What grinds my intergalactic gears about the F2P model

[Psychlon]

Anyone ever experienced xp/level loss and grind fests will just silently laugh... . Where are the "the harder the better and not max lvl in under 1 year" fanatics when you need them.....

[namelessone]

Is that xp penalty on top of not getting "rested" xp or is that the xp penalty you are talking about? In any case....

It's on top of not getting rest xp, apparently. And it is a game-killer for me. I don't have unlimited free time anymore, and I found levelling in pre-P2P SWTOR to be way too slow for my liking. If P2P means going even slower - I simply won't bother. The sad part is if it wasn't for the penalty, I would be playing and buying the XP buffs to minimize the amount of filler side quests I need to do. SWTOR side quest feel incredibly grindy to me, I'd rather do as little of them as possible. Instead, I'm being asked to do more.

Also there's no point comparing the game to Everquest or what not. It might have been slower, sure, but I'm not playing everquest and don't plan to.

[Deleted]

The restrictions you have as F2P are very harsh. The game is playable but you will missing alot of features.
The best part of the game (class stories) are still fully playable. It`s just that all the stuff that makes the experience easier/faster/more comfortable is locked away.
I think their F2P model is succesful though, I`ve been seeing alot of new players and alot of the people i`ve been talking to have spend money in the shop or are subbed.

[Edge-]

You forgot to mention EQ1 and it's hell levels every 5 levels where those levels required about 5x the exp than a normal level. Leveling is easy. xp bonus's are readily and easily available on the GTN as well to negate that for typically 1k or under. That's nothing in terms of creds in game, even at level 20.

EQ1 is a totally different breed of game and you can't really draw comparisons between the two. Make a game with a leveling curve like EQ1 today and it will see a micro-population, since the broader MMO community won't put up with massive grinds like that (see: all the Asian grinder hate).

[notorious98]

It's on top of not getting rest xp, apparently. And it is a game-killer for me. I don't have unlimited free time anymore, and I found levelling in pre-P2P SWTOR to be way too slow for my liking. If P2P means going even slower - I simply won't bother. The sad part is if it wasn't for the penalty, I would be playing and buying the XP buffs to minimize the amount of filler side quests I need to do. SWTOR side quest feel incredibly grindy to me, I'd rather do as little of them as possible. Instead, I'm being asked to do more.

Also there's no point comparing the game to Everquest or what not. It might have been slower, sure, but I'm not playing everquest and don't plan to.

I can definitely agree with this. Limiting XP seems extraneous to me. Once I got to level 30, I was ready to be done. Leveling a second toon to 50 was also tough because the side quests were just too much for me. I'll give them that this game is definitely based on strong stories, but I always felt like the stories were too weighted down by all the side shit and, for alts, the inability to completely skip conversations. Same thing goes for dailies. Dailies are bad enough. Having to rewatch them over and over or spacebar through over and over is annoying.

[anyaka21]

EQ1 is a totally different breed of game and you can't really draw comparisons between the two. Make a game with a leveling curve like EQ1 today and it will see a micro-population, since the broader MMO community won't put up with massive grinds like that (see: all the Asian grinder hate).

considering I was responding to someone who was talking about xp in eq2, your point is pointless.

[Svifnymr]

I can definitely agree with this. Limiting XP seems extraneous to me. Once I got to level 30, I was ready to be done. Leveling a second toon to 50 was also tough because the side quests were just too much for me. I'll give them that this game is definitely based on strong stories, but I always felt like the stories were too weighted down by all the side shit and, for alts, the inability to completely skip conversations. Same thing goes for dailies. Dailies are bad enough. Having to rewatch them over and over or spacebar through over and over is annoying.

FOr myself, I've got 4 80's (sith warrior, sith inq, jedi consular, trooper) and was leveling a knight and agent, but it was too tedious. So I got my knight the xp bonus for space missions and was logging in to do space missions for xp and occasionally doing class quests. If there was stuff I wanted to do, I'd sub, but to just log in to "maintain" my lot it's not worth sub and it's not worth doing it on the F2P system either.

[Semihage]

But keep in mind subscribers are rewarded with free cartel point as well... And some things you have already unlocked through credits or raiding (your gear, inventory space, and bank tab as well) are all retained even if you stop subscribing.

The free cartel point should be more than enough for you to unlock tons of stuff (including weekly passes).. So I am really not so sure why you think subscribers didn't get any benefit once they stop subscribing.

[Doylez]

Your TLDR is just as long as the rest

You're right though, any game where I get the feeling "I need to pay for the game to be fun" isn't a game I want to play at all.
Constantly getting reminded about what you can't do and feeling like a 2nd class player is no fun.

[Psychlon]

It's on top of not getting rest xp, apparently. And it is a game-killer for me. I don't have unlimited free time anymore, and I found levelling in pre-P2P SWTOR to be way too slow for my liking. If P2P means going even slower - I simply won't bother. The sad part is if it wasn't for the penalty, I would be playing and buying the XP buffs to minimize the amount of filler side quests I need to do. SWTOR side quest feel incredibly grindy to me, I'd rather do as little of them as possible. Instead, I'm being asked to do more.

Also there's no point comparing the game to Everquest or what not. It might have been slower, sure, but I'm not playing everquest and don't plan to.

Sorry but the leveling is going pretty fast.... if this is too slow for you I don't know what kind of game you are used to ... maybe leveling services? The point that you don't want to do side quests or bonus quests (which you are doing aside doing the quest.... I never had to randomly stand around and kill stuff, everyhing just went while I was heading to the next point) is your problem. There are several ways in which you can get xp, if none of this is fitting you, probably the game is not for you.

