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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsychotic View Post
    It would make for smarter playstyle during a multiplayer match, being careful with how you choose to fire your weapon, there wouldn't be as much spraying that's for sure but it wouldn't be the way to go so I'm glad CoD isn't considering anything like it, couldn't care about BF.
    Last time I checked, anyone who is 'spraying' is probably missing a lot anyway. I for one am very happy to meet a 'sprayer', as their aim is generally horrible. I'll admit I tend to panic and spray myself, but that's because I'm just terrible. And yes, I'll be missing. If I hit anything other than a wall during those moments, my enemy can consider himself extremely unlucky, but definitely not outplayed.

    I am loving the term by the way and will make sure to introduce it if we play some BF3 again.

    Edit: I'm thinking but wouldn't that just mean, with a pay feature like this, that you'd just empty your gun on the nearest wall with a silence device (been ages since I played!)? As I understood it, "just" running out of ammo wouldn't cost you.
    Last edited by Cirque; 2012-12-10 at 05:47 AM.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Argroth View Post
    Thats how fanboys are justifying any F2P game that has unlockables for money.

    Its a greedy stance from the developer point of view and a stupid stance as a customer to support something like that that only disadvantages players.
    How does the F2P model disadvantages current subscriber? The only thing I can see is introducing items which could have been made available during ingame quests/ rewards.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Mizgarth View Post
    League of Legends are about the only ones who did F2P right. Where you can unlock everything free but pay if you want things faster.
    I somewhat agree (since skins are RP only, but they are just visual and don't affect gameplay in any way)

    If LoLs F2P was done in the same way as SWTORs You would get one less item slot then others and would have to buy it with limited gold before you could buy an item for it.

    Or you would only be able to play 3 games a day

    or you would get a smaller choice of champions then others.

    Or they would allow some to only be able to buy like 5 champions, they would have to give up one champion if hey wanted to get a new one.

    They would cap your gold in every match so as soon as you reach that amount you would have to buy an item before you gained more. (there might be some super high cap now like 9999 but noone gets to it)

    They would make it so you couldn't /dance and/or /taunt unless you wasted gold during a match to buy it or with real money.


    In short they would limit a bunch of silly things or make ridiculous limitations if Bioware ran LoLs F2P.

    BUT since LoL is a good F2P game the only things that do cost money is Skins, otherwise it dosn't bother you around every corner limiting you to cash shop items.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-10 at 07:13 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Psychlon View Post
    How does the F2P model disadvantages current subscriber? The only thing I can see is introducing items which could have been made available during ingame quests/ rewards.
    Subscribers it means that the company is putting development costs into stupid useless items in the shop to make money

    and as stated before F2P and Prefferred players get screwed way more then other F2P games.

    Guess you didn't read my post before. there are lots of things that disadvantage a F2P player, things cost more (can't remove that), Commendations are capped (can't remove that) and credits are capped (can't remove that either). Many quest items are locked out too.

    Then there is the fact around every turn it limits other things. True while SOME can be bought in the GTN many are way overpriced (some idiots even sell them above the credit cap) and are given right from the start in many other F2P games.
    Last edited by Argroth; 2012-12-10 at 07:15 AM.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsychotic View Post
    Succeeded with doing something similar in SWTOR though, sadly.
    You have to reload to play the most basic piece of such a game. There's quite a bit available in star wars that you don't have to pay for. People overlook that a lot, especially when hating on it.

  5. #45
    My question was regarding subscribers.. not F2P players.

    I don't think I need to discuss with you how much you "need" all these unlocks as a F2P when first leveling a character from 1-50... cause you really don't. Been there, done that...

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Psychlon View Post
    My question was regarding subscribers.. not F2P players.

    I don't think I need to discuss with you how much you "need" all these unlocks as a F2P when first leveling a character from 1-50... cause you really don't. Been there, done that...
    Depends on class. I'm pretty sure I needed more than 2 action bars by level 30 as a Shadow.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheGravemind View Post
    If I was in his boots (and forced to join the SS in 1939 or whenever he joined), I would have tried to liberate the camp myself or die trying. He did not. He traded his life for the life of thousands of people, thus he should face the consequences
    Quote Originally Posted by Proberly View Post
    Oh would you now? It truly is amazing how many heroic people we have wasting their time on internet.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Psychlon View Post
    My question was regarding subscribers.. not F2P players.

