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  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    Actually the purpose of alimony is to maintain a comparable standard of living for a long term spouse. Whether that is a good purpose or not is of course a separate question, though in the majority of cases, I don't see it as a big problem as such (barring extremes).
    Since when are people entitled to a lifestyle? Furthermore, why the hell should that lifestyle be provided indefinitely by another person who no longer has anything to do with them? This is indentured servitude. Alimony is wrong and needs to be abolished.

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbamboozal View Post
    Too much effort? Or is it that you know it's just going to be painfully distasteful to you?
    Because it's a waste of time? I asked for court cases. You linked videos of someone's personal opinions. While I procrastinate a lot, I'm not going to waste my time on crap that obviously do not contain the things I specifically requested. Especially it is once again just some guy's personal opinions. If you have opinions post them, saying "oh look this other guy had opinions, why won't you watch his!?" is dumb.

    I do understand how this guy would turn your stomach....but come on, five minutes of watching a video in the interest of a conversation....
    Or you can actually try make a valid point yourself. Also this condescension is retarded, if you had relevant, valid material to support an argument I'll look at them. I'm under however no obligation to watch some random guy's youtube video of his personal opinions. Especially not when you offered them up as though it's what I asked for, when in fact it is clearly completely different.

    I won't press the issue, but I do wish you'd at least give it a chance without your exact, and limiting knee jerk reaction....
    How is it a knee jerk reaction? I asked if you (plural) had court cases. You (plural) keep linking me irrelevant shit - while pretending it's what I asked for. It's not knee jerking to point out hey, it's not actually a court case, it's a youtube video.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 06:53 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Zurtle View Post
    Since when are people entitled to a lifestyle? Furthermore, why the hell should that lifestyle be provided indefinitely by another person who no longer has anything to do with them? This is indentured servitude. Alimony is wrong and needs to be abolished.
    Take it up with your legislature then. That post was talking about the purpose of alimony.
    Last edited by semaphore; 2012-12-08 at 06:56 PM.

  3. #123
    Moderator Anakso's Avatar
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    I just googled alimony because I always thought it was child support...but it seems to be some ridiculous "here's money for being married to me" thing. I don't understand how this still exists. We don't have alimony in Australia. If I were to get married and have a child then get divorced I'd have to pay child support. No child then no reason to pay, and if you have a child then isn't child support enough? This kind of boggles my mind.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Anakso View Post
    I just googled alimony because I always thought it was child support...but it seems to be some ridiculous "here's money for being married to me" thing. I don't understand how this still exists. We don't have alimony in Australia. If I were to get married and have a child I'd have to pay child support, but no child then no reason to pay, and if you have a child then isn't child support enough? This kind of boggles my mind.
    Yes you do. It's called spousal maintenance. Most developed countries have them, they're just a lot more prominent in the United States because the government doesn't really take care of the people in America - so the court/legal system assigns responsibility to former spouses. It's almost like having a social safety net is a good idea.

  5. #125
    This is stupid. Typically the divorce settlement over here is 50/50 of all moneyz and property etc etc and thats done and dusted.

    Then child maintenence is settled in a different agreement.

    Always thought this whole alimony business was fucked up when I saw it on 2 and a half men.

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    Yes you do. It's called spousal maintenance. Most developed countries have them, they're just a lot more prominent in the United States because the government doesn't really take care of the people in America - so the court/legal system assigns responsibility to former spouses. It's almost like having a social safety net is a good idea.
    So you get married to have a social safety? Doesn't seem that romantic or even "marriage" worthy in the sense of what religion wanted you to know. But still I guess that's why a lot of people do it just for the benefits.

    Here in my country I have heard people getting married just so they can apply for a first house loan to the bank, since they are inclined to give it to "new families".
    Last edited by naturestorm; 2012-12-08 at 07:07 PM.

  7. #127
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Can someone explain to me, why its legal to ask someone who makes roughly $90,000 a year, to pay $104,000 plus $3,300 child support. And what the hell is alimony.

  8. #128
    The Lightbringer Ermahgerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    I'm not sure it needs to be ELIMINATED. Spouses who stay home to raise kids make valuable sacrifices. Permanent alimony, however, is complete nightmare fuel in its own right. It encourages the payee to simply sit on their ass and collect checks. If they find a new partner they simply move in and enjoy all the benefits of cohabitation without losing their alimony payment.

    Alimony needs to be limited. I'd say to 5 years, tops. That will allow the recipient to rehabilitate themselves into the workforce.
    Unless the man this thread is about is a multi millionaire then I would agree with you. But 3300/month and 104k/year is a RIDICULOUS amount.

    My mother can't work so she gets like 1100/month from the government (not sure what's it called in english) and she managed to raise my sister and me (though, my father helped my mother out as well) just well.

    Alimony is just really freaking stupid and it should be elimenated. I mean, c'mon! Both my parents combined don't even make 100k per year.

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by naturestorm View Post
    So you get married to have a social safety? Doesn't seem that romantic or even "marriage" worthy in the sense of what religion wanted you to know. But still I guess that's why a lot of people do it just for the benefits.
    Well, you get married to have someone to spend your life with, and to take care of you in sickness and in health...