Your TLDR is just as long as the rest

You're right though, any game where I get the feeling "I need to pay for the game to be fun" isn't a game I want to play at all.
Constantly getting reminded about what you can't do and feeling like a 2nd class player is no fun.

F2P Player aren't paying, if you feel like a second class player because of that that's maybe because you are? You don't get all the bonuses, you don't get stuff for free like subscribers etc. , there are definately different categories called... F2P/ Prefered/ Subscriber.

[namelessone]

Sorry but the leveling is going pretty fast.... if this is too slow for you I don't know what kind of game you are used to ... maybe leveling services? The point that you don't want to do side quests or bonus quests (which you are doing aside doing the quest.... I never had to randomly stand around and kill stuff, everyhing just went while I was heading to the next point) is your problem. There are several ways in which you can get xp, if none of this is fitting you, probably the game is not for you.

The point is that I don't want to do more BORING content than necessary and this is exactly what F2P is forcing me to do. It's slow not based on time, but based rather on experience. When you are having fun, time flies. Interesting quests would really help a lot. But SWTOR is choke full of badly written padding. Case in point: Alderaan.

[Psychlon]

I played bountyhunter twice, sith warrior twice, will play sith inquisitor again and probably either trooper or agent story a second time. I can't see your point.

[Deleted]

The point is that I don't want to do more BORING content than necessary and this is exactly what F2P is forcing me to do. It's slow not based on time, but based rather on experience. When you are having fun, time flies. Interesting quests would really help a lot. But SWTOR is choke full of badly written padding. Case in point: Alderaan.

Tbh the exp rates are the same for f2p as what everyone had at launch, so really you should be leveling just fine. You also say that interesting quests would help alot? What would you rather do, the old WoW style of questing where every quest is 'go collect x amount' or 'go click x amount' SWTOR questing is some of the best ever tbh and saying it is badly wrote is rather crazy.

[jvbastel]

Tbh the exp rates are the same for f2p as what everyone had at launch, so really you should be leveling just fine. You also say that interesting quests would help alot? What would you rather do, the old WoW style of questing where every quest is 'go collect x amount' or 'go click x amount' SWTOR questing is some of the best ever tbh and saying it is badly wrote is rather crazy.

While the class quests are definitely top-notch, the side quests are awful. Taris still brings shivers to my spine.

[Psychlon]

The planets I don't like I'll switch, however as I don't have any xp problems I can afford it. As you don't want to pay something... you might have to go along with it as it's actually not a restriction but a personal dislike of parts of the game.

[Deleted]

My take is simply this,

The more you know about the game and the model the less you have to pay.
Experienced players can generate a significant amount of credits with relative easy and buy unlocks from players attempting to profit off their stipend through the GTN.

Swtor's model, especially on the surface, is imperfect. There is much room for improvement. Which is not to say that the model is horrible or terribad or w/e.

^^ what this guy says,

sure when you log in at level 1 you think the f2p model sucks, but later on when you realize you can purchase all the unlocks for credits on the gtn you see that its actually much more liberal than most f2p models

[Skizzit]

^^ what this guy says,

sure when you log in at level 1 you think the f2p model sucks, but later on when you realize you can purchase all the unlocks for credits on the gtn you see that its actually much more liberal than most f2p models

But as the F2P model was implemented to get new players into the game, don't you see a problem with that way of thinking?

[namelessone]

Tbh the exp rates are the same for f2p as what everyone had at launch, so really you should be leveling just fine. You also say that interesting quests would help alot? What would you rather do, the old WoW style of questing where every quest is 'go collect x amount' or 'go click x amount' SWTOR questing is some of the best ever tbh and saying it is badly wrote is rather crazy.

SWTOR feels exactly like the old WoW style quest. In fact, modern WoW questing feels much more fresh and less grindy. And it is poorly written, outside of a few unique stories. I swear, when I was on Taris, I think I was asked to get the cure for rakghoul virus at least 5 times by different people. On Alderaan, seriously, almost every quest follows the same pattern: "We made some progress but the enemy made unexpected move and took control of some key facility and now we can't proceed". After two hours of doing quests there, I felt like I'm fighting with the most inept army in the universe.

[Psychlon]

SWTOR feels exactly like the old WoW style quest. In fact, modern WoW questing feels much more fresh and less grindy. And it is poorly written, outside of a few unique stories. I swear, when I was on Taris, I think I was asked to get the cure for rakghoul virus at least 5 times by different people. On Alderaan, seriously, almost every quest follows the same pattern: "We made some progress but the enemy made unexpected move and took control of some key facility and now we can't proceed". After two hours of doing quests there, I felt like I'm fighting with the most inept army in the universe.

I swear when I was on Taris I got the Rakghoul Virus once... and I swear that on a war plagued planet it doesn't make any sense to not talk about war efforts/ problems... because it's war. However if you don't like it... just do your class quest but for some reason you are riding on the planets you don't like.... get over it. Skip the planets an be done with your complains. There is an easy way... take it or leave it.

[Sivick]

I would agree with the OP assessment that the "carrot" dangling infront of them urging them to pay is a greater motivator than the "stick" that constantly penalizes them for not paying. Then again, having played SWTOR, they made a lot of questionable decisions that kept this excellent MMO from becoming a true WoW rival.