    I don't think I need to discuss with you how much you "need" all these unlocks as a F2P when first leveling a character from 1-50... cause you really don't. Been there, done that...
    But here's the question: Is the experience without all those unlocks enjoyable?

    Whether it's possible or not is irrelevant. If an experience isn't enjoyable, why would someone pay money?

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusherO0 View Post
    But here's the question: Is the experience without all those unlocks enjoyable?

    Whether it's possible or not is irrelevant. If an experience isn't enjoyable, why would someone pay money?
    Would you consider the original UI as "enjoyable"? I don't but I still had a blast playing a character, seeing all planets for the first time, I didn't do a single warzone/ flashpoint/ space mission but every planetary/ class/ bonus quest and I used only 2 actionbars. However I probably didn't lack something a lot of people do... the will to give it an honest try. If you have spare money you can even unlock some stuff which I couldn't because there was no legacy.

    @priestiality I play a tank assassin and a dd shadow.... if I had to strip it down 2 actionbars would be sufficiant however I would feel limited, however as I can play totally for free without any need to invest a single coin I wouldn't have a problem with it.

  9. #49
    Why would somepne want to compare lol (even the name- omg) with a tripple A MMO RPG?! there isn't even one way to compare Content against Content! LOL is a moba game, copy pasted dota with quit good mechanic changes, but there is a huge gap between a moba and AAA MMO RPG games..

    If you have problem with f2p, rather pay something for your inconvinience of gtfo. You dont have to play it when you dont like it. But to coming into forum to blame for a thing you even dont like and dont have to, is simply the worst time investment in the internet...

    Wildstar Black Ops - loved by strangers

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Keren View Post
    But to coming into forum to blame for a thing you even dont like and dont have to, is simply the worst time investment in the internet...
    There are people which can bring up valid arguments, no doubt about it but these are usually showing themselves not spilling their issues in every thread no matter the topic. I really don't understand what the moron typ of complainer try to achieve with their constant reminding of all the aspects which they can't live with. Before WoW came out I was hyped for years but as it came out it was for myself a dissapointment. I couldn't bare the graphics, simple as that. When D3 came out (as someone who played D2 and D1 for many many years) I was so curious that I even bought the game for 60 dollars only to find out after few hours of playtime that this game isn't for me (copy&paste taking so many years to develope?..) but I really don't feel the need to jump over to Blizzard Forums, complaining how I feel about the game, I simply lack the need to do so. I would really wish that people which are done with this game use the official forum to voice their complain once and move on with whatever makes them happy.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Argroth View Post
    I somewhat agree (since skins are RP only, but they are just visual and don't affect gameplay in any way)

    If LoLs F2P was done in the same way as SWTORs You would get one less item slot then others and would have to buy it with limited gold before you could buy an item for it.

    Or you would only be able to play 3 games a day

    or you would get a smaller choice of champions then others.

    Or they would allow some to only be able to buy like 5 champions, they would have to give up one champion if hey wanted to get a new one.

    They would cap your gold in every match so as soon as you reach that amount you would have to buy an item before you gained more. (there might be some super high cap now like 9999 but noone gets to it)

    They would make it so you couldn't /dance and/or /taunt unless you wasted gold during a match to buy it or with real money.


    In short they would limit a bunch of silly things or make ridiculous limitations if Bioware ran LoLs F2P.

    BUT since LoL is a good F2P game the only things that do cost money is Skins, otherwise it dosn't bother you around every corner limiting you to cash shop items.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-10 at 07:13 AM ----------


    Subscribers it means that the company is putting development costs into stupid useless items in the shop to make money

    and as stated before F2P and Prefferred players get screwed way more then other F2P games.

    Guess you didn't read my post before. there are lots of things that disadvantage a F2P player, things cost more (can't remove that), Commendations are capped (can't remove that) and credits are capped (can't remove that either). Many quest items are locked out too.