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 07:10 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    Can someone explain to me, why its legal to ask someone who makes roughly $90,000 a year, to pay $104,000 plus $3,300 child support.
    We don't know that it is. All we have is him and his friend saying he is. Has anyone even found the court order/decision/judgement?

  10. #130
    There is a ton more going on in this case than we know. You don't incure 100k in legal fees over a divorce, that is 100% wrong unless something else is going on in the situation. You can't take them on contingency fees. The average lawyer charges between 300 and 500 and hour depending on their reputation. Do the math, divorce is actually rather simple and rarely requires the I don't know....200+ hours that 100k in legal fees would require at the absolute worst rate.

    Your alimony is based on your income there is a lot more going on than simple this guy is getting screwed. More than likely to actually serve time he tried to hide all his money and go caught and lost his job and generally refused to pay. If you can't pay you go to the court show them the change in your financial situation and the court redesigns the alimony. If he had 100k in legal fees and 200 hours of legal work, they would have done this because it takes little to no time to go and do. My guess is with a disabled wife he had a mistress among other things that allowed the judge to really stick it to him. Who inflicts the divorce can have issue, and he probably has other assets that allowed his income to be higher than 90k, if you make money you can hide money, especially trust money etc. There is a lot more going on here and without seeing any COURT, not my friend says, documentation this is a spin piece trying to get reform in the alimony area. Which isn't bad, but don't go thinking this is common way things work and that this "poor" guy is getting shafted. You don't incur what he did because he kindly left his wife, handicapped wife, and children.
    Last edited by Zoldor; 2012-12-08 at 07:15 PM.

  11. #131
    Dreadlord Lovecrafts's Avatar
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    Semaphore, how much alimony are you collecting exactly? :P
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Let's be clear: It's Pandaria, not 'panda land'. Everyone got the message?
    -Yes, yes let the anger FLOW through you.
    The community whined and bitched and cried, they stamped their little feet and demanded faster expansion releases. They don't get to complain now that expansions are shorter.

  12. #132
    Legendary! Tommo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    We don't know that it is. All we have is him and his friend saying he is. Has anyone even found the court order/decision/judgement?
    Ah well... then doesnt that make this thread kind of just, pointless speculation?

  13. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by Tommo View Post
    Ah well... then doesnt that make this thread kind of just, pointless speculation?
    More like blatant sensationalism.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 07:17 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Lovecrafts View Post
    Semaphore, how much alimony are you collecting exactly? :P
    You're making the massive assumption that: I can find someone to marry me

  14. #134
    Scarab Lord slime's Avatar
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    I love when this debate pops up - all women who get married suddenly turn into women that could've done so much with their lives and careers but gave it all up to get married...
    /rollseyes

  15. #135
    Dreadlord Lovecrafts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    More like blatant sensationalism.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 07:17 PM ----------


    You're making the massive assumption that: I can find someone to marry me
    With your entitled attitude and rabid support of the alimony system, I fear for that poor fellow who you manage to trick into your clutches
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Let's be clear: It's Pandaria, not 'panda land'. Everyone got the message?
    -Yes, yes let the anger FLOW through you.
    The community whined and bitched and cried, they stamped their little feet and demanded faster expansion releases. They don't get to complain now that expansions are shorter.

  16. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by slime View Post
    I love when this debate pops up - all women who get married suddenly turn into women that could've done so much with their lives and careers but gave it all up to get married...
    /rollseyes
    I love how when this debate pops up, people start to pretend women aren't more and more often becoming the ones paying alimony.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-08 at 07:28 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Lovecrafts View Post
    With your entitled attitude and rabid support of the alimony system, I fear for that poor fellow who you manage to trick into your clutches
    Shhh, that only comes out after marriage!

  17. #137
    Merely a Setback Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    I love how when this debate pops up, people start to pretend women aren't more and more often becoming the ones paying alimony.
    Often? Yeah....that's extremely subjective.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Both of those links don't provide any evidence. They make unsubstantiated statements

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by semaphore View Post
    I love how when this debate pops up, people start to pretend women aren't more and more often becoming the ones paying alimony.[COLOR="red"]
    As you so often demand from others, where is your source?

  19. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Zurtle View Post
    As you so often demand from others, where is your source?
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...8490YW20120510

    It's not like I was making an obscure or unbelievable claim. This has been well known for a long time.

    On second thought...

  20. #140
    Semaphore, I mean this in as nice a way possible, but your method of arguing is extremely abrasive. People don't care what statistics or studies say, they care about their own experiences. Experiences are what shape a person's perspective. If I, or someone I know, or any of these other posters and people they know have had this kind of crap happen, then it's happened. The fact that they don't have an encyclopedia article detailing it doesn't make it any less real, or any less valid. Given the sheer number of men complaining about settlements regarding alimony and child support, I'd say that's enough evidence that there's a serious problem in the system, and that it very often does favor the woman by default. And to be fair, I know you've stated that you agree it's not a perfect system and needs worked on, but I'm trying to offer constructive criticism here. The reason you never get the sourced evidence you ask for is because that's not what people go by. They go by experience.

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