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  1. #21
    I thought about it a bit, and I think this is no-win for Blizzard in a couple of respects.

    My understanding of Brawler's Guild is that it will let the very best players show off the same skills they use in those insane YouTube videos like the ones with the hunter or DK soloing insane boss fights, but do it with people watching. By its very nature, this will exclude the vast majority of WoW players because we aren't the best, don't have the best gear, and aren't tight enough in our execution or knowledge of boss fights.

    Where this is hard for Blizzard is that since this is the cool new thing, everybody wants in, everybody wants the rewards, and everybody thinks that since they are paying they should have access.

    So, how do you create high profile, special content for the elite few, but let everybody have it?

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Ayonel View Post

    So, how do you create high profile, special content for the elite few, but let everybody have it?
    You don't. What exactly is the value in catering to those people again? Don't they have enough to do?

  3. #23
    BWÜAHHHHHHH I CANT GET EVERYTHING IN DA GAME BLIZZARD BWÜAHHH


    this has to stop.


    if you want something, GODDAMN FUCKING SHIT WORK FOR IT GODDAMN.

    yeah infract me, what ever.

  4. #24
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    I was expecting this to be content that could be cleared by everyone, not just the raiding minority. Looks like I was wrong.
    It's a system in which things get more difficult as you work up through the ranks. There's no particular reward as such so it's not terribly surprising that you need better gear in the later ranks than you can get by with in the earlier ranks.

    As well, I would question the idea that content designed to play solo should be the exclusive province of solo-only players. There's nothing at all wrong with content that encourages someone to go out and do other parts of the game to get a better advantage. That applies to the Brawler's Guild and the arguments going on about having to do BG's for the legendary. People might not like it but there's nothing wrong about designing things so that they relate to each other and poke players into doing something they've never done before or for a very long time.
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  5. #25
    I am Murloc!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayonel View Post
    very best players
    Being one of 25 people who follow a schedule and know how to move out of the fire is the same as "very best players?"

    Or do you mean people with the best gear?

    Either way, your concept of "best" is flawed at best. Doesn't being one of the very best players mean you're an awesome player, not that your gear is good?

    Before I spend tens of thousands for an invite, I'd like to know I have a snowflakes chance in hell, regardless of how fucking awesome I am as a human being and a player, of ever clearing this shit. Right now, it seems like some e-peen candy designed for raiders.
    've is short for have. C/Sh/Would've or c/sh/would have. Not c/sh/would of.

  6. #26
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    People who are better than you deserve better rewards, simple as that
    ^^^^ Why should you get anything for being bad?

    Im not elitist I dont even raid anymore but come on, the reason the games going to hell is because of entitlement.

  7. #27
    High Overlord
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    One other thing of note, I've got guild members with invites who are decked out in half heroic/half normal gear (we're 4/12H atm), who are exceptional players using flasks/pots/going with all buffs, and still not beating enrage timers. So I wouldn't say it's for the decked-out raiders, I'd say it's for future-you. You would need a lot of gear to be able to beat it this patch, I think that's both intended, and both a good thing.

    As a Mainspec healer in said guild, I might be waiting until I'm in BiS for the entire xpac before I'm able to beat it, and I'm perfectly fine with that, I'm not a gladiator either, and fine with that!

  8. #28
    Better fix that asap. Having advantages in pve content being better geared. Preposterous.

  9. #29
    Pandaren Monk Otiswhitaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deja Thoris View Post
    I don't get your point?

    If they make it so that a person kitted out in dungeon blues can finish it then people in raid gear are obviously going to faceroll it. Theres 2 possible solutions to this:
    1) Do what they did. This offers less geared people something to aim for, through skill or gear progression. SOLO players can still hit close to an ilevel of 500, it will just take crafted BoE epics, valor items and valor upgrades.
    2) Gear normalisation such as in challenge modes.

    While I personally would have preferred option 2), the option they chose is perfectly valid. In either case progression is available through either path, it will just take non raiders longer.

    In any case, deck a weekend warrior out in epics and they will still not meet the skill requirements needed to kill the later bosses (in most cases) so it pretty much invalidates your points.

    Anyway, your whole post stinks of entitlement. God forbid blizzard introduces content with a high skillcap or gear requirement eh?
    His point was that a very small minority of players raid. Why tailor anything to them? Seemingly, Blizzard (and a lot of players) live in a fantasy world where this isn't true.

  10. #30
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    Make things available to everyone? People say it's too easy.
    Limit things to people with lots of money and playtime? People say it's too gated.


    If you remember, original WoW was very gated. Blizzard just can't win!

    Want to get into the guild, farm cash and play more!

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Otiswhitaker View Post
    His point was that a very small minority of players raid. .
    Do you have any half-valid evidence to back that up other than what your uncle told you?
    Quote Originally Posted by Bovinity Divinity View Post
    Then the [MMORPG] genre started attracting more players. These players wanted more of a "game" and less of a "world" [...]

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Otiswhitaker View Post
    His point was that a very small minority of players raid. Why tailor anything to them? Seemingly, Blizzard (and a lot of players) live in a fantasy world where this isn't true.
    Because you'd have no noteworthy game left if you'd cater only to players that log in five minutes a week and want to see all the stuff. Maybe in a couple years everything will be an iteration of angry birds and divers reality shows to maximize profit but we still have a little time left till that point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfsage View Post
    Do you have any half-valid evidence to back that up other than what your uncle told you?
    There is no question that most "subscriptions" don't actually raid looking at the numbers presented by wowprogress and comparing those to active subscription numbers given by Blizzard.
    Last edited by cFortyfive; 2012-12-01 at 10:00 PM.

