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  1. #81
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsonfiend76 View Post
    what does that have to do with anything? when you have the best raid enchants gated behind rep, tell me how dailies are still optional? and yes, i do currently raid in a super casual guild and only downed the first couple bosses. let me ask you a question, how many alts do you have raid geared with maxxed out professions?
    Because if you read my original post, if you're a raider, the dailies aren't MEANT for you.

    Do you NEED Elder Charms.

    Do you NEED the gear from Valor.

    You have LFR, meaning you can run the same instances TWICE in one week, even if the iLevel is lower.

    Not the mention you can now, also, upgrade the iLevel on your gear.

    This also answers your post, Devic.

    This game has always been based around RNG.

    Valor point gear has NEVER filled in every slot for your gear.

    It's usually a ring, some legs, shoulders, or a helm and that's it.

    Refer to Cataclysm or Wrath for my points.
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  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by slozon View Post
    Yup ignore,

    Pet battles
    Treasure hunting
    Achievements
    Brawlers guild
    Rare hunting

    Nah all you got this expansion was dailies.........
    None of which have anything to do with gear progression.

    And as so many of you conveniently overlook, the complaints were not about lack of any old kind of content, they were about multi-month gaps between the new GROUP content (dungeons and raids) in Cataclysm. Saying they added your list and dailies to solve the problem of players complaining about lack of new group content doesn't make people who complain about dailies because they wanted more group content idiots.

    It just means you and Blizzard like to make the gist of your argument, you complained about X and we delivered Y so you will therefore never be satisfied.

    There was no mass demand for more dailies after Dragon Soul was dragging out to 9 months. The demand was far faster delivery of dungeon and raid tiers and to mock people for complaining about Blizzard's "solution" because they chose to ignore what kind of content people were complaining about doesn't alter the fact that they delivered the wrong thing and will ultimately pay the price in another big wave of sub losses.

    And for all of you people who are bolstering your argument because the sub numbers FIVE days after the release of new expac were up 1 million, bear in mind that subscriber numbers of Sept 30th don't reflect a thing about the content of Mists as the bulk of players were nowhere near levelled and even if players cancelled their subs on Sept 25-30th, they would have all still been active accounts.

    You have no data on subscriptions that means anything until the Dec 31st subscriber numbers are released.

  3. #83
    Why do people care so much that they have to work for things?
    'Work'… WoW is a game. Games should be fun. Yeah, 'fun' is a complex concept and even frustrating things can feel fun and rewarding in the end.
    But dailies are 'work', its simple PvE grind in it's purest form, doing the same things over and over and over and over again without any interesting dynamics.

    So yeah, no one has to do dailies. I did one faction to exaulted (cloud serpents), ignored the rest and am sitting at 3000 VP which I can't and won't spend.
    But dailies are hard to ignore, they are a major point in blizzards endgame design from a progression and content perspective. Tons of items, mounts, recipes and gear is locked behind dailies and we all know that gear and items are a major motivational point for wow players.

    Also, dailies don't treat my like a human being. It's 5h content, stretched to 200+ hours, just to keep me playing/paying. Well, WoW did this from the start but was better at hiding this. Running dungeons with other players has social dynamics involved that solo daily quests can't provide and I'm still having fun in AV, even in match #200. It's grind, too, but it becomes a fun and much more dynamic activity while in a group. Dailies are solo content, terrible solo content (you can do them grouped, but that's not so easy with different stages etc). For 13$/month you can play 10+ fantastic indie games or finish that old deus ex play-through.

    Imo Blizzard's major fault is trying to stretch out solo content to the point of player frustration instead of focussing on group based activities for end game. More dungeons, a LFG-tool for challenge modes. Scenarios were a great idea, too… but are terrible balanced and have zero in-game rewards. PvP needs balance ASP.

  4. #84
    High Overlord Crimsonfiend76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    Because if you read my original post, if you're a raider, the dailies aren't MEANT for you.

