33% Nerf to Chaos Wave Damage

[Deleted]

Yeah, I love the justifications. Something could be instant cast and deal one million damage, and people will still say, "Oh, you're a noob if you get hit by that, all you gotta do is xyz all the time."

Wait you mean you wouldn't be able to bubble/iceblock/LoS a 1 million damage cast in an arena setting reliably? Are you noob?

No but really. It's what I always say. People seem to always love using the whole "avoid y ability by doing x" argument like it actually means something in an arena environment.

[Enderan]

Correct!

What are we supposed to do now? Damage is piss poor for 2 minutes, then is good (not great) for 20 seconds, then is in the dirt again. Wonderful!

Whaaaaaa, let me drink your tears for a second. This is the exact thing rets. Deal with it like we have and don't start making a pity party for yourselves when you have been able to global people for months now, as you will find no sympathy here.

[Malgru]

Has Chaos Bolt changed since release? Anyone know?

[Nicola]

Has Chaos Bolt changed since release? Anyone know?

Yes, it went from pretty useless against good players to totally useless. The extra damage from grimoire of sacrifice is a dot now.

[Phoenexis]

Warlock

• Demonology
  • The damage and Demonic Fury cost of Chaos Wave have been reduced by 33%. The new values will not be reflected in the tooltip until a client patch.

About time?

A change that doesn't affect PvE and helps balance PvP. My only question is: Why did it take so long?


Changes like this should've been shifted with MoP release or hell, even changed while on beta. Chaos Bolt, 5 stacked TfB HS, Frost Bomb, Stampede and Chaos Wave were all hitting too hard on beta and Blizzard knew this. Stampede, HS and Chaos Wave have all been toned down but weeks into an already in progress season and they have attempted to rework Frost but ended up changing nothing at all.

Why should I spend one minute doing shit damage to then do as much burst as another spec that can mindlessly pop its cooldowns from the start while having better sustained DPS? Answer this question and I will be pleased. Yes it's unbalanced to be able to do so much damage, regardless of the constraints, but it's just unfair that Destruction and Demonology find themselves in a one trick pony that requires much more ramp-up than any other spec. Difference betwween previous ret paladin design and current Warlock design is that Ret paladins never needed so much ramp-up, although they did rely a lot on Wings and did shit damage outside of them.

[Malgru]

Yes, it went from pretty useless against good players to totally useless. The extra damage from grimoire of sacrifice is a dot now.

whats the highest you've seen it crit since then? I'm not sure whether or not to run double destro in RBGs anymore

[Nicola]

whats the highest you've seen it crit since then? I'm not sure whether or not to run double destro in RBGs anymore

Nowadays, without zerker and full malovent, chances you'll see a crit above 150k is rather low.
Honestly, I don't see why to bring a reason to bring warlocks to rbg now. You are way better off bringing mages and shadowpriests instead of warlocks now. They bring more sustained damage, more pressure and are way deadlier than any warlock spec is right now.

EDIT: just gonna leave this here, but I feel like the nerf is actually 50% instead of 33%.
I can barely hit for 75k, with zerkerbuff, critting 150k...
Sure, 150k crit is nice, except the fact I can hit that high only twice every 2min and the rest of the game, my chaoswave, and everything else I have hits like a wet noodle. Without cooldowns nor zerker, my strongest spell crits for about 60k.
A 10% chance to crit 60k every 15 seconds is the most amazing thing that has ever happened to a warlock /sarcasm.

[Crimsonfiend76]

No but really, just play affliction. It's not horrible, and they'll have to buff it soon, I've seen rank 1 warlocks that refused to play demo because it was filthy stream it at decent ratings (2300+) and it still works to a certain extent. You just won't be 1 shotting shit.

yes, because i cant wait to go back to cata, where afflic was the ONLY viable class to do anything as a lock. /endsarcasm. so nice to see all the love locks got this expac, being overhauled and redesigned for what? to revert back to what 'worked' last expac?

[Malgru]

i think you're underestimating affliction tbh. I've seen two or three top 20mil in one game, where they actually compete with a frost dk on damage.

[Nicola]

i think you're underestimating affliction tbh. I've seen two or three top 20mil in one game, where they actually compete with a frost dk on damage.

Yes, that's in battlegrounds like AV where they are mindless dotting everything on sight. However what you don't know about affliction is that they bring zero pressure nowadays because of how little damage the dots actually do without MG and because of how strong healers are.
I played affliction at the begin of the season before switching to destruction, and then to demonology. Having played all 3 specs at 2.4k+ rating this season in both rbg and arena I know what I'm talking about when I say that warlocks are not viable anymore until healers and several other classes are nerfed..

