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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    I watched a dude with upgraded CP gear get clobbered like he wore cloth last week on the BG.

    If upgraded CP gear isn't offering the protection PvPers are used to with CP gear, it's really broken.

    I mean the DoTs are ticking out more damage than melee weapons and most of their abilities (except for CDs abilities and popping trinkets). These aren't 3 second DoTs anymore, they tick very fast. Add that fast dispels are gone, there's multiple DoTs on targets at very unacceptable rates -- kitties; DKs; Warlocks; Shamans all are DoTTING, and my healing addon looks like a Christmas tree...but I can't do a thing to cure it, as Cleanse is on a whopping 8 second cooldown PER TARGET.

    Broken, seriously, broken.
    I find it comical that you think dots of all things are the issue right now, with them being the easiest things to heal through and manage, when frost mages/warlocks/warriors can frontload over 200k damage in a global these days.

    Nothing surprising though coming from a player with no experience past the 1500s in a rated scene.


    As for the OP: if you're prepared and wearing pvp gear when you're going into a fight against another player, expect to be clobbered when he is prepared for such a fight and destroys you.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    but I can't do a thing to cure it, as Cleanse is on a whopping 8 second cooldown PER TARGET.

    Broken, seriously, broken.
    The mentality behind putting a CD on dispels was brain damaged. For one it completely gimps pve dispelling. Healers are going to have to call out dispelsoff every target to avoid stepping on toes, dispels need to be removed in many cases, and I don't think anyone who did LFR or DF could accuse the average pug healer of "dispelling too much", if they ever did it, it was a shock.

    As for pvp, seriously, 8 seconds CD but things still have dispel protection, haste makes dots tick faster and faster, and dots have been critting since wrath, I don't get this. For PvE especially, every class should have a mass dispel at least. Not potent like priests to offensively remove immunities, but something that can defensively remove a lot of dots, say raidwide or whatever. Constantly dispelling makes it harder to what exactly? Dot cleaves were OP even in Cata, constant dispelling wasn't a go-to strategy but it at least made things a bit more manageable. Dispel protection made it so blindly removing dots was ill-advised anyways, but now it's hard to intelligently dispel.

  3. #23
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    I find it comical that you think dots of all things are the issue right now, with them being the easiest things to heal through and manage, when frost mages/warlocks/warriors can frontload over 200k damage in a global these days
    DoTs a healer could Cleanse preventing deaths.

    If you're going to be essentially dead on sight no heal in the world is going to save you, just rez already.

    It's called triage.
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  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    As for the OP: if you're prepared and wearing pvp gear when you're going into a fight against another player, expect to be clobbered when he is prepared for such a fight and destroys you.
    You mean if "you're unprepared and not wearing pvp gear", right? Or were you specifically making commentary based on the fact the guy he fought was a warrior which no melee can stand a chance against, even with pvp gear on?

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    DoTs a healer could Cleanse preventing deaths.

    If you're going to be essentially dead on sight no heal in the world is going to save you, just rez already.

    It's called triage.
    On the flip side, having cleanse with a cooldown allows you to remove any number of magic/poison/disease dots in a single cast, instead of it being x number of cleanses to take them off, and sometimes eating an unstable affliction or vampiric touch fear instead. which did you prefer?

    Otherwise, unless you are fighting a team filled with 10 shadow priests/warlocks/unholy death knights, dots are a non issue to heal through. Just a couple days ago watching Vangards stream with an affliction warlock, they had a 16 minute game that didn't end until they were able to stun the enemy shaman in a spot in which he couldn't run behind a pillar after it faded, spirit link/astralshift/trinket were on cooldown, and his team's shadowpriest's life grip and void shift were on cooldown.

    If you are having an issue with dots outdamaging your heals, you are either vastly outnumbered, or playing very poorly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Constellation View Post
    You mean if "you're unprepared and not wearing pvp gear", right? Or were you specifically making commentary based on the fact the guy he fought was a warrior which no melee can stand a chance against, even with pvp gear on?
    The only warriors I have issues with are those with tier 2 weapons. While their burst is terrifying, it can be dealt with with proper cd usage.