    Do you NEED Elder Charms.

    Do you NEED the gear from Valor.

    You have LFR, meaning you can run the same instances TWICE in one week, even if the iLevel is lower.

    Not the mention you can now, also, upgrade the iLevel on your gear.

    This also answers your post, Devic.

    This game has always been based around RNG.

    Valor point gear has NEVER filled in every slot for your gear.

    It's usually a ring, some legs, shoulders, or a helm and that's it.

    Refer to Cataclysm or Wrath for my points.
    when there are epic shoulders available via VP from golden lotus, i'll have to disagree. considering i went through all DS with only 2 token drops and 1 token + trinket in LFR, i am RNG's bitch. having the same T11 shoulders for all of cata, wasnt fun, if it wasnt for the VP gear available via vendors, i know i wouldnt have even bothered raiding the last tier.

    you side-stepped the question of profession patterns tied behind the rep-grind. ive seriously got more spirits of harmony than i know what to do with but since i cant trade them in for the best 'raid enchants' they are sitting in my bag collecting dust.

    lastly, being a raider doesnt guarantee gear, so unless you are just farming raid content, epics via dailies are necessary for progression since they are no longer obtainable via VP/JP alone.

  5. #85
    Honestly, my only beef with dailies is the lack of 100% drop rate. I don't mind doing 5-10 dailies for each faction. I do mind that it takes far longer for zero benefit than it needs to. When the Klaxxi dailies are on the far island, killing slaves and the coil worm thingies, I just skip that day. Spending an hour fighting others for the mobs that have a 10% drop rate? No thanks. I guess I'm willing to put in the work, I'm not willing to put in THAT much work.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-03 at 03:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by imYemeth View Post
    It's 5h content, stretched to 200+ hours, just to keep me playing/paying. Well, WoW did this from the start but was better at hiding this. Running dungeons with other players has social dynamics involved that solo daily quests can't provide
    This is a fantastic answer. People complain about me and my 'solo approach to an MMO' and now I have the perfect retort. Its not so much as I am antisocial and want to be left alone (although this is true) but Blizz has turned the MMO aspect on its ear by providing solo content in a MMO. So yeah, why do I have to spend my time fighting off hordes of CRZ asshats when Blizz obviously wants me to play by myself?

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoxus View Post
    Honestly, my only beef with dailies is the lack of 100% drop rate. I don't mind doing 5-10 dailies for each faction. I do mind that it takes far longer for zero benefit than it needs to. When the Klaxxi dailies are on the far island, killing slaves and the coil worm thingies, I just skip that day. Spending an hour fighting others for the mobs that have a 10% drop rate? No thanks. I guess I'm willing to put in the work, I'm not willing to put in THAT much work.
    I think this should be extended to all quests. I don't know why, but quest mobs having a drop rate just annoys me. I'd rather collect double the amount with 100% drop rate instead of half the amount with 50% rop rate.

  7. #87
    Scarab Lord foxHeart's Avatar
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  8. #88
    Mechagnome Vinni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyIommi View Post
    So wow is a professional sport now? Do I get paid like Bret Farve? How many useless dumb comparison can you guys make to real life before you get the hint. Wow is not actually real life and this virtual work ethic you've all seemed to embrace is not helpful. Should I be required to herd some sheep for an epic?
    I compared them because they are both games, it had nothing to do with one being a professional sport. It isn't a dumb comparison just because at first sight they are very different. I know that WoW isn't real life and so do just about all of the player base, but having to work to get rewarded is something that is included in any aspect of life where there are rewards to be gained. Some things require more effort than others and some are based off of luck but in the end you still need to put effort to get the ''best'' rewards. If by herd (fixed that error for you) sheep you mean doing something boring, then perhaps; if you mean something that is part of something that you chose to do (and by chose I am referring to playing WoW and progressing your character(s)) then still perhaps. There are multiple ways of getting epics nowadays with varying effort required for each. If you don't like earning your rewards then perhaps go buy an account or something.
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  9. #89
    Do people really thinks that millions of subscribers will stay with doing dailies

    when there are truckloads of other games to play? hmm

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-04 at 07:31 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    Because if you read my original post, if you're a raider, the dailies aren't MEANT for you.

