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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucetia View Post
    I think what they meant, and I very well could be wrong is that we have something like this: (and dates aren't exact, just there to illustrate)

    September 25 - MoP Release
    November 25 - Small Content Patch
    January 25 - New Raid Content (...)
    I don't think so. It would mean you're expected to clear a 16 boss tier in 4 months. That's pretty much the largest tier ever, rivaled only by T7, which was absolutely trivial. And it'd become useless the day 5.2 hits, unless they figure some way to keep people playing old heroics. Which I doubt.

    If that happens, it will be the repeat of ToC - release new instance too early, while lots of people still progress in previous one, killing old tier in the process.

    Also, even if that was the case, it should be on PTR already - assuming it's not 5 boss instance and actually decent size raid.

  2. #22
    Herald of the Titans RoKPaNda's Avatar
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    Wow. Did I just see someone compare being a top tier raider to feats of human evolution? Wow. Just ... Yeah. Look I'm not hating on top tier WoW players but if you think that playing WoW at a top tier level is in any way a major accomplishment, newsworthy, or a feat of human evolution ... Your priorities are probably a little messed up. Back when I was in my teens during Vanilla I thought WoW was a lot more important than it is too, so I understand.

  3. #23
    Dreadlord Aquarela's Avatar
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    I raid 8 hours a week, can't really imagine being raiding 8 hours per day.
    Of course, my raiding team has little progress, just 9/16 normal. but considering we started raiding 2 weeks later than everybody and only raid on weekends I think our progress is good.

  4. #24
    High Overlord Zazzmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelos View Post
    you'll have to wait 4 months for a new raid now. And again I fail to see the reason why someone wants to plow through the content as fast as possible.
    I'm raiding 3-4 days a week for 4 hours each day and if I had to guess I'd say that we still have 2-3 months of progressing to do before we'll kill the last boss of T14 in heroic mode.
    But for some people there's nothing to do other than farming the same bosses again for 4 months. That's double the time that MoP has been out already. Sounds fun I guess?

    I think Blizzard did a good job with the difficulty this time. You can't tune encounters to block guilds that probably raid 24/7. There's no way anyone other than those will ever kill such bosses. And for this "rest" 5.2 will probably arrive while they're still progressing or are just done with Sha HC.

    I made this thread because it really perplexes me what someone who goes raiding every single day for god-knows-how-long has to be thinking to make the decision to spend most of this time in some dungeons in some game. Or to phrase it more general - to do the exact same thing all the time for weeks if not months or maybe even years (Diablo2 anyone?).
    I can understand people that are playing for such a long time but are mixing it up a bit. Some raids, some PvP, some dailies, some pet-battles. But usually there's a point when things start feeling like a chore and most people call it a day. And that's the thing - I can't even believe that people raiding so much or playing things like Diablo2 for years doing the exact same grinding (seriously wtf? there's no new content coming out, what's even the point?) are having fun anymore.

    Okay, there's that feeling of competition with raiding in WoW. Being the first to clear the content might be nice but is it really worth sacrifing so much time? SO. MUCH. TIME?
    What do you think?
    I think that there are as many different ways to play this game as there are players. True progression raiding appeals to a fairly small percentage of the WoW population, but that doesn't make it a less valid form of play.

    Also, progression raiders spend less overall time raiding than most guilds. Once the initial progression period is over, tackling those raids takes FAR less time every reset than it does for the average guild who struggles for weeks/months.

    The real question is: why do you feel so offended by how others choose to spend their time in the game?

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-07 at 06:14 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Mionelol View Post
    I won't enter the "top guilds spend less time overall" because I personally think that's utter bullshit aside from a few select individuals or guilds.
    Frontloading content is a lost artform for the average WoW raiding guild, but most progression guilds still actively use that method. They really DO spend less time raiding a content tier than most.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelos View Post
    you'll have to wait 4 months for a new raid now. And again I fail to see the reason why someone wants to plow through the content as fast as possible.
    I'm raiding 3-4 days a week for 4 hours each day and if I had to guess I'd say that we still have 2-3 months of progressing to do before we'll kill the last boss of T14 in heroic mode.
    But for some people there's nothing to do other than farming the same bosses again for 4 months. That's double the time that MoP has been out already. Sounds fun I guess?

    I think Blizzard did a good job with the difficulty this time. You can't tune encounters to block guilds that probably raid 24/7. There's no way anyone other than those will ever kill such bosses. And for this "rest" 5.2 will probably arrive while they're still progressing or are just done with Sha HC.

