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  1. #1

    MM 5.1 worth at last?

    Well guys with the recent buffs to mm in 5.1 at least is worth it use this spec at last? i think yes because the increase to the buff of IS is really a quality change.


    Pve wise any mm experience can tell me if a swich from survival to mm atm, my dps is gonna go up, thanks!

  2. #2
    Blademaster
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    Quote Originally Posted by keygy View Post
    Well guys with the recent buffs to mm in 5.1 at least is worth it use this spec at last? i think yes because the increase to the buff of IS is really a quality change.
    Sorry but no.

    noxxic.com/wow/dps-rankings/realistic-dps

  3. #3
    My hunter mate tried MM last night and is a die hard MM fan, went back to Surv/BM after one boss so its still not good.

  4. #4
    Thing that makes me laugh about Purifico's post is that he said, DEFINITIVELY, "Sorry but no." and then proceeded to link to a site that demonstrated that not only is Marks close to BM, but above Survival. What kind of shit is that?

    In any case... I tried it, like all hunter dps, it's trash, but it's viable... it even does pretty decent AOE dps if you get Thrill of the Hunt. So if you have a fight with a lot of AOE you can put TotH on and it'll allow you to multishot like 20 times in a row.(or more on certain trash like the giant packs of Vizir trash, infinity multishots)

    Is it the answer to hunter dps woes?

    Sorry but no.

    Could be worse though.

  5. #5
    The spec still sucks. The single target portion of it can't compete with BM and the AOE portion can't compete with Surv.

    Verdict= still sucks. Although single target maybe on par with Surv's single target, which isn't saying much at all.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Ijanaak View Post
    Thing that makes me laugh about Purifico's post is that he said, DEFINITIVELY, "Sorry but no." and then proceeded to link to a site that demonstrated that not only is Marks close to BM, but above Survival. What kind of shit is that?

    In any case... I tried it, like all hunter dps, it's trash, but it's viable... it even does pretty decent AOE dps if you get Thrill of the Hunt. So if you have a fight with a lot of AOE you can put TotH on and it'll allow you to multishot like 20 times in a row.(or more on certain trash like the giant packs of Vizir trash, infinity multishots)

    Is it the answer to hunter dps woes?

    Sorry but no.

    Could be worse though.
    In what world do you live in that you see Marks being higher than SV in pve?

    Delusions much? Since when are people trusting noxxic.com? Newb as fuck.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by rjambi View Post
    In what world do you live in that you see Marks being higher than SV in pve?

    Delusions much? Since when are people trusting noxxic.com? Newb as fuck.
    In this case you couldn't be more wrong. Noxxic takes that data directly from simcraft. Here is the same results only ~30k higher but since its in heroic gear. BM ahead by 5k and MM ahead of SV by 1k.

    http://simulationcraft.org/510/Raid_T14H.html


    Anyone saying that MM is not viable, but says that survival is viable, is not up to date with current information.

  8. #8
    It's still pretty terrible. Realistically all 3 specs are still way behind, compared to all the other pure DPS'ers.

    And all of our specs have like 6 more buttons than most of the others, too. It's pretty shitty.

  9. #9
    Tried out MM; has less single-target dps than BM, less aoe than SV, has zero cleave.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Penguintamer View Post
    It's still pretty terrible. Realistically all 3 specs are still way behind, compared to all the other pure DPS'ers.

    And all of our specs have like 6 more buttons than most of the others, too. It's pretty shitty.
    Well if you are arguing that we should just abandon our hunters..... I see your point. We are pretty bad overall.

    However this is a question about viability and I've yet to hear someone say that Survival is not viable on single target, its just lower. Now the MM people still say its not viable despite being higher. Its grossly illogical.

  11. #11
    ^I think they are just saying that because they don't know how to play it properly.

  12. #12
    MM sucks. In fact, I think it's even worse then before. My tests before the patch resoulted in about 15% drop in dps in MM compared to SV - but now my SV dps went up kinda nicely, and MM did not almost at all.

    I guess Blizzard should sometimes, uhm, peek into hunter forums once for a while. MM dps was amazingly bad even in beta.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by rjambi View Post
    In what world do you live in that you see Marks being higher than SV in pve?

