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  1. #1

    Remove dark soul, buff our other spells

    Current gameplay for any lock spec: Tickle your opponent while you build up shards/embers/fury so you can pop Dark Soul and hope to global someone, which after the nerfs is mostly no longer possible, leaving us in a very bad spot. An idea I saw on the official forums, how about Dark Soul is simply removed and our other spells are buffed to compensate?

  2. #2
    The Unstoppable Force N-aix's Avatar
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    Okay then this happens again

    - Chaos wave and chaos bolt are now back to pre-nerfed state
    - WHINEEE WHINE WHINE WHINE WHINE
    - kay well revert it back to Dark soul sry warlocks

  3. #3
    So leave Chaos Wave and Chaos Bolt as they are now, buff everything else.

  4. #4
    How about they stop messing with my class! Either buff it or leave it alone im tired of adjusting every patch
    I play many games. WoW, Rift, D3, PoE, SC2 I will not criticize your game choice if you don't mine.

  5. #5
    Dreadlord Forgottenone's Avatar
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    No, I enjoying popping Dark Soul and doing awesome damage. If you go on the root you want why not remove Recklessness? Icy Veins? Avenging Wrath? Dark Soul is our main offensive cooldown for PvE and PvP. If you remove it and buff other spells you might as well do that to every other class.

    Would be better to rework broken spells such as Chaos Wave and then just buff other spells accordingly.

  6. #6
    Here's an idea, stop balancing a game that was created for PvE around its shitty PvP.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Teye View Post
    Here's an idea, stop balancing a game that was created for PvE around its shitty PvP.
    Alternatively, just make some abilities function based on being flagged or not flagged. There is no reason for PVP to suffer when nerfing for PVE, or for PVE to suffer when nerfing for PVP.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Iry View Post
    Alternatively, just make some abilities function based on being flagged or not flagged. There is no reason for PVP to suffer when nerfing for PVE, or for PVE to suffer when nerfing for PVP.
    this would work so well that Blizz risks to have a game perfectly balanced causing a huge amount of mages quitting the game, so a huge loss of subs :P :P :P

  9. #9
    Just remove MG and give us old Haunt/SB back with proper damage from dots. This solves everything.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Ripley6174 View Post
    Current gameplay for any lock spec: Tickle your opponent while you build up shards/embers/fury so you can pop Dark Soul and hope to global someone, which after the nerfs is mostly no longer possible, leaving us in a very bad spot. An idea I saw on the official forums, how about Dark Soul is simply removed and our other spells are buffed to compensate?
    No. Dark Soul is a killer dps cd that is useful in pvp and pve. I love it.
    Perfect example of why "community" forums are poisonous to the health of a development team. These developers are wasting hundreds of hours trying to stem the tide of incessant bitchery that would never, ever abate so long as these entitled, unfortunate human beings don't get their way.

  11. #11
    High Overlord
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    Just no. They would balance it for pve sustained. Instead of doing 80k dps 5/6 of the time and 100k dps 1/6 of the time, we would always do like 84k dps all the time. This whole xpac was designed around burst pvp. We need it. So instead of tickling most of the time and punching sometimes, we would just be poking them all the time if it was removed.

    Those numbers were just random btw :P
    Why is there no "Demonhunter" hero class yet? He was only the coolest hero in WC3. Get busy Blizzard.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    Just remove MG and give us old Haunt/SB back with proper damage from dots. This solves everything.
    No. Then we're back at pre mop affliction. That would be a step back. MG is amazing. This is a pve game. Here's all they need to do. Massively buff the dispell damage from UA. Buff execute from drain soul against players. And change MG school with a glyph.
    Perfect example of why "community" forums are poisonous to the health of a development team. These developers are wasting hundreds of hours trying to stem the tide of incessant bitchery that would never, ever abate so long as these entitled, unfortunate human beings don't get their way.

  13. #13
    Although I think this is the wrong way to go, to compensate for the loss of DS, Blizzard would no doubt go the easy route with a massive amount on buffing to each specs major spells.

    CB
    MG
    ToC (NOT CW!)

    Each of these would result in a PvE imbalance and would cause (As Apathy pointed out above) Waah Waah Waah. And we'd be hit with the nerf bat again.

