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  1. #21
    The Lightbringer Vellerix's Avatar
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    They'd probably gain a lot more customers if they allowed M + KB support. Alot of people use the controller as their soul reason why they won't play FPS on console.

  2. #22
    I think the main reason is accessibility, control pads are much simpler and don't require you to be hunched over a desk, also if you include kb/mouse support when the majority use a control pad, that would simply create an unfair advantage, because the mouse is vastly more pin point accurate than analogue sticks.

    how would you do something like this, if you plug in a kb/mouse it removes the aim assist? i don't think that would cover the advantage.

    maybe one day but this is the sort of thing they would have to include with the whole console package and not simply a standalone peripheral you need to actually buy separate. at least that way ppl have the choice, but i still don't think there will ever be fair ground when your talking kb/mouse vs control pad.

    this is the sort of discussion that really delves into the whos and whys of gaming, why do ppl play console instead of getting a beefy gaming pc.. for the most part it works as it is, if you want easy accessible gaming with minimal effort while being able to armchair it up, you get a console, if you want to expand on that, you opt for the gaming pc.. tbh who has a console and doesn't have a pc these days. if your really into gaming, you'll do yourself justice and get a pc.

    in all honesty i would play more console FPS's if i could use a mouse/kb setup, i really dislike the aim assist and blocky movements you get with the pads. but conversely they work great for platformers and 3rd person games like GTA.

    there is also the fact that control schemes don't simply map from one to the other, pc gamers i think are used to having extra features in their games, when you trying to navigate crappy menus with a kb/mouse you'll just end up plugging the control pad back in, and realizing things like Q and E don't exist as a lean feature in console fps's. cod is a good example, in the pc cods you can lean around corners, i'm not sure if they gave that same feature to console yet but last time i checked it wasn't in there. only a simple difference but a difference all the same.
    Last edited by Heathy; 2012-12-06 at 05:41 PM.

  3. #23
    I got this one folks:

    ahem...

    Here's a brief outline of why they "don't" do peripheral support for mouse/keyboard

    1) They DO have mouse/keyboard support... especially since the PS3 is USB based connections. One reason nobody supports it is because it's a peripheral... by definition not everybody has one, and they focus on are what people do HAVE that comes with the system when you purchase it - and that is a controller.

    2) Here's a big one nobody considers... why? Because the PC gaming market is damn-near non-existant in Japan. Hell, World of Warcraft isn't even out there... simply because there's no market for it. Japan, for some reason, has not adopted to PC gaming - they see the home computer and video games as two totally separate things, and have done so since the Famicom (ironically short for "Family computer"). Japan is a HUGE market for console gaming, so why make a system that totally alienates 1/2, if not MORE, of your market?

    3) As others have said... keyboard/mouse require flat surfaces and being hunched over even a table. Console gaming lets me recline into my EZ chair and relax while playing. Even if you put a plank of wood accross the EZ chair and play, you're still having your heads wide-apart and hitting all sorts of buttons/options. One console developer I know interviews potential new development staff and hits them with unusual questions: One of which is "What is the optimal number of useable buttons for a Video Game?" The answer? is ONE or NONE. Their idea is simple... SIMPLIFY the game experience. The more it's simplified, the less convoluted it becomes to average Q gamer looking for just some simple action, not an in-depth mind-taxing life simulator.
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  4. #24
    The problem is, your 'probably' is more than likely trying to work against their 'market research'. I admit I'm not in possession of any hard evidence, so don't take what I say as fact, but if there was money to be made in supplying an official keyboard+mouse, and it didn't cost more to support the devices than they get from sales of the devices and the increased customer base, then they'd be doing it. So my thoughts on the matter are that there aren't _enough_ people to make it worth their while. Halo hasn't suffered much by _only_ (insofar as being years ahead of a PC launch) being available on a machine using a controller.

    That's what you're working against.

  5. #25
    Dreadlord Brightamethyst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tenaka30 View Post
    The point you should take from this is that Sony/Microsoft already support the devices and you should be asking why the games developers don't. They are the reason the items aren't used.
    This.

