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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    So, they want a Boss where you need to move constantly?

    Oh yeah, Affli Lock fight.
    That's hunter fight.

    Maybe he meant 15 seconds long fight? Perfect duration for Ascendance.
    Next tier will have 6-7 bosses. What are the odds we won't get one that "is great for ele"?

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by mlodgor View Post
    That's hunter fight.

    Maybe he meant 15 seconds long fight? Perfect duration for Ascendance.
    Next tier will have 6-7 bosses. What are the odds we won't get one that "is great for ele"?
    Ele would have been good on Spine now

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by mlodgor View Post
    That's hunter fight.

    Maybe he meant 15 seconds long fight? Perfect duration for Ascendance.
    Next tier will have 6-7 bosses. What are the odds we won't get one that "is great for ele"?
    Sorry, Balance Druids have greater Burst.

    Our Balance Druids go close to 400k Burst Dps during Pulls with Bl, i'm just hitting 300k.

    Next Tier will be more like Ulduar style, so expect at least 10 Bosses, this statement is still pretty weird.

    Let's say there is a fight where Ele performs great, is being awesome on a single fight a justification for being below average on the rest?
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2012-12-20 at 12:13 PM.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  4. #144
    Dreadlord zenga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enaina View Post
    Ele would have been good on Spine now
    Ele was actually pretty good on spine hc, at least better than most classes (not at the level of arcane mages and sub rogues ofc,). EM was up for every burn phase and chain lightning / earthquake was awesome for controlled blop burning.

  5. #145
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    Not sure if this was mentioned before, but I think an easy fix for secondary stat scaling would be doing something similar to warlock's Chaos Bolt with our LvB: the more crit chance % the more damage done.

    What do you guys think?
    Quote Originally Posted by Lao_tzu View Post
    Ele Shams were sith lords before it was cool

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeeper View Post
    Not sure if this was mentioned before, but I think an easy fix for secondary stat scaling would be doing something similar to warlock's Chaos Bolt with our LvB: the more crit chance % the more damage done.

    What do you guys think?
    I'd rather have sustained damage buffed. Lightning bolt buff or old fashioned shamanism buff

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeeper View Post
    Not sure if this was mentioned before, but I think an easy fix for secondary stat scaling would be doing something similar to warlock's Chaos Bolt with our LvB: the more crit chance % the more damage done.

    What do you guys think?
    Would probably make crit better than haste and mastery but it's really LB which need a buff not LvB.

  8. #148
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Folks, a "good fight for Ele" does not have to mean "a fight that's better for Ele than anyone else and which will ensure we are the top DPS for that fight". That isn't what GC said, so stop maligning him for what you're twisting his actual words into.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Folks, a "good fight for Ele" does not have to mean "a fight that's better for Ele than anyone else and which will ensure we are the top DPS for that fight". That isn't what GC said, so stop maligning him for what you're twisting his actual words into.
    Then enlighten me please which fight is good for Elemental.

    On Movement fights you are pretty much in the middle, Warlocks & Hunters will shine there because they can continue with their rotations.
    Arcane Mage, Sp and Balance suck there.

    Elemental is great compared to Arcane / Sp / Balance but weak compared to Warlock / Hunter.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2012-12-20 at 03:02 PM.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  10. #150
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Then enlighten me please which fight is good for Elemental.

    On Movement fights you are pretty much in the middle, Warlocks & Hunters will shine there because they can continue with their rotations.
    Arcane Mage, Sp and Balance suck there.

    Elemental is great compared to Arcane / Sp / Balance but weak compared to Warlock / Hunter.
    Which would mean it's a good fight for Ele.

    Again; you are changing the comment from "a great fight for Ele" to "a fight where Ele outperforms literally everyone else". That's not what GC said. A high mobility fight that wasn't friendly to melee would be a good fight for Elemental. It might be an even better fight for locks and hunters, but that doesn't change that it's still a good fight for Elemental.

    GC says enough silly things that you don't need to invent stuff to claim he said.

  11. #151
    Eh, he used "great", if he meant "decent" he should have and probably would have used "decent".

    I suspect he doesn't entirely realize that there is only one fight that ele would be great at... and that's a boss with shared health pool with 4 other dudes that need to stand near him all fight.

    Overall I think our tools are good, there are a lot of things you can do as elemental that help the raid. Simple stuff like glyphing thunderstorm on emperor and Tsing every rage pair after you earthbind them. But... perception is reality and for most perception is recount.
    The most successful tyranny is not the one that uses force to assure uniformity but the one that removes the awareness of other possibilities.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Which would mean it's a good fight for Ele.

