5. #645
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    Right. But the main problem is WoW is too gear based. Chasing gear that is useless in 4 months isn't very compelling for long.
    This. This is why I don't kill myself to do dailies or to raid. Being the first one to do it is not gonna win me some sponsorship from Pepsi and a 5M dollar contract. Plus, after the next expac launches, the gear that took months to gather is basically worthless. Figure I will just take my time and get what I get without stressing.

  6. #646
    Well like any MMO, eventually content runs out and there isn't much to do. Other than doing the new 5.1 dailies which don't take that long, there really isn't much else for me to do other than my 2 night a week raiding. I've got some alts up already, but even then I'm not going to valor cap them because chances are I'll only do LFR with them. So I don't care. I've also done all the factions as well. I could blow tons of gold on a brawler invite, but then what? Wait literally a few hours to get my turn and kill an elite? Woop de freakin do. lol.

  7. #647
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Medanielle View Post
    This 'WoW is dying' thread has been masterfully disguised!

    Actually though, it's not. WoW is doing great and there are a myriad of RL complications that can lead to a steady decline in player population. I myself haven't noticed one whatsoever.
    More excuses.

    The game is dying due to apathy and staleness and some brain dead decisions from Blizzard (e.g., Warlocks being so OP it's just watch players die as healers don't have efficient counters scenerios, all so it can work in arena, hells bells anywhere else).
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
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  8. #648
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by duster2 View Post
    Just like he would have 3 months into cata - and after 4.1. Still the stats were showing a steady decline at the time and we got same arguments going then.
    Carefully read all that I posted in the thread and you would find that I agree you can tell whether things are generally going up/down with regard to activity. My point is more subtle in that due to the nature of the sampling mechanisms (especially WRC) the nature of the sample can and will change over time. That makes comparing one set of data (first two months of MoP) to another a much more difficult proposition. I'm not saying that you can't use Xfire/WRC to determine broad overall trends. I think you can. I'm much more skeptical of using either to compare results spaced over a very long time frame of 18+ months and then draw conclusions from that.
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  9. #649
    Quote Originally Posted by Maruka View Post
    I think its because the xp is not alt friendly so far so a lot of people that would normally play and level alts just dont have the drive to do it.
    Which strikes me as odd, because the time and effort required to level multiple alts and vp cap them all on any given week in Cata > the effort it takes to do dailies + vp cap on 1 toon now.

    After years of Blizzard saying 'hey, there's no need for you to make a decision on much of anything', folks don't like suddenly feeling like they need to decide on what single toon they'll be focusing on for at least the start of this expansion.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  10. #650
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    But the main problem is WoW is too gear based. Chasing gear that is useless in 4 months isn't very compelling for long.
    It has proved compelling enough to put it in the number one spot and keep it there for years.

    WoW has always been based around gear.
    I mourn the loss of a man of true vision and talent. You were my idol, Mr. Giger.
    You gave faces to my dreams and nightmares and sparked my imagination throughout my entire life. You will be missed.

    Hans Rudolf Giger
    2/5/1940 - 5/12/2014

  11. #651
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BeastmasterGuardian View Post
    This. This is why I don't kill myself to do dailies or to raid. Being the first one to do it is not gonna win me some sponsorship from Pepsi and a 5M dollar contract. Plus, after the next expac launches, the gear that took months to gather is basically worthless. Figure I will just take my time and get what I get without stressing.
    Yep.

    Raising 30 alts on Shandris alone is enough of a time sink as it is.

    Feels wonderful not being on that gear roller coaster. Now can simply play (if Blizzard doesn't screw up things again...no more 164k crits + DoTs in BGs without efficient counters!).
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
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  12. #652
    High Overlord Kissme's Avatar
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    Great post by Faroth

    Although I would argue that various parts of each and every expansion were terrible or good. I don't think that we've hit the nostalgia window for Cataclysm yet, but then I never hit a nostalgia window for wrath. Each to their own.