    Then there is the fact around every turn it limits other things. True while SOME can be bought in the GTN many are way overpriced (some idiots even sell them above the credit cap) and are given right from the start in many other F2P games.
    Lol! Entertaining and true comparison.

    Maybe there's a marked for a thread in your style? "If X game adapted a F2P model as bad as swtor."

  12. #52
    The Patient
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    I agree 100% with posts #49 & #50.

    People should really spend more time playing the games they enjoy and less time bitching about the games they don't.

    If someone has put some time into TOR, I don't mean racing to max level and quitting by the end of Jan, I'm talking giving all aspects of the game a real go then still doesn't like it then fine....move on and play a game you like. Why lots of them feel the need to come onto the TOR boards and whine about how the game they cast aside 10/11 months ago "SUXZ" or "Is big Fail" is beyond me.

    If someone has fully played the game, likes some aspects of it but has some constructive points on how the game can be improved or specific gripes about bugs or management of the game, that is good for the game and the community. But the general hate directed towards the game leads me to the think there are deeper issues with these people, it's like some of them take enjoyment out of the perceived failings of the a computer game....sad!

    Nearly 12 months on now it's has become very old, I come here to try and find information about a game I enjoy or to maybe once in a while offer up some advice but any threads like that are just lost in a sea of bitching and hate.

    Sorry for the rant I've just had my fill of it.

  13. #53
    The answer to every question on here is SUB!

    Considering that people who play mmo's invest more of their time playing games then much else in their lives, i.e seeing freinds, being at the pub, or what ever. Say you play 8 hours a week thats 32 hours a month, and thats a lot of time.

    whats the sub per month what £9? Thats what 2 bottles of WKD when out drinking, or 2 packs of fags, that urll smoke in 1 hour of smoking - Think of how many pints you drink a month and the time you spend drinking them, or how many fags you smoke, or how much petrol you use, or chocoltae you stuff your face with. Your average mobile phone contract is most likely 3 times more then a mmo sub and do you spend as much time on your phone as you do playing games? If you choose to invest soo much time playing mmo's then why not invest the money to make that experience the best it can be?

    Thats like saying ok I want to spend 40 hours a month fishing but im going to use a free rod i found in the garage? or im going to play golf 40 hours a month and use 2nd hand clubs

    My guess is these people who moan who cant afford a tiny sub most likely blow 10 times that amount per month on shit that rots teeth n mind.

    Im just asking for a normal amount of perspective on the the FTP model.
    Last edited by Lethorien; 2012-12-10 at 01:08 PM.
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  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethorien View Post
    Im just asking for a normal amount of perspective on the the FTP model
    As usual, a very terrible argument that comes from the entirely wrong place. Using other prices of products to justify a different price of a different product is asinine. That's not how capitalism and economics works. Not to mention all of the flaws in your argument from a logical standpoint.

    If someone gave out free cigarettes, but they were the worst tobacco ever made, I'm sure a lot of smokers would gladly take them for free and not spend a dime. Same with alcohol, and every vice you mentioned. How about gasoline? If it was given out free, but was used 3x as fast because it's mostly water I bet a lot of people would take that as well. Sure I'd have to fill up once a week then, but I wouldn't pay a dime for it.

    Additionally, we are talking about a product that has lots of competition with a lower price and higher value. When it all comes down to it, that's what this is. It's like if a bar had top shelf liquor on special so that when you got the higher quality you paid less money. It never happens in most of those products you mention, but it happens frequently in video games.

    Here's the second flaw: a lot of those things people actually 'need' now. Cell phones and gas are kinda prerequisites for having a working life. That's not even relatable to choosing to play an MMO.

    So no, the answer is not to simply sub and take whatever is given you...but then again that's your response to every criticism on here. You aren't doing the game any favors and are just as bad as the people saying this game is garbage and nothing else.

  15. #55
    Kitty if bioware had a commision for every quote you decontruct with counter arguement, this mmo would be the most successfull mmo in gaming history.

    for all the time wasted debating free to play - for the sake of a few quid. I guess i should respect the fact that some people just love to spend hours n hours debating and complaining over something they can resolve with £9 -

    Some people love playing 20/30 games that are free and weighing up every con/pro - to see what they can squeeze out of not paying a single penny. Some would say thats crazy and a waste of time, others would say thats regular.