    I made this thread because it really perplexes me what someone who goes raiding every single day for god-knows-how-long has to be thinking to make the decision to spend most of this time in some dungeons in some game. Or to phrase it more general - to do the exact same thing all the time for weeks if not months or maybe even years (Diablo2 anyone?).
    I can understand people that are playing for such a long time but are mixing it up a bit. Some raids, some PvP, some dailies, some pet-battles. But usually there's a point when things start feeling like a chore and most people call it a day. And that's the thing - I can't even believe that people raiding so much or playing things like Diablo2 for years doing the exact same grinding (seriously wtf? there's no new content coming out, what's even the point?) are having fun anymore.

    Okay, there's that feeling of competition with raiding in WoW. Being the first to clear the content might be nice but is it really worth sacrifing so much time? SO. MUCH. TIME?
    What do you think?
    Could you be any more judgmental and condescending?

  6. #26
    what is it that you're trying to say? yea we do sacrifice a lot of time during progression, but a semi-hardcore guild like yours raids a lot more if you look at the big picture aka the time a tier is current content. hardcore guilds -> raid a lot during the first few days of an expansion / content patch and after that it's logging in 4 hours every reset to farm heroic gear and then you're done for the week. Casual guild? has to put in way more time overall to get the same results.

    Your casual guild will, as you said, still progress T14HC in a few months, mine is already done and got everything on farm and has to progress nada from now on until the next patch is released. So while you go have fun progressing I farm 16/16 heroic every week in 4 hours and then I'm done for the week. Doesn't sound that bad, does it?

  7. #27
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    Hey, just because some people have no job, no girlfriend, no friends outside WoW, and no real hobbies doesn't mean you should look down on them. They're allowed to live their lives however they want.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jainzar View Post
    what is it that you're trying to say? yea we do sacrifice a lot of time during progression, but a semi-hardcore guild like yours raids a lot more if you look at the big picture aka the time a tier is current content.
    Doubtful, since progression guilds have to learn the strats through hours of trial and error while casual guilds can just watch a 5 minute video.

  8. #28
    Actually I would prefer having next tier in ~4months, time to upgrade most items (damn Blizz said VP capping isn't mandatory and the next patch they made it so ...). Also time to kill and farm elite protectors.

    Also time to get drunk, finish personal projects, catch up on RL, have a relaxed Xmas vacation, play STO, get drunk some more, sleep more than 5-6H/night etc.
    Last edited by dakalro; 2012-12-07 at 02:52 PM.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelos View Post
    you'll have to wait 4 months for a new raid now. And again I fail to see the reason why someone wants to plow through the content as fast as possible.
    I'm raiding 3-4 days a week for 4 hours each day and if I had to guess I'd say that we still have 2-3 months of progressing to do before we'll kill the last boss of T14 in heroic mode.
    But for some people there's nothing to do other than farming the same bosses again for 4 months. That's double the time that MoP has been out already. Sounds fun I guess?

    I think Blizzard did a good job with the difficulty this time. You can't tune encounters to block guilds that probably raid 24/7. There's no way anyone other than those will ever kill such bosses. And for this "rest" 5.2 will probably arrive while they're still progressing or are just done with Sha HC.

    I made this thread because it really perplexes me what someone who goes raiding every single day for god-knows-how-long has to be thinking to make the decision to spend most of this time in some dungeons in some game. Or to phrase it more general - to do the exact same thing all the time for weeks if not months or maybe even years (Diablo2 anyone?).
    I can understand people that are playing for such a long time but are mixing it up a bit. Some raids, some PvP, some dailies, some pet-battles. But usually there's a point when things start feeling like a chore and most people call it a day. And that's the thing - I can't even believe that people raiding so much or playing things like Diablo2 for years doing the exact same grinding (seriously wtf? there's no new content coming out, what's even the point?) are having fun anymore.

    Okay, there's that feeling of competition with raiding in WoW. Being the first to clear the content might be nice but is it really worth sacrifing so much time? SO. MUCH. TIME?
    What do you think?
    You're aware that you will in the end end up raiding twice as much as those top guilds if not more? They will raid 1 day a week soon for months while you still do 4 days a week. So can you explain to me what time sacrificing are you talking about?

  10. #30
    Hey there, thanks for the answers.
    I've read everything and there's one point I'd like to pick out in particular: hardcore raiders spend less overall time.
    That's exactly what my "problem" with this playstyle is. This sounds like "I have to get done with it as fast as possible so I can enjoy other stuff". By spreading it out over a longer amount of time you can make sure that you have something to aim for for much longer.
    I just don't understand why you would want to get to this point when there's no progression anymore as fast as possible.

    Hey, just because some people have no job, no girlfriend, no friends outside WoW, and no real hobbies doesn't mean you should look down on them. They're allowed to live their lives however they want.
    I didn't really want to come across like this as I don't think that playing a game for a high amount of time has that much to do with being a pathetic loser in real life. Sure there are those who just play to escape reality but looking at most people I met in MMORPGs this only applies to 1% of them or even less.
    I can understand where this stereotype is coming from (and that most "normal" people are thinking like that about gamers) but it's just not true.
    Even with 7 days of raiding I'm sure there's enough time to lead a healthy social life, so that's not really the point.
    Also: WoW is a hobby. I don't even know why it wouldn't be.