[Malgru]

Yes, that's in battlegrounds like AV where they are mindless dotting everything on sight. However what you don't know about affliction is that they bring zero pressure nowadays because of how little damage the dots actually do without MG and because of how strong healers are.
I played affliction at the begin of the season before switching to destruction, and then to demonology. Having played all 3 specs at 2.4k+ rating this season in both rbg and arena I know what I'm talking about when I say that warlocks are not viable anymore until healers and several other classes are nerfed..

Care to link armory? And I'm pretty sure AV isnt an RBG

[Gangresnake]

whats the highest you've seen it crit since then? I'm not sure whether or not to run double destro in RBGs anymore

Burst crit around 150k+25% Dot in PvP, worthless

i think you're underestimating affliction tbh. I've seen two or three top 20mil in one game, where they actually compete with a frost dk on damage.

That's the point, affliction is predictable, immobile and vulnerable to dispel and kick, and they dont even do more damage than Frost DK, the spec is garbage

Edit : About RBG, affliction is pretty fine imo

[Nicola]

Care to link armory? And I'm pretty sure AV isnt an RBG

Looks like a misunderstanding, forgot we were talking about rated bgs lol...
Armory

[Stormspellz]

i think you're underestimating affliction tbh. I've seen two or three top 20mil in one game, where they actually compete with a frost dk on damage.

frost dks and affliction essentially pad the damage meters with cleave dot damage that is healed with a dps passive healing in other words its not the real story while a frost mages damage is nearly all effective damage

[kosechi]

if people think raw damage is all that warlocks bring to arena they are sorely mistaken.

[Tyrean]

frost dks and affliction essentially pad the damage meters with cleave dot damage that is healed with a dps passive healing in other words its not the real story while a frost mages damage is nearly all effective damage

That's also not the real story. The benefit of classes like Frost DKs is the ability to create switch targets. If your healers are being controlled decently and you are making them choose between 2-3 players to heal then someone will be vulnerable to switches at low health. Frost DKs are monsters at this because they will be 100% damage on main target with the benefit of splash damage on other targets that creates vulnerable switches.

Think of Frost DKs, Affliction Locks, Boomkins, Fire Mages, etc in an RBG as if you were playing RLS in arena. The lock spreads the damage around to give the rogue opportunity to pick his target based on who is closest, out of position, etc instead of calling hard switches all the time.

[Nicola]

if people think raw damage is all that warlocks bring to arena they are sorely mistaken.

Yes, they bring (pretty shitty )cc, health stones and a gateway which was useless until 5.1.
Honestly, I rather have a shadowpriest or a frost/fire mage instead of a warlock now. Superior cc, bring more buffs and more damage.

That's also not the real story. The benefit of classes like Frost DKs is the ability to create switch targets. If your healers are being controlled decently and you are making them choose between 2-3 players to heal then someone will be vulnerable to switches at low health. Frost DKs are monsters at this because they will be 100% damage on main target with the benefit of splash damage on other targets that creates vulnerable switches.

Think of Frost DKs, Affliction Locks, Boomkins, Fire Mages, etc in an RBG as if you were playing RLS in arena. The lock spreads the damage around to give the rogue opportunity to pick his target based on who is closest, out of position, etc instead of calling hard switches all the time.

Except that affliction warlocks boomkins, and even frost dks have no real pressure going on at all when spreading dots compared to unholy dks, firemages and shadowpriests.
Sure it does some damage, but not enough to actually make other targets viable to switch onto.

[klaps_05]

the only problem is that the changes to warriors/mages/hunters/locks/sps/shamans werent applied BEFORE the reset. so now again you have incredibly inflated ladders and have to wait months for them to get straights and all the shitters that got carried by fotms to clear out and go to their appropriate rating.

chaos wave wasnt nerfed until now because it took pvp weapons and tons of pvp power(which eventually becomes available to all, i dont mean its hard to get) for it to hit for fucktons.

[Malgru]

Looks like a misunderstanding, forgot we were talking about rated bgs lol...
Armory

thanks. just wanted to make sure you weren't shooting info out of your ass

[kosechi]

Yes, they bring (pretty shitty )cc, health stones and a gateway which was useless until 5.1.
Honestly, I rather have a shadowpriest or a frost/fire mage instead of a warlock now. Superior cc, bring more buffs and more damage.

lol. lock cc. shitty. thats a first.

Except that affliction warlocks boomkins, and even frost dks have no real pressure going on at all when spreading dots compared to unholy dks, firemages and shadowpriests.
Sure it does some damage, but not enough to actually make other targets viable to switch onto.

when exactly was the last time you saw an UHdk? or a fire mage?