  6. #26
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Constellation View Post
    The mentality behind putting a CD on dispels was brain damaged. For one it completely gimps pve dispelling. Healers are going to have to call out dispelsoff every target to avoid stepping on toes, dispels need to be removed in many cases, and I don't think anyone who did LFR or DF could accuse the average pug healer of "dispelling too much", if they ever did it, it was a shock.
    The problem is 8 second dispel times in PvP. W-a-y too many DoTs, and single-target dispels when, just one kitty or DK, can pollute 10 players...it's the definition of broken.

    Blizzard already increased the mana cost on it, now 8 second CDs. Either the DoTs don't do as much damage, or bring back instant cast dispels. There has to be a counter to DoTs, or having the ability of dispelling is a joke.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
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  7. #27
    Dreadlord Ninaran's Avatar
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    You're late to the party. WoW PvP hasn't been good ... ever.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Apathy- View Post
    Cmon don't be silly or could be sarcasm regardless I have to correct you because It bothers me

    ''Conquest point gear''
    ...I'm still shocked at the fact he said Child Porn Gear. /stare
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    Transorcers, Warlords in disguise.

  9. #29
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmmmmmmBacon View Post
    On the flip side, having cleanse with a cooldown allows you to remove any number of magic/poison/disease dots in a single cast, instead of it being x number of cleanses to take them off, and sometimes eating an unstable affliction or vampiric touch fear instead. which did you prefer?
    8 seconds of waiting for 50+k of damage vs 3 cleanses that take 3 seconds???

    That does not compute.

    Even if you did cleanse unstable affliction or vampiric touch...it's easily healed, and often with a nice HS.

    BG dispelling especially is fast and furious, as they stack and hurt. If it's not removing DoTs, it's removing stuns/fears/any disorientating effects that sub-class can dispel. I often assume that duty as I've very quick at it and keep the team clean. But now, it's just having my healbox looking like a Christmas tree littered with 10000000001 DoTs and can't but Cleanse ONE player at a time every 8 seconds, and they're dying of tick damage.

    No flip side to that madness. That's not even triage, that's working for a morgue. -_-
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
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  10. #30
    Dreadlord Ninaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    The problem is 8 second dispel times in PvP. W-a-y too many DoTs, and single-target dispels when, just one kitty or DK, can pollute 10 players...it's the definition of broken.
    I actually like the dispel cooldown as mindlessly spamming it was way too effective.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Constellation View Post
    Also if that guy had an SI:7 Manual equipped, you are gona get clobbered. 10000 PvP power for 15 seconds, every minute (in Pandaria) is huge amounts of burst (it's 37.5% by itself), especially for an OP warrior.
    This pretty much.

    It's also a pain to farm, I was trying to get it to get more kills in the new area. The only problem is the large quantities of players also camping the rares for the Brawler's invites who just delete the pvp trinkets when they don't get the Invites.
    "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it." - Ayn Rand

  12. #32
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninaran View Post
    I actually like the dispel cooldown as mindlessly spamming it was way too effective.
    Wait until locks get a pretty hard nerf (as you know it's coming).

    ...Oh, the bitter tears...
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  13. #33
    Dreadlord Ninaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    Wait until locks get a pretty hard nerf (as you know it's coming).

    ...Oh, the bitter tears...
    Eh, not playing PvP so I dunno.

  14. #34
    The Lightbringer Kevyne-Shandris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ninaran View Post
    Eh, not playing PvP so I dunno.
    You will feel the nerf, even if you don't play PvP, as stats are linked between PvP and PvE.
    From the #1 Cata review on Amazon.com: "Blizzard's greatest misstep was blaming players instead of admitting their mistakes. They've convinced half of the population that the other half are unskilled whiners, causing a permanent rift in the community."
    Blizzard's blame game in action: Deleting 6,100+ of Kevyne's posts and threads from the WoW forums.