    Do you NEED Elder Charms.

    Do you NEED the gear from Valor.
    Absolutely yes.

    If I am not dedicated super heroic raider? yes
    What if I am? yes because I would need better gear from the start.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Vinni View Post
    I compared them because they are both games, it had nothing to do with one being a professional sport. It isn't a dumb comparison just because at first sight they are very different. I know that WoW isn't real life and so do just about all of the player base, but having to work to get rewarded is something that is included in any aspect of life where there are rewards to be gained. Some things require more effort than others and some are based off of luck but in the end you still need to put effort to get the ''best'' rewards. If by herd (fixed that error for you) sheep you mean doing something boring, then perhaps; if you mean something that is part of something that you chose to do (and by chose I am referring to playing WoW and progressing your character(s)) then still perhaps. There are multiple ways of getting epics nowadays with varying effort required for each. If you don't like earning your rewards then perhaps go buy an account or something.
    Again your still comparing it to real life. If you really want to compare it, then wow has become a tedious menial low wage low thought job that only requires I show up and invest time. I mean the strawman argument going on here is that I don't want to work for gear well fine fuck you to. I was fine with "harder" heroics and the gear I got from them, and the rep, and the valor. Instead we get this crap. dailies are like working at MCDonalds and this game pays out about as well. Dumb ass real life comparisons not withstanding of course.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    Because if you read my original post, if you're a raider, the dailies aren't MEANT for you.

    Do you NEED Elder Charms.

    Do you NEED the gear from Valor.

    You have LFR, meaning you can run the same instances TWICE in one week, even if the iLevel is lower.

    Not the mention you can now, also, upgrade the iLevel on your gear.

    This also answers your post, Devic.

    This game has always been based around RNG.

    Valor point gear has NEVER filled in every slot for your gear.

    It's usually a ring, some legs, shoulders, or a helm and that's it.

    Refer to Cataclysm or Wrath for my points.
    Again, you're forgetting the item enhancement recipes. Only obtained through dailies. Are you telling me those are optional for raiding?

    Since you're stuck on dailies are optional despite Blizz doing everything they can to leverage the most daily rewards than another other content, I refer to the blue post:

    https://twitter.com/CM_Zarhym/status/258089196349190144

    Blizz WANTS players to do dailies. People were skipping it before using tabards. But Blizz knew even if they took out the tabards, players would still skip it since they didn't HAVE to do them - no more head 'chants, right? So, what did Blizz do? Turned around and quadruple dip the daily rewards. Now, in addition to the flavor mounts and stuff, they gates valor gear, item enhancement recipes, and the new elder charms. All so people don't "bypass content". That means, not optional.

  12. #92
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsonfiend76 View Post
    when there are epic shoulders available via VP from golden lotus, i'll have to disagree. considering i went through all DS with only 2 token drops and 1 token + trinket in LFR, i am RNG's bitch. having the same T11 shoulders for all of cata, wasnt fun, if it wasnt for the VP gear available via vendors, i know i wouldnt have even bothered raiding the last tier.

    you side-stepped the question of profession patterns tied behind the rep-grind. ive seriously got more spirits of harmony than i know what to do with but since i cant trade them in for the best 'raid enchants' they are sitting in my bag collecting dust.

    lastly, being a raider doesnt guarantee gear, so unless you are just farming raid content, epics via dailies are necessary for progression since they are no longer obtainable via VP/JP alone.
    Oh, no, I honestly forgot about your profession argument.

    Sorry, I was halfway out to the gym while responding.

