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  1. #1

    unholy dk? are they still here and worth someting?

    hey guys.

    i'm almost done lvling my dk. and i love uholy.
    but when i look on this forum. i rarely see unholy dk post.
    almost all of them are blood/frost. so is unholy dk still viable. or is it just to much behind frost in a raid?

    and if not why are there not more unholy dks? there sould be a reason for it right?

  2. #2
    Most sims and parses have unholy doing pretty similar DPS to Frost. AFAIK, most people play frost regardless because it is easier to play, better for PvP and ramps up damage quicker. Plus, the better burst makes it nicer for doing dailies.

    There's an unholy DK in my raid group, he does pretty good DPS.

  3. #3
    From what I usually see as well, Frost will be the go to dps spec for most dk's. That may be because Frost sim's higher, the player doesn't like playing a spec with a pet, personal preference, ect ect. A lot goes into it, but don't worry that doesn't mean Unholy is totally dead. Most people I see though, don't like having to manage Timmy because in all honesty he is clunky and if he dies your dps suffers.

    Overall from my experiences Frost and Unholy are both raid viable. We have 2 dk's in my raid group (myself as unholy, the other as frost), and while we are pretty much the same gear give or take 1-2 items, I always come out far past his dps. In LFR's if I look at similar geared frost dk's they will usually be close but I overall end up beating them.

    If you take it down to sims, I am fairly sure that Frost actually does beat Unholy, in both DW and 2hander playstyles. But if you know what you are doing as Unholy you can certainly rock the meters.

    Imo, the main reason is timmy. People don't like pets! Although, I love pets and that is precisely why my dk is an orc, pet bonus, atp buff, it's just generally handy!
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  4. #4
    Herald of the Titans Lovestar's Avatar
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    I tried to roll Unholy before dumping it for a Blood offspec and maining Frost.

    For me the problem is that Unholy feels incredibly cumbersome. Frost is fluid, adaptable, and efficient in any situation. Unholy has a frankly ludicrous ramp-up time for both single and AoE unless you devote a lot of thought and attention to detail and/or are psychic. It's also much easier to scramble your Runes and get into really annoying configurations that leave you handicapped on useful things to do.

    And, I play a melee sword-swinging soldier type because I want the excitement of charging into battle on the front lines, blades flashing. Being transformed into a plate-clad babysitter spending all my time and attention breastfeeding buffs into a dumb pet which frequently becomes an incredible liability just... doesn't really fit the feel of what I'm looking for from a melee class. If I wanted to worry about a pet this much I'd roll a BM Hunter, you know?

    I'm not qualified to talk about whether Unholy does or does not have actual performance issues relative to other DPS specs. But personally, I just found the spec to be unremarkable at everything, have too many annoying things to worry about that just aren't very fun, and to feel really clunky/cumbersome compared to Frost, which is smooth as silk once you get the hang of it.

  5. #5
    i played unholy quite a long time and it was fun. unfortunately it seems, that frost does far more dps.
    yes yes yes, i know sims say they are near to each other, but in my opinion they are not.
    first, with unholy you have such a big ramp up time
    second, most of the encounters are very unholy unfriendly.

    so i specced to absolutely hated frost and dps is rollin'
    roughly 15k more dps and i'm not talking from burst.

    i'm sitting at around 7k haste, that was the point where unholy feels comfortable to play.
    hope with more gear the gap flats out a bit and unholy can catch up.

  6. #6
    I will be playing DW frost purely because my DK is a forsaken female. It would be a crim,e not to have her dual wield. All those damn flips!

    Although more on topic, play what you want. I am pretty sure you will do more DPS using a spec you actually enjoy.
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  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Lovestar View Post
    I tried to roll Unholy before dumping it for a Blood offspec and maining Frost.

    For me the problem is that Unholy feels incredibly cumbersome. Frost is fluid, adaptable, and efficient in any situation. Unholy has a frankly ludicrous ramp-up time for both single and AoE unless you devote a lot of thought and attention to detail and/or are psychic. It's also much easier to scramble your Runes and get into really annoying configurations that leave you handicapped on useful things to do.

    And, I play a melee sword-swinging soldier type because I want the excitement of charging into battle on the front lines, blades flashing. Being transformed into a plate-clad babysitter spending all my time and attention breastfeeding buffs into a dumb pet which frequently becomes an incredible liability just... doesn't really fit the feel of what I'm looking for from a melee class. If I wanted to worry about a pet this much I'd roll a BM Hunter, you know?

    I'm not qualified to talk about whether Unholy does or does not have actual performance issues relative to other DPS specs. But personally, I just found the spec to be unremarkable at everything, have too many annoying things to worry about that just aren't very fun, and to feel really clunky/cumbersome compared to Frost, which is smooth as silk once you get the hang of it.
    You're calling unholy clunky....lol...Unholy is a lot more smooth if you actually know how to play it in comparison to frost. Frosts damage is relied entirely on killing machine procs. If you dont get them you dont do awesome damage. It's an rng spec but granted since mop it has gotten a LOT better for 2H at least. I actually want to play unholy over frost but all the guilds I find want the top damage spec which is right now frost.