    Now, that's not to say I don't think re-adjusting Dark Soul is a smart move (It isn't comparable - especially Demo - with Wings / Icy / Etc due to the MASSIVE push, not static 20%) but if it was changed to a flat 20% damage like the others, we could possibly have more damage baked in. This could probably be put into some of the more lack-luster things we have at the moment (DoT's / Pet damage for non demo / and the like) which wouldn't bring us back into the "Global trololol" that everything seems to think Lock has been for the last few weeks while not making PvE "massively" buffed that we suddenly become way over the top


    *edit* And to those saying they like having the big PUSH ME NOW!! button...you realise it is the route of our current PvP issues right? As everyone and their dog has it macro'd to their on-use trinket for a stupid big jump in damage
    Last edited by Telila; 2012-12-06 at 08:18 AM.

  14. #14
    Dreadlord kushlol's Avatar
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    I feel they should remove doomguard and give us a new 3 or 5min cooldown.....doomguard is very buggy and unreliable on some encounters and a 10min cd for the damage it does is just absurd.

    Made by dubbelbasse

  15. #15
    Mechagnome Sweetz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nekrosislol View Post
    How about they stop messing with my class! Either buff it or leave it alone im tired of adjusting every patch
    This.

    Removing Dark Soul would significantly reduce our skillcap in PVE AND PVP. Timing your cooldowns is a part of the game, get used to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by kushlol View Post
    I feel they should remove doomguard and give us a new 3 or 5min cooldown.....doomguard is very buggy and unreliable on some encounters and a 10min cd for the damage it does is just absurd.
    Worse still, it doesn't always reset on wipes inspite of being supposed to.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Ripley6174 View Post
    Current gameplay for any lock spec: Tickle your opponent while you build up shards/embers/fury so you can pop Dark Soul and hope to global someone, which after the nerfs is mostly no longer possible, leaving us in a very bad spot. An idea I saw on the official forums, how about Dark Soul is simply removed and our other spells are buffed to compensate?
    Holy shit no, it took two expansions to get the damn thing. The days of "Blow you cooldowns!" "Urgh I don't have any. " Were bad. Really bad.

  17. #17
    A good compromise would be to make DS 1min CD(before 4set) and the numbers tuned ofc.
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  18. #18
    Mechagnome Kildragon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ripley6174 View Post
    Current gameplay for any lock spec: Tickle your opponent while you build up shards/embers/fury so you can pop Dark Soul and hope to global someone, which after the nerfs is mostly no longer possible, leaving us in a very bad spot. An idea I saw on the official forums, how about Dark Soul is simply removed and our other spells are buffed to compensate?
    Bad idea. One of the biggest complaints I've been seeing from my SPriest friends is that Blizz took away all of their burst CD's. I also remember trying to burst something back in Wrath, when the only CD we had was trinket. It wasn't very fun and there's no reason to return to that approach.

    The reason we can only tickle people right now without CD's is because of the way healing works. Healing is too strong, so any damage outside of your 3-4 second burst window with CD's up is wasted.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 02:35 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    Just remove MG and give us old Haunt/SB back with proper damage from dots. This solves everything.
    This doesn't solve anything. I can guarantee you that putting a lvl 90 Affliction Lock with Cata mechanics into an arena would result in absolute shit results. It would be completely pointless and you'd cry more than ever before.

    Healers just dispel your UA cause the silence doesn't matter with the new dispels? Well what did you expect, he can get all of your DoTs in one GCD and there goes your damage. Burst him while he's silenced? Fel Flame spam, yay. Reapply all your DoTs, go go. 4 seconds later you got your DoTs back up, his dispel is already almost off CD, damn it.

    Oh so you want to be able to still have Soulburn Soulswap? Well sure, but you get three uses per game, unless you kill something. You mean old Soul Shard mechanics don't work now since we don't have Soul Harvest and such? So what do you want then? Old mechanics or new? Anyways, back in the game.

    Now to the burst part. Arenas right now are all about burst. Rotting a team doesn't work, period. Remember how much burst we had back then? Oh that's right, close to none. Haunt hit for shit and you never used Shadowbolt. Fel Flame also did shit damage, so yay for Fel Flame spam. Did you kill something yet? Nope? Damn shame! I thought you had a shot when you got him to 50%.

    So you say you want to try rotting the other team anyways? Everyone is at 50%, feels good huh? Oh no, you're sitting in a full fear and your team mate is stunned. Those 5 seconds just let the healer top his entire team off with ease. His mana pool must be going? Nope, the other team has half a brain and knows how to CC to create breathing room for the healer. He just got 30% of his mana pool back since you couldn't dispel your DPS with that damn 8 second CD.

    Congratulations, you just got replaced by a Shadow Priest since he can at least kill shit and has some burst. Oh you were on a Shadowplay team? He just replaced you with a Boomkin since even those damn lazer turkeys have more burst than you.