    I guess my argument is, lifes to short. £9 - click pay done, thanks i have what i want. Ill get busy enjoying my game and leave u lot to endless debate.

    Each to their own.
    Last edited by Lethorien; 2012-12-10 at 05:45 PM.
    Leth - Level 50 Sith Maurader - War Hero - 1300 Exp

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusherO0 View Post
    But here's the question: Is the experience without all those unlocks enjoyable?

    Whether it's possible or not is irrelevant. If an experience isn't enjoyable, why would someone pay money?
    Is it possible? Yes.

    Is it enjoyable? No. So many convenience things are taken out its unbelieveable. They make it an excruciating experience and slap you in the face on every screen "PAY US FOR THIS UNBELIEVABLY SIMPLE FEATURE!!!"

    People complain about complainers on this forum but people need a perspective that isn't totally biased for the game.

    It's not fair to people who come here to find information only to see bobbleheaded fanboys saying everything in the game is the greatest around. People say "if you don't like the game move on" How about "if you do like the game go play it, instead of spreading personal bloom all over the forums painting an unfair picture of the game"

    The game has flaws and I am pointing them out.

    It's a bad F2P model.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Argroth View Post
    It's a bad F2P model.
    Its better than having no f2p model available.

    That said, they should have had some sort of in-game through gaming way of unlocking coins independent of subscriber stipends.
    Like, completing chapter 1 gets you a bunch of coins you can use to unlock things like hide helm and crap or, if you don't want to hide helm, unlocking a 3rd trade skill.
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  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Argroth View Post
    Is it possible? Yes.

    Is it enjoyable? No. So many convenience things are taken out its unbelieveable. They make it an excruciating experience and slap you in the face on every screen "PAY US FOR THIS UNBELIEVABLY SIMPLE FEATURE!!!"
    Idk... I have run across a number of F2P people in game who seem very happy with the model. The only complaint I have heard talking to people in game is they don't like that some quest rewards are restricted (which is completely valid).

    The people who seem the most unhappy are the people who are playing as preferred, which is understandable because they know (in general) how restricted they are. Though they have made some strides to improve that, and I don't think they are quite done yet.

    It's also important to remember that most people who play MMOs never look at a website about that MMO, and if they do they maybe look at official websites and not fan sites. Forums tend to attract people with strong feelings (both negative and positive) and as such the impression of things on forums is often skewed a bit.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethorien View Post
    I guess my argument is, lifes to short. £9 - click pay done, thanks i have what i want. Ill get busy enjoying my game and leave u lot to endless debate.

    Each to their own.
    Except that wasn't your argument, or any of your arguments. You are specifically telling people who have issues to just cough up the money or else they are invalidated. If you really believe what you just posted, then you should never come back to these boards again because that is all that happens here.

    If it really is 'to each their own', then stop criticizing everyone who has an opinion. See I have been defending the model as pretty valid since they have been making great strides with the recent changes. I had to refute your post, because it was nonsense. I might go to lengths to show people how the model is fine, since now you will have 4 action bars, 6 characters, and can buy unlocks for credits. I will even advocate spending $15 for one month to get your coins, spend your credits on unlocks, and then be done with giving them money.

    But I'm surely not going to advocate blindly handing over your money because it hurts someone's feelings that other people aren't satisfied with the game. Please, by all means, get busy enjoying your game and leave these forums to our debates.

    Thank you!

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arlee View Post
    It's also important to remember that most people who play MMOs never look at a website about that MMO, and if they do they maybe look at official websites and not fan sites. Forums tend to attract people with strong feelings (both negative and positive) and as such the impression of things on forums is often skewed a bit.
    This 100%
    One guy recently stated that he would spit on the developers for coming up with a free to play model as bad as this and any customer who supported it....WHAT!?!?! I find it hilarious and sad in equal measures that people can get so worked up over a computer game, I don't know whether to envy or pity them. For them to get so worked up over a computer game they obviously haven't been kicked in the nads enough by life to put it all well into perspective and for that I envy them, but I also pity them for having such empty lives that a computer game means so much.

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