  13. #653
    Just because people are playing less doesn't mean they're not paying their subscription.

  14. #654
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    It has proved compelling enough to put it in the number one spot and keep it there for years.

    WoW has always been based around gear.
    At most 20% raids.

    Do you understand by Blizzard's own statistics 20% of the population also solos the game?

    Put things in perspective, raiding was never THE reason to play a MMORPG.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  15. #655
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    At most 20% raids.

    Do you understand by Blizzard's own statistics 20% of the population also solos the game?

    Put things in perspective, raiding was never THE reason to play a MMORPG.
    I must have missed the part where only raids used and awarded gear.
    I mourn the loss of a man of true vision and talent. You were my idol, Mr. Giger.
    You gave faces to my dreams and nightmares and sparked my imagination throughout my entire life. You will be missed.

    Hans Rudolf Giger
    2/5/1940 - 5/12/2014

  16. #656
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora View Post
    Annoys me how people say this so frequently when statistics are posted. Do you guys realise how surveys are generally conducted and typical sample sizes? 2,800 people is not a small sample, it is a huge sample that would be the envy of most survey organisers. If you believe 1 in 3333 of the total audience is too small a sample to conclude anything you must believe that 21 million is a small sample size to conclude anything about the human population? Or rather "far too small".
    There's a very large difference between the sort of sample you'll get with Xfire/WRC and a scientifically designed poll such as you read about during election years. How large a difference might be worth discussing if that could be determined. It can't though since anything resembling the latter doesn't exist that we know of for World of Warcraft. If Blizzard has done a scientifically designed market survey, they haven't talked about it or provided any results.
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  17. #657
    Scarab Lord ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilian View Post
    So what are these game breaking, contradicting game decisions they took? Please enlighten me.
    One example is silhouette theory. Back in the classic days, Blizzard devs would regularly point out that the reason we would never see a bi-factional race was because a core idea of the game was that you should recognize the opposite faction on sight almost instinctively. Here's a piece from WoW Insider on the idea: http://wow.joystiq.com/2011/08/17/tr...tte-theory-an/

    Similar fundamental changes in game design have occurred with pve to pvp realm transfers, paid faction changes, and endgame access. These may not be "game-breaking" in the sense that they nosedive the revenue, but they represent very large, basically 180 degree shifts in the underlying structure of the game. A game where a tiny fraction of the players ever see (much less defeat) endgame content is fundamentally different from one where the philosophy is for as many people as possible to experience the endgame content. I'm not saying which model is better (although obviously I have my own opinion, as do most of us ) but it's unquestionable that they are polar opposites in terms of game design.

  18. #658
    Scarab Lord Anjerith's Avatar
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    Why do people keep showing Xfire statistics like anyone actually uses Xfire?
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Gold and the 'need' for it in-game is easily one of the most overblown mindsets in this community.

  19. #659
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    At most 20% raids.

    Do you understand by Blizzard's own statistics 20% of the population also solos the game?

    Put things in perspective, raiding was never THE reason to play a MMORPG.
    How ironic that the pvp you keep mentioning is the biggest mistake blizzard has ever made. Do a search and it was GC and another dev in a interview said that pvp/arena are the biggest mistakes blizzard has ever made. I guess that would explain why they arent nerfing things for you in pvp, this is a pve game more than it is a pvp game and if you hear GC and devs mention that it is the biggest mistakes they ever made maybe you should wish for other things lol.

  20. #660
    Dreadlord Voolawl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kissme View Post
    The problem comes when bad players expect to clear hardmode content as quickly as average or upper echelon players.

    Accept your limitations.
    I just wanted to quote this and use it in my signature, because it's completely true.

    Also sup getting out of my AP early because this game has nothing worthwhile to offer me anymore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kissme View Post
    The problem comes when bad players expect to clear hardmode content as quickly as average or upper echelon players.
    Accept your limitations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    Admittedly, I enjoy beer more as a beverage that I can appreciate rather then getting drunk.

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