    The PS3 and 360 have keyboard support. There just aren't many (any?) games that take advantage of it.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    One console developer I know interviews potential new development staff and hits them with unusual questions: One of which is "What is the optimal number of useable buttons for a Video Game?" The answer? is ONE or NONE. Their idea is simple... SIMPLIFY the game experience. The more it's simplified, the less convoluted it becomes to average Q gamer looking for just some simple action, not an in-depth mind-taxing life simulator.
    That explains a lot of shitty games since the right answer is actually 2 , A for jump, B for shooting ^^

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Heathy View Post

    how would you do something like this, if you plug in a kb/mouse it removes the aim assist? i don't think that would cover the advantage.

    in all honesty i would play more console FPS's if i could use a mouse/kb setup, i really dislike the aim assist and blocky movements you get with the pads. but conversely they work great for platformers and 3rd person games like GTA.
    This is the same reason why you don't get cross platform FPS multiplayer. PC gamers would thrash console gamers. (It was tested using XBOX/Windows live and Halo)

  8. #28
    we might even end up using a completely new control system soon, i'm sure i read that valve were hiring ppl to invent a new control system.

  9. #29
    Legendary! Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    I got this one folks:

    ahem...

    Here's a brief outline of why they "don't" do peripheral support for mouse/keyboard

    1) They DO have mouse/keyboard support... especially since the PS3 is USB based connections. One reason nobody supports it is because it's a peripheral... by definition not everybody has one, and they focus on are what people do HAVE that comes with the system when you purchase it - and that is a controller.
    They could start shipping consoles with mouse and keyboard and stop making controllers, then developers would be required to develop around them. Also this would be a good way to do PC ports so us PC gamers arent stuck playing games that were designed for consoles and as such usually have menus and interfaces designed to be used with a controller and are are clunky and annoying to navigate with keyboard and mouse. This is my biggest complaint with ports. If they are going to port a game to a PC, then they should be required to remake the game with a PC in mind instead of being lazy and just porting it directly. It just reeks of laziness and greed


    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post
    3) As others have said... keyboard/mouse require flat surfaces and being hunched over even a table. Console gaming lets me recline into my EZ chair and relax while playing. Even if you put a plank of wood accross the EZ chair and play, you're still having your heads wide-apart and hitting all sorts of buttons/options. One console developer I know interviews potential new development staff and hits them with unusual questions: One of which is "What is the optimal number of useable buttons for a Video Game?" The answer? is ONE or NONE. Their idea is simple... SIMPLIFY the game experience. The more it's simplified, the less convoluted it becomes to average Q gamer looking for just some simple action, not an in-depth mind-taxing life simulator.
    This is the major problem with consoles in general. They are designed to be played by simpletons who want to run through a game from beginning to end with no challenge or skill in a short period of time, almost like an interactive movie, then when ported to PC they lack all the extra depth PC gamers are accustomed to. Limited options, no difficulty, short play times to beat it. Nothing extra like the old days when you got a better ending if you beat a game on the hardest difficulty with no cheats. Hell half of the new games even give you in game hints on how to finish parts of the game. Id love to see a modern console gamer try to beat a game like Myst without cheat books or the internet. What happened to the good old days when you were either good and beat a game, or got pissed off and stopped playing and bought a different game to play. Every person that buys a game shouldnt be able to finish it.

  10. #30
    Moderator Remilia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mvallas View Post

    2) Here's a big one nobody considers... why? Because the PC gaming market is damn-near non-existant in Japan. Hell, World of Warcraft isn't even out there... simply because there's no market for it. Japan, for some reason, has not adopted to PC gaming - they see the home computer and video games as two totally separate things, and have done so since the Famicom (ironically short for "Family computer"). Japan is a HUGE market for console gaming, so why make a system that totally alienates 1/2, if not MORE, of your market?
    Quite honestly that's a first one to hear.
    If you wish, just take a look at how many games are released at comiket in Japan for the PC. It is massive. They do have a hell of a lot more console games than us part due that not many of em get ported.
    I've been to Taiwan and Japan multiple times and at one point bought a few Japanese games. (hell of a lot cheaper too ).
    Games with the style like YS Origin are more prevalent and some games are even showcased on a monitor are shown. (Once saw an AFK character for a game for some reason).
    It's not that they don't have a market, quite honestly their pc market resembles more of the Indie market games that we have, and they're pretty damn good for some of the ones I played.

