1. #1
    Pandaren Monk Sunnydee's Avatar
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    blood, why not haste?

    Im kinda curious why no1 is going full haste/mastery ( after hit/exp that is)

    shouldnt it be better then some louzy +dodge/parry?

  2. #2
    because 10% more haste would give you 10% more death strikes, therefore 10% more "hps" whereas 10% more avoidance will reduce the damage you