You can call specific examples selfish (I don't want the child, I just want to party), but you don't get to call the act of abortion selfish.
It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere.
Besides which, there's a fairly straightforward fashion for men to mitigate this risk - use contraceptives and sleep with women that you're reasonably confident don't want children.
There are just as many counter-arguments from that side as there are arguments from yours.
But again, you're going off on the whole "x party forces y party to do z" instead of, you know, some form of actual rational compromise.
Noone should be able to DECLINE an abortion if the other party wants it.
If the woman can have the baby then ask for child support when the man didn't want it then yes a man should have equal rights in deciding to keep it or not.
Really, you should make this view clear to any woman that's thinking about sleeping with you. Make good and sure that they're aware you desire to control them.
--- Want any of my Constitutional rights?, ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
I come from a time and a place where I judge people by the content of their character; I don't give a damn if you are tall or short; gay or straight; Jew or Gentile; White, Black, Brown or Green; Conservative or Liberal.
It's the woman's body, not the man's. So, no. Although, the woman should be considerate to the man and not, say, sneak behind his back when he wants the kid to abort it, you should at least give them a heads up.
Also I could see a man abusing his right to a woman having an abortion by guilt tripping them into getting it/not getting it. I agree a man should have a say in if he wants to be a father or not, if he doesn't want to pay child support he shouldn't have to. (Of course with some restrictions, like, if a father is involved with a kid, then just one day drops out without saying anything)
That to me is more fair than having a man have the right to say a woman should get an abortion, legally.
Last edited by Digglett; 2012-12-05 at 02:07 AM.
It's a rather binary situation. It's unfair to the father if he has no say but it's also unfair to the mother if the father has any say.
Bergtau's Law: As an online discussion grows longer, the probability that somebody will mention Godwin's Law approaches 1.
Hitler wasn't all bad, I mean, he DID kill Hitler.
An accident is something that you did not mean to do at all. A mistake is something that you regret doing.
Yes, the father should have some say, if it wasn't for him, the baby wouldn't be being made. However, the father should only be able to stop the abortion if he signs legally-binding contracts that would make it to where he would pay for everything, help alleviate any inconveniences faced by the mother because of the pregnancy and birth, and take custody of the child after it is born. Making it to where, while the mother still had a lot of say, if the father was completely determined on having the child, he still could. And yes, I think it is fair for the mother to give up the right to abort if the father does/accepts to do what I listed above. Regardless of whether it is her body or not, it is partly the father's child and the father should have some say whether the child is born or not. Even if it means going to great lengths, ie signing many legal contracts, etc to secure the child's birth, I think a father who is that determined to see the child born, should be able to.
And no, the argument I made, is not based off of religious ("insert word of your choice", mine is stuff, since it still abides by the rules of this forum and isn't bashful), it is based off of my view of equality.
Last edited by Hastings; 2012-12-05 at 02:06 AM.
"Then we have found, as it seems, that the many beliefs of the many about what's fair and about the other things roll around somewhere between not-being and being purely and simply." - Plato: Republic
---------- Post added 2012-12-04 at 09:06 PM ----------
Of course he should. It is HIS baby too.