  11. #31
    To be fair, i can (and frequently do) use my 360 controller on PC game, using a usb wireless recieve, everytime i turn on the controller, it also turn on the console, but that is another pb ^^


    ok, i get the argument that sony, being a japanese manufacturer, donc see mouse gaming as natural. PC gaming being under developed in japan. But microsoft? I mean common, microsoft and PC are almost indissociable.


    Another question for you guys.


    When we see that microsoft and sony battling for market share 71.1 millions 360 and 69.2 millions ps3 from VGChartz (don't know if accurate) seems it's a very close battle indeed. Do you think if suddenly, a manufacturer out of the blue offer mouse and keyboard gaming, they can take a significant advantage over the concurence, or they will upset their current player base, seeing that if they want to continue playing FPS mltiplayer, they will have to learn this new peripheral.

    Or perhaps you can have 2 kind of online play, 2 type of laderring, with pad and with mouse.


    We could see game such as Starcraft 2 on console, do you think i might do well?

  12. #32
    I think someone should come in and break the mould with the next gen at least for first person shooters, it would be a benefit to both pc and console in the long term, consoles have the option then to gradually lose this rap they have with the pc communities. and both platforms can evolve together instead of the pc being pulled down by the lack of options surrounding control pads, I'd love to see some RTS gaming on the console, i think the ppl you lose to complaints over needing to use a KB/mouse for specific styles of games will be drowned out by the overwhelming joy of pc gamers actually being able to buy a console thats near identical to their regular platform.

    hell they could even kill pc gaming (or maybe just create a bigger variation) with a move like this, i would probably buy a console if i knew it handled games the same as my pc, yet its guaranteed to run every game i buy for it for the next xx years.

    i doubt its too much of a push of the imagination to have ppl on consoles using kb/mouse setups being lumped together with other players using the same control scheme, sure you may cleave a community in half, but it probably wouldn't lower the speed of getting into a game. again with cod, the lobbies already exist, its just a matter of getting the system to assign control schemes into the same lobbies, so pads play with pads and mouse/kb play against other mouse/kb.
    Last edited by Heathy; 2012-12-06 at 06:02 PM.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Crysthalica View Post
    Afaik Dreamcast didn't have keyboard/mouse support, but it was like 10 years since I played on it.
    You are wrong it did. It ran windows CE ( A version of it that supported DirectX) and had full keyboard/mouse support along with applications and email (Including integrated internet connection via dial-up modem).

    It was one of the most advanced consoles ever made at the time, and playing Half Life on it was amazing. There is absolutely no reason not to add keyboard and mouse support considering how many PC Games are "console ports" these days, and could only add to the consoles saleability. Imagine what Blizz would do if they could port a playable version of WoW to console? 20 million subscribers?


  14. #34
    Moderator Remilia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dammagia View Post
    You are wrong it did. It ran windows CE ( A version of it that supported DirectX) and had full keyboard/mouse support along with applications and email (Including integrated internet connection via dial-up modem).

    It was one of the most advanced consoles ever made at the time, and playing Half Life on it was amazing. There is absolutely no reason not to add keyboard and mouse support considering how many PC Games are "console ports" these days, and could only add to the consoles saleability. Imagine what Blizz would do if they could port a playable version of WoW to console? 20 million subscribers?
    Get a windows 8 (not rt) tablet. Hook up the keyboard and a mouse. \o/.
    Also get a solar power mini portable battery pack. Maybe the 10000mAh one.
    Specs can be i5 3rd generation, 4gb ram, ssd but it's probably integrated graphics. I want one.....
    Offtopic though.

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