    But in all seriousness, you can't just throw old mechanics back into a spec that's not designed like that anymore. People bitch that we have MG and Haunt now. We had Haunt back then, but also this lovely thing called Shadow Embrace that you probably chose to forget about. How do you solve the Soul Shard issue? The spec back then was built around Soul Shards being a limited resource that can't be regenerated in combat. With the new system and Haunt not using Soul Shards, our Soul Shard utility would have to get nerfed since we can't have something as strong as SB: SW with Soul Shards not being used for anything else.

    You can't just put SB/Haunt back in the game without redesigning the spec. We'd lose all of our burst again. People seem to forget that Affliction isn't played the same way anymore. We actually have burst now, Haunt hits like a truck and channeling MG does pretty good damage. Back then it was ALL Fel Flame and Drain Life spam. Oh and if you didn't have a problem with channeling Drain Life, stop bitching about channeling MG. At least MG allows you get some benefit from it if you cancel it to juke midway through.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 02:36 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Last Starfighter View Post
    No. Then we're back at pre mop affliction. That would be a step back. MG is amazing. This is a pve game. Here's all they need to do. Massively buff the dispell damage from UA. Buff execute from drain soul against players. And change MG school with a glyph.
    They don't even need to change Affliction to make it useful in Arenas. They need to change healing. As soon as we move away from burst being the ONLY viable option to killing something Affliction will be in a much better spot. Especially since we now have the option to burst, just not in the 3-4 second window that is required right now.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    A good compromise would be to make DS 1min CD(before 4set) and the numbers tuned ofc.
    Change DS to give us mastery or something on a 3 min CD and give us Eradication back. That way the DoT pressure becomes stronger and more frequent like Spriests and their 3x orb DP. I've never been a big fan of DS being a haste CD tbh.

  20. #20
    Mechagnome Kildragon's Avatar
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    *edit* And to those saying they like having the big PUSH ME NOW!! button...you realise it is the route of our current PvP issues right? As everyone and their dog has it macro'd to their on-use trinket for a stupid big jump in damage
    False, CD's are not the reason PvP is the way it is right now. If they were, PvP would have always been this way, since CD's have been in the game since it was launched. The problem right now is stacking too many CD's for too much burst and that approach being the only viable way to play. Affliction is fine with CD's because it does a lot of damage but not all in one ability. That's why they nerfed CW and the CB + GoSac burst. Too much burst in too short a window.

    I honestly think Demo will still be fine in arenas since ToC does a lot of damage with CD's up. It's my preferred way of playing anyways and it's how Demo was meant to be played. I still wish they would reduce the cast time on Shadowbolt to let us actually cast in PvP, but that will never happen.

    Destro is fine right now, and would be great if CB wasn't the ONLY way to kill something. Reduce burst healing and Destro has a shot.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 02:50 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by kushlol View Post
    I feel they should remove doomguard and give us a new 3 or 5min cooldown.....doomguard is very buggy and unreliable on some encounters and a 10min cd for the damage it does is just absurd.
    Please, I hate our guardian CD's. They do pathetic damage, they cause us to be balanced around them in PvE, and we can't even use them in arenas. I'm not even sure why they can't be used in Arenas, especially since they aren't game breaking like Lay on Hands. An Infernal in an arena match might provide that tiny extra CC needed, but its damage is pathetic. DG can't swap targets and is brain dead when it comes to adjusting to LoS.

    Anyways, please remove those CDs or just lower the CD to 5 minutes, cut the damage in half and let us use them.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 02:51 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Hellfury View Post
    A good compromise would be to make DS 1min CD(before 4set) and the numbers tuned ofc.
    This would give us 100% uptime on the damn thing, which would mean we might as well not have it at all. They would balance our numbers around that in PvE and PvP would suffer. No thanks.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-06 at 02:57 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    Change DS to give us mastery or something on a 3 min CD and give us Eradication back. That way the DoT pressure becomes stronger and more frequent like Spriests and their 3x orb DP. I've never been a big fan of DS being a haste CD tbh.
    The only reason they did that is because people wanted spec specific Dark Souls instead of having them tied to pets. I actually really like the way they work right now and I don't understand why people want to change DS. We finally have a CD that's worth two shits and you want to get rid of it or change it? It's plenty strong for Affliction and actually plays into the new strengths of the spec in regards to burst.

    I do like the idea of adding Eradication back in, just perhaps with a new effect: Your Unstable Affliction ticks have X% chance to cause your next MG to have 50% reduced channeling time.

    This would spice the spec up a bit and it wouldn't feel too bad in PvE either. The DPS gain from it would also be minor in PvE over the course of a fight, but it would be great for some extra burst in PvP.

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