  13. #33
    Pandaren Monk Otiswhitaker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfsage View Post
    Do you have any half-valid evidence to back that up other than what your uncle told you?
    Blizzard published stats on dragon soul last year, if you want something official. They've said many times over in interviews that very few people raid, which is why LFR is being made (So they can validate spending all that money on content people wouldn't normally see), then, go look at some third party things, like wowprogress. Look at the amount of players that have completed various tiers. Compare that to the 10 million or so playing. There's a large portion of people, even, who don't even get to level caps in any given expansion.

    There's a HUGE conflict of what Blizzard thinks WoW is, what players think WoW is, what HARDCORE players think WoW is, what casual players think WoW is, and what WoW actually is.

  14. #34
    It is a fun event & all but i think blizzard should focus more on other things like fixing botting issue

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    So, apparently this newly implemented SOLO content is nothing more than an e-peen meter for geared raiders.

    I've not personally gotten an invite yet, so I can't say anything from personal experience, but from what I've seen, apparently the later bosses require such high DPS amounts (combined with some survivability), that we're talking about high-end raid gear. People who have justice point gear, or PvP gear, seem to be getting shafted in this completely.

    I was expecting this to be content that could be cleared by everyone, not just the raiding minority. Looks like I was wrong.

    Anyone here not in heavy valor point gear who has reached rank 8? That would prove me wrong and show me that you don't need high-end raid gear to clear this content. Content, by the way, that was designed for SOLO playing.
    You made so little sense that I dont know where to start.

    First of all, you think that Raiders are a minority and that players in JP gear are a majority? Reality check please, only players in JP gear are alts and people that stopped playing.

    Not to mention that you think that PvP geared people are supposed to clear PvE content somehow? You put a lot of pressure on your SOLO's, maybe you should go look up the meaning of PVE as well.


    If you are a casual player, get used to only playing the casual part of the game and not ruining it for the people that want more.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by mswhiskerson View Post
    Raiding requires (in almost all cases) you to be available at specific times on specific days. Some people's lives do not allow for that.
    Quote Originally Posted by mswhiskerson View Post
    It's obvious you do get his point. You even suggest solutions to the issue he highlights.

    Gear normalisation should have been such a no-brainer for Blizzard on this content. Then they're introducing something new that everyone can do while only being limited by their ability to play.

    I think it's perfectly acceptable that he wants to do content that even Blizzard describe as solo to the same standard as people that outgear him assuming equal skill levels.

    If anyone's post stinks of anything it is yours. Grouping the majority of people who don't have large amounts of time to play and suggesting they wouldn't have the skill to do it anyway given the same gear is tantamount to a troll coming in and saying "lol u casual u bad".

    I'm sure my opinion here will differ from the majority, but I'm with you OP. I think everyone should be able to complete that content without raiding, spending huge amounts of gold or crafting every eipc under the sun as long as they have the skill to do it.
    ^This. Of course non-raiders can always wait for welfare epics in the next tier/patch, but hey, who wants to do stuff when its already old. Let skill dominate brawlers guild, not faster access to better gear.....

  17. #37
    The rank 8 bosses are really the only ones with tight dps requirements and theres nothing wrong with those being that high since you can already get more rewards.

  18. #38
    But but but iam 502ilvl holy pala ; i cant kill any bosses /sad panda

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    So, apparently this newly implemented SOLO content is nothing more than an e-peen meter for geared raiders.

    I've not personally gotten an invite yet, so I can't say anything from personal experience, but from what I've seen, apparently the later bosses require such high DPS amounts (combined with some survivability), that we're talking about high-end raid gear. People who have justice point gear, or PvP gear, seem to be getting shafted in this completely.

    I was expecting this to be content that could be cleared by everyone, not just the raiding minority. Looks like I was wrong.

    Anyone here not in heavy valor point gear who has reached rank 8? That would prove me wrong and show me that you don't need high-end raid gear to clear this content. Content, by the way, that was designed for SOLO playing.
    SOLO playing for very well geared skilled people to give them a new challenge. What is the problem about it? We have LFR for us casuals, which the semi-serious raiders dislike. Do we now whine because they have something designed for them? I think not, well not me anyway. Good on them, the good ones deserve something special, they worked hard to get their uber gear and skills, nice they have a chance to really test themselves. I, along with many, have no interest in it at all but the game is so big there is plenty for me to do that I enjoy. Now there is something for people whose only interest is fighting mobs. I hope they enjoy it and not too many kiddies complain so it is nerfed.

    OP - you want to do it, you work as hard as the ones doing it, to get their skills and gear and you can do it too. It is not closed to anyone who is able to do it. It is about time Blizzard gave something to skilled players, not everything for us casuals

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfsage View Post
    Do you have any half-valid evidence to back that up other than what your uncle told you?
    Blizzard's own numbers say that even including LFR the number of raiders is below 20%, was way way less before LFR.

    That said CRZ killed the fight club for me, there's hundreds of people in mine when I've gone to try and it's literally too laggy for my international connection to handle. After buying the invite I can't even fight. They whole thing feels very badly implemented, especially considering all the 'bringing the realm together' crap they said when it was announced. I don't think I've seen a single person from my realm inside, should have just instanced it individually.

    I was really looking forward to it because as someone who doesn't quest I've pretty much been left out of a fair chunk of the content this xpac, so this seemed ideal for me, but it's been a huge letdown.

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