  8. #8
    Unholy is better when you have a short phase you want to finish as quickly as possible even at the expense of overall damage, and also has a better execute phase.

    Frost is better at pretty much everything else.

    Most people go with the spec that's more useful more often.

  9. #9
    Bloodsail Admiral Skeletroll's Avatar
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    I've always wondered why blizz didn't made unholy spec some kind of melee-spellcaster, casting all kind of shit like original death knights, and using +int plate.
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Skeletroll View Post
    I've always wondered why blizz didn't made unholy spec some kind of melee-spellcaster, casting all kind of shit like original death knights, and using +int plate.
    yea that would be realy good:P.

    also thx guys. good to know there still guys doing good as unholy:P.
    so far in in dungeons i'm doing good. always the first or sec. most of the times i'm way above the rest of the dps.

  11. #11
    Not only is Unholy a lot harder to master and play, it also simply doesn't work for some encounters as well as Frost.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Vereesà View Post
    Not only is Unholy a lot harder to master and play, it also simply doesn't work for some encounters as well as Frost.
    This is probably the best way to put it. Unholy will challenge you more, and some fights just simply favor frost a lot more.

  13. #13
    People play Frost because most of the fights have stupid gimmicky mechanics which affects Unholy's ability to do damage, no other reason really. Unholy does surpass Frost on a few fights though, namely: Sha, Elegon.

  14. #14
    I play as Blood tank myself but frost offspec I was DW but at the moment 2handed due to better 2handed wep. Unholy is grate fun though one of the DK's in our guild stands by it and does very good DPS.

    Just play the spec you enjoy not for the numbers. The end of the day the chances of you being in one of the top guilds in the world where it would matter what spec you are will be slim. Meaning just go with what you enjoy playing so what if it does 4% less dps than DW frost or 2handed This is a game so have some fun.

  15. #15
    Field Marshal Jarg's Avatar
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    We are doing fine, and actually there are more unholy death knights out there, but i agree, its not that popular now, because of the insane ammount of rapid bursts of frost. If you liked unholy in cata you will like it now too. (would like to add: you need a healthy ammount (5-6k) haste to play it fluidly with blood tap, atleast thats my experience)
    We are also doing compareble damage to frost death knights, Magdalena has made a thread about it on the US forums. (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/7350535124)

  16. #16
    I think, many of you guys are really underestimating a unholy dk.
    I have been playing unholy for many years now, even if frost was a better alternative (expect for Ragnaros or Garalon). I was always competitive. If you don't believe me, you can check for Unholy DKs on WoL, you will find me on top in 25man HC and 10man HC.
    It's true, that Unholy is a harder to master, but you can essentially play unholy on every fight.
    There are more fights than Sha and Elegon which favors Unholy. Spirit Kings HC in the first weeks was also better for unholy because of the strong execute. Empress HC also has a longer execute phase, because you have to take so many healers with you.

    You have to differentiate between effective dps and dps overall. Spirit Kings is the perfect example. You could cleave both targets as frost, but as unholy, you help to kill the 30%-king faster, because your execute is so much stronger. and spirit kings is so much easier, when the lower king dies so much faster.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Vereesà View Post
    Not only is Unholy a lot harder to master and play
    When did this happen?

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Domiku View Post
    I play as Blood tank myself but frost offspec I was DW but at the moment 2handed due to better 2handed wep. Unholy is grate fun though one of the DK's in our guild stands by it and does very good DPS.

    Just play the spec you enjoy not for the numbers. The end of the day the chances of you being in one of the top guilds in the world where it would matter what spec you are will be slim. Meaning just go with what you enjoy playing so what if it does 4% less dps than DW frost or 2handed This is a game so have some fun.
    yea. i think i'll do that. and i will just start raiding since i finally found a daytime raiding guild:P. and there still doing normals. so learn to get out of stuff would be better:P

  19. #19
    Would people who say that UH is fine please step out? No one cares if you ranked in top10, it doesn't make the specc any better then frost.

    Here are some loggs to show the diffrence in all bosses of Heart of Fear:

    Frost: http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/ .
    Unholy: http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    Only reason the guy pulled those UH numbers is cause he has a heroic Sha weapon, probably fully upgraded. The 2nd guy is 7k DPS behind.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    A good fight for Unholy, seeing as the boss moves around quite a bit, yet, UH still behind.

    I'll ignore Garalon cause that's obviously a frost specc encounter due to the good burst and target swapping for legs.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    Depends on how your guild does this fight, but sitll, Frost is still stronger since it's great to have the frost burst on the boss with the dmg buff.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    Fairly balanced fight, depends on who loggs though and if they get transformed.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/rankings/..._Death_Knight/
    Great fight for UH, especially with the long execute phase.

    Not only is Unholy a lot harder to master and play, it also simply doesn't work for some encounters as well as Frost.
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  20. #20
    Herald of the Titans Varyk's Avatar
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    It's not competitive with Frost right now. Anyone who says otherwise because "herp derp I top meters in my guild" is pretty clueless. DW Frost is where you want to be, with 2H not far behind (not enough to avoid playing it, like Unholy).

    Of course you could always play whatever you prefer, but if you're looking for the optimal spec DW Frost (stacking mastery) is the way to go.

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