    Regardless, Spirits of Harmony wise I dunno. I wish you could vendor them or something so I agree with you on that.
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  13. #93
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devic View Post
    Again, you're forgetting the item enhancement recipes. Only obtained through dailies. Are you telling me those are optional for raiding?
    If you're talking about patterns for things like spellthreads, top enchants, leg armors, etc those aren't mandatory for individual players to know how to make, only to use on their gear.

    They're not BoP, so as long as someone gets them (and someone will, as they can be lucrative moneymakers, especially if not many people have the pattern), it's fine. You can get them from other guildmates, or the AH, or by seeking out crafters in /trade, just like you would for the items made by professions other than your own.
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  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    Regardless, Spirits of Harmony wise I dunno. I wish you could vendor them or something so I agree with you on that.
    You can vendor them. There's a vendor outside each faction's new city that will give you mats that can be sold for a profit.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    If you're talking about patterns for things like spellthreads, top enchants, leg armors, etc those aren't mandatory for individual players to know how to make, only to use on their gear.

    They're not BoP, so as long as someone gets them (and someone will, as they can be lucrative moneymakers, especially if not many people have the pattern), it's fine. You can get them from other guildmates, or the AH, or by seeking out crafters in /trade, just like you would for the items made by professions other than your own.
    That requires other players to use spirit of harmony which are BOP. I'd gladly trade a guildie the mats, including harmonies, to make all the enhancements I need, but I can't, can i?

    I'd never buy the enhancements for a profession that my character has, then I'd buy the recipe (like I could before), then sell the enhancements to recoup the cost. Can't do that now, either.

  16. #96
    Elemental Lord Destil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squirl View Post
    You can vendor them. There's a vendor outside each faction's new city that will give you mats that can be sold for a profit.
    I meant more-so for gold :X.
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  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Destil View Post
    I meant more-so for gold :X.
    The mats you get sell for gold... 2x golden lotus is a decent option. As is an Ironpaw token which you can then turn in for soy sauce.

  18. #98
    Scarab Lord Gandrake's Avatar
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    Because these zones were crowded, especially Golden Lotus.

    I'm willing to be that, if resources were more abundant, a lot of players who had a problem with doing dailies wouldn't have had a problem. It's just stupid that when you have all of your quests done the holdup is that you cannot find one last set of mobs or whatever dumbass item. It took up a significant and unnecessary amount of time and was very frustrating.

    But you know, I wonder why it is, that no one is bitching about the O:SW quests. Probably because they are quick. The only beef I have with them is that it's like Blizzard intentionally places items that are good for Warriors on Valor Vendors, just to fuck with them!
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  19. #99
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Devic View Post
    That requires other players to use spirit of harmony which are BOP. I'd gladly trade a guildie the mats, including harmonies, to make all the enhancements I need, but I can't, can i?
    Not sure why that matters, really. There have often been BoP mats; historically we have compensated the crafter with gold. I've traded lotuses (or flasks) in equivalent quantities this expansion, since I can match the SoH value more exactly that way.

    Like I said, you already have to do this, since you can't have every single profession at once anyway.

    I'd never buy the enhancements for a profession that my character has, then I'd buy the recipe (like I could before), then sell the enhancements to recoup the cost. Can't do that now, either.
    But that's your decision. I understand and agree with that sentiment, but that still doesn't make the mandatory.

    If you want to make goodies yourself, you have to do some dailies. If you don't want to, then you have to get the pieces somewhere else. It's a reasonable tradeoff. If the situation was that if you didn't grind the rep yourself you couldn't get those items at all because they were BoP, then I'd concede that that "choice" isn't really a choice. But the difference between asking a guildmate or being self-sufficient is fairly minor.
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  20. #100
    well in reply to your post title, most likly because this is a GAME it should not feel like a job, or work or whatever it is meant to be fun to play, im sorry but if I get home from a 12 hour day and want to chill out with some wow I dont want to feel like Im back at work just on my pc......nuff said.

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