    Could you be any more judgmental and condescending?
    Oh please, that has to be one of the most overused phrases I've heard on the Internet in... well, I guess in like ever.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Doom Panda View Post
    Frontloading content is a lost artform for the average WoW raiding guild, but most progression guilds still actively use that method. They really DO spend less time raiding a content tier than most.
    In terms of pure raiding, yes, but you know just as much as me that you spend that time in WoW elsewhere, to farm mats, to do alts raids, to prepare for te next content, or on beta/PTR, whatever.

    Also, let's not kid ourselves. Aside from a few select individuals, most people are nerds to a much larger degree(nothing wrong with that), and just because we cleared content doesn't mean I'm suddenly going to bang my 3 BF/GFs, it just means I'm going to play more dota and watch more anime, lol.
    Last edited by Mionelol; 2012-12-07 at 03:12 PM.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Zelos View Post
    Hey there, thanks for the answers.
    I've read everything and there's one point I'd like to pick out in particular: hardcore raiders spend less overall time.
    That's exactly what my "problem" with this playstyle is. This sounds like "I have to get done with it as fast as possible so I can enjoy other stuff". By spreading it out over a longer amount of time you can make sure that you have something to aim for for much longer.
    I just don't understand why you would want to get to this point when there's no progression anymore as fast as possible.
    Why do marathoners try to be as fast as possible and finish quick, when they could just take their time and enjoy the stroll?

    It's called competition.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radalek View Post
    You're aware that you will in the end end up raiding twice as much as those top guilds if not more? They will raid 1 day a week soon for months while you still do 4 days a week. So can you explain to me what time sacrificing are you talking about?
    This really isn't even remotely true. Killing bosses early means you have to learn the strategy through trial and error, you have less gear from fewer farm runs of previous bosses, and you may have to deal with overtuned mechanics that will be nerfed before non-progression guilds reach that boss.

    You can't rationally argue that progression guilds spend less time raiding overall unless you ignore most of the facts.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mionelol View Post
    ... and just because we cleared content doesn't mean I'm suddenly going to bang my 3 BF/GFs, it just means I'm going to play more dota and watch more anime, lol.
    Ha, try telling that to a girlfriend!

  14. #34
    Idea for most raiders now on farm:

    > get BiS gear
    > upgrade all BiS gear to 517

    I currently have 8 BiS items. 3 Upgraded to 517.

  15. #35
    Those people I dont get is those who raid 24/7 to get all the hc bosses down first on their realm etc. Then they go complain on MMO-C when they are done and its still 3 months left to next patch and Q_Q its nothing left for them to do.
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  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by konway View Post
    Doubtful, since progression guilds have to learn the strats through hours of trial and error while casual guilds can just watch a 5 minute video.
    No, it's not doubtful, it's a fact. Those times where you had to figure out the tactics for hours and hours through trial and error are over. If we progress on a new boss we read the dungeon journal, every ability is listed in there and since we know the normal mode version of the encounter, we know what abilities are heroic only (plus it's even pointed out in the dungeon journal). It's not really that hard, the tactics for the heroic bosses in T14 were figured out very quickly.

    Plus the said casual guild watching the "5minute video" will need just as much time until they can adapt the tactics and until they are able to play the encounter the way it's supposed to be played.

  17. #37
    Stood in the Fire Desh's Avatar
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    Top 10 guilds raid less than rank 1000 guilds.

  18. #38
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    I think OP should stop worrying about what other people are spending their time on.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-07 at 05:16 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Trollfaced View Post
    Those people I dont get is those who raid 24/7 to get all the hc bosses down first on their realm etc. Then they go complain on MMO-C when they are done and its still 3 months left to next patch and Q_Q its nothing left for them to do.
    Link me one person from vodka, Method, Blood Legion, etc, that is QQing about having nothing to do. Just one.

  19. #39
    These people you talk about raiding too much, end up raiding a lot less than you over the course of the tier.

    They go mental for a couple of weeks, sometimes 3. Then end up raiding once or twice a week, as they clear stuff pretty fast once learned. Soon it will just be one raid per week.

  20. #40
    Moderator Gehco's Avatar
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    Well, if you rush through content in no time, then the time when you are done can be used for something else. Alts or one of the hundreds of other things. I don't really care for the ones whom burn through the content, mostly because some of them end up turning to be the ones whining that there aren't enough content to keep them occupied.

    But enjoy it at your own pace, as they say. But don't expect people to follow you, everyone is allowed to do what they wish and keep up..

    ... Else hunt that elusive world boss, we all know whom it is. Always multiple raids waiting for it, heh.
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