    Again; you are changing the comment from "a great fight for Ele" to "a fight where Ele outperforms literally everyone else". That's not what GC said. A high mobility fight that wasn't friendly to melee would be a good fight for Elemental. It might be an even better fight for locks and hunters, but that doesn't change that it's still a good fight for Elemental.

    GC says enough silly things that you don't need to invent stuff to claim he said.
    In my view, a good fight is if you are able to pull good numbers compared to any class, not just classes which simply suck under certain conditions.

    Not talking about being uncontested nr.1, talking about being able to pull similiar numbers, which would not be case because you get outdps'd already by affli Locks and Hunters in a Patchwerk situation.


    Quote Originally Posted by oblivionx View Post
    Eh, he used "great", if he meant "decent" he should have and probably would have used "decent".

    I suspect he doesn't entirely realize that there is only one fight that ele would be great at... and that's a boss with shared health pool with 4 other dudes that need to stand near him all fight.
    There are a few "decent" fights for Elemental in this tier, Mel'jarak is decent not because of Cl but decent burst for those 30sec Phases

    Also, from i've seen so far, Cl gets outperformed by multidotting, no matter if used for cleave or AoE, given enough time.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2012-12-20 at 04:38 PM.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  13. #153
    Pandaren Monk Evela's Avatar
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    You seem to keep quoting GC. Looked through the thread, can't find the link. Anyone mind sharing?

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 06:01 PM ----------

    Ah found it. That's absurd. Makes me want to reroll, to be honest.

  14. #154
    Every time i log in to MMO and i see a new GC twitter I always facepalm.

    That latest twitter is just stupid. If so few bosses are great for ele, maybe ele isn't that great?
    and maybe all those classes for whom the bosses are great, are maybe great classes?

    this makes sense,

    what he says makes as much sense as comparing disarming a mage with silencing an enhancer... oh wait :X

    And what is supposed to be a great fight? A CL spam cleave fest? boooooorrringg...
    just do what's right and buff shamanism like you've always done, but plz don't add a fff'in bandaid fix in our next tier bonus :F

  15. #155
    Sigh, the one tier I decide to switch to elemental , enhancement is awesome.

    On topic : Shamanism buff does seem like the way to go, I don't want any retarded set bonus buffs or bandaid fixes
    Hatred the Fearless.

  16. #156
    Dreadlord zenga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voltage View Post
    On topic : Shamanism buff does seem like the way to go, I don't want any retarded set bonus buffs or bandaid fixes
    The more because in pvp the damage is low as well, a shamanism buff would help out there as well.

  17. #157
    Moderator Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voltage View Post
    Sigh, the one tier I decide to switch to elemental , enhancement is awesome.

    On topic : Shamanism buff does seem like the way to go, I don't want any retarded set bonus buffs or bandaid fixes
    Besides which, Shamanism is one of the spec bonuses they added to the game specifically to create tuning knobs that they could use to tweak specs independently of each other.

    Complaining because they tweaked Shamanism again totally misses that the entire POINT of Shamanism is to make something they can tweak that only affects Elemental.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Complaining because they tweaked Shamanism again totally misses that the entire POINT of Shamanism is to make something they can tweak that only affects Elemental.
    I think many would be happy for them to turn the shamanism nob again if it was down for once, hahaha.
    The most successful tyranny is not the one that uses force to assure uniformity but the one that removes the awareness of other possibilities.

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Complaining because they tweaked Shamanism again totally misses that the entire POINT of Shamanism is to make something they can tweak that only affects Elemental.
    The Problem about buffing Shamanism in the past was, that it never solved this dmg problem completely.

    It went often like:
    Shamanism gets buffed Ele dps is good
    6 Weeks later everyone got new Gear, Ele is in the same spot as before the buff.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    The Problem about buffing Shamanism in the past was, that it never solved this dmg problem completely.

    It went often like:
    Shamanism gets buffed Ele dps is good
    6 Weeks later everyone got new Gear, Ele is in the same spot as before the buff.
    yup it keeps getting buffed, but if its so easy like that, why haven't they buffed it like 5% already? either buff shamanism asap, or give us some real long term changes, a ridiculous tier bonus, perma fire ele like firelands works for 1 tier, then leaves us shit for dragon soul....WITH a legendary.......that was quite retarded.

    issue i have with shamanism is if its such a easy way to change ele, why does it take MONTHS to adjust it? surely it could be done by tomorrow with a hotfix unless they actually plan to add something rotation changing in 5.2 which i doubt.

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