    Delusions much? Since when are people trusting noxxic.com? Newb as fuck.
    Unfortunately since I couldn't find Nascent's logs on Worldoflogs to try and make any comparisons or examples or arguments at all...

    I'll just say, I'm not the one who linked noxxic, so that's a pretty shit attitude to come in here with. For two, you self admit to being pro-Survival and anti-Beast Mastery so there's a clear bias slant in favor of Survival and against anything else, never mind just Marksmanship... and third, I've played hunter for eight years... didn't post to advocate for Marksmanship, but I think it's perfectly fine albeit lower than Beast Mastery.

    Based on Nascent's progress I'll grant you on your current Heroic progress of one Heroic kill that, yes, fine, Survival is the best on Stone Guard. I have not found it to be a particularly great spec in the expansion, especially on single target - but Survival does perform very well on Stone Guard and Wind Lord... at the end of the day, in the absence of being able to pick apart everything you're saying - since you only blanket noob-dismissed, I'll just leave it at that.

    So yes, MM is still pretty shitty... but relax with your smarmy attitude. Survival sucks too.
    Last edited by Ijanaak; 2012-11-30 at 11:11 PM.

  14. #14
    Can we stop linking Sims as hard fact please? Everyone with two brain cells to rub together knows that Sims are incredibly bad for comparing specs and classes.

    MM right now is probably slightly behind Survival on single target. That means it's significantly behind BM for single target. It also has nowhere near the AoE capabilities of Survival. Add those two things together, and you realize that MM is still completely useless for PvE.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Can we stop linking Sims as hard fact please? Everyone with two brain cells to rub together knows that Sims are incredibly bad for comparing specs and classes.

    MM right now is probably slightly behind Survival on single target. That means it's significantly behind BM for single target. It also has nowhere near the AoE capabilities of Survival. Add those two things together, and you realize that MM is still completely useless for PvE.
    You say people shouldn't link Sims as hard facts, and then go on to claim MM is slightly behind SV on single target without any facts. Simcraft only becomes iffy once you compare different classes and of course factor in boss mechanics. Comparing specs of a single class (especially hunters) with each other is fairly accurate. If Simcraft is showing MM slightly ahead of SV, it probably is.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Can we stop linking Sims as hard fact please? Everyone with two brain cells to rub together knows that Sims are incredibly bad for comparing specs and classes.

    MM right now is probably slightly behind Survival on single target. That means it's significantly behind BM for single target. It also has nowhere near the AoE capabilities of Survival. Add those two things together, and you realize that MM is still completely useless for PvE.

    As the poster above me said, what evidence do you then have to say MM is slightly behind? Logs are not in any way conclusive since there hasn't been enough marks parses. There is no better tool for comparing patchwerk dps than Simcraft because Patchwerk hasn't been current tier since naxx. There are patchwerk type bosses but there are very few that qualify for perfect single target.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Nangz View Post
    As the poster above me said, what evidence do you then have to say MM is slightly behind? Logs are not in any way conclusive since there hasn't been enough marks parses. There is no better tool for comparing patchwerk dps than Simcraft because Patchwerk hasn't been current tier since naxx. There are patchwerk type bosses but there are very few that qualify for perfect single target.
    Well, seeing as we are 100% mobile, most fights will in a sense be sort of like patchwerk.

  18. #18
    now that I have my 4 piece I kind of want to try hardcasting aimed shot as marks and see how that goes.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Nangz View Post
    In this case you couldn't be more wrong. Noxxic takes that data directly from simcraft. Here is the same results only ~30k higher but since its in heroic gear. BM ahead by 5k and MM ahead of SV by 1k.

    http://simulationcraft.org/510/Raid_T14H.html


    Anyone saying that MM is not viable, but says that survival is viable, is not up to date with current information.
    Anyone saying that Simcraft provides actual and correct information about hunters hasn't played a hunter for the majority of the past 3 years.

    SC placed us bottom spec for majority in cataclysm, yet most of the time we were top 5 (besides that time in DS when we were shit for a week or 2).
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  20. #20
    High Overlord Whyevernot's Avatar
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    Who the hell links sims when comparing dps?

    Sims are so far from what things are actually like on live. If you want cold hard facts, check raidbots in a week or two weeks time and compare then.

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