  15. #35
    Dreadlord Ninaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    You will feel the nerf, even if you don't play PvP, as stats are linked between PvP and PvE.
    Well Warlocks kinda need a nerf in PvE anyways so I'm completely fine with it

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevyne-Shandris View Post
    8 seconds of waiting for 50+k of damage vs 3 cleanses that take 3 seconds???

    That does not compute.

    Even if you did cleanse unstable affliction or vampiric touch...it's easily healed, and often with a nice HS.

    BG dispelling especially is fast and furious, as they stack and hurt. If it's not removing DoTs, it's removing stuns/fears/any disorientating effects that sub-class can dispel. I often assume that duty as I've very quick at it and keep the team clean. But now, it's just having my healbox looking like a Christmas tree littered with 10000000001 DoTs and can't but Cleanse ONE player at a time every 8 seconds, and they're dying of tick damage.

    No flip side to that madness. That's not even triage, that's working for a morgue. -_-
    50k damage over 8 seconds is a very very tame amount of damage and easily healed. If you had to use the old cleanse it would still take you several seconds (gcd being 1.5 seconds, not 1 second) to remove each dot on the target, each time risking taking a fear from vampiric touch or a silence from UA, while the dots you didn't get remain up, instead of just getting all the dots at once with the new cleanse, and just eating the silence (vamp touch fear being gone with the new dispel cds being implemented).

    Your cleanses should be saved for clearing a target of long ccs or any cc that is impeding them from getting the most out of a big cd (say a warrior being stunned after using recklessness or a warlock silenced with demon soul), and then to clear a rack of dots second. The only way your team is going to die to dots alone is if they are swamped with a 10 man team's worth of them, or they're incredibly undergeared. And even if they are going to die to dots, they aren't going to die soon, and you can simply just outheal the damage they put out.

    I don't know why you keep saying triage, because players with dots on them should be the least of your worries, and you should be worried about the guy afflicted with frost bomb or about to get hit with a chaos bolt.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Constellation View Post
    Also if that guy had an SI:7 Manual equipped, you are gona get clobbered. 10000 PvP power for 15 seconds, every minute (in Pandaria) is huge amounts of burst (it's 37.5% by itself), especially for an OP warrior.
    So we accepts as players that such an item exist? I think their developpers got hit hard on the head and need to be hit in the nuts to wake em up.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazmodius View Post
    So we accepts as players that such an item exist? I think their developpers got hit hard on the head and need to be hit in the nuts to wake em up.
    You are just a bad player. Stop whining.

  19. #39
    WoW pvp is broken imo. The need for gear to do good in pvp is a bad choice imo, thus the reason I don't play pvp in WoW.

    Something I think would be fun is if there were BGs you could join with pre-set gear, i. e. everybody has the same gear, thus the one doing well is more skilled than the rest, considering they would all have the same gear.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Doylez View Post
    Didn't they introduce 40% base resilience because they didn't want this to happen though?
    A shame it failed so miserably though, damage is so insane that you can barely tell that the base resilience actually exists.
    Hell I have something like 61% resil currently and sometimes it feels as if I don't have any at all.

    On the up side, there are also times where I'm grouped for these dailies with one or two others and we take down a group of 6+ horde.

    So there are happy times and sad times. Idk what people really expect though, I KNOW any brain dead player will be able to lock me out with blanket silences, stuns, fears etc...there's nothing else to do except group up and go to town. It doesn't matter when I DO actually manage to juke three of the players playing drums on my kindneys they will still silence me. That's why I group up and that's why you should too...support.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-03 at 08:01 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kazmodius View Post
    So we accepts as players that such an item exist? I think their developpers got hit hard on the head and need to be hit in the nuts to wake em up.
    It's a ganking trinket, nothing really wrong with it being in the game. Besides its not usable anywhere else except in pandaria.
    Last edited by Theholypally; 2012-12-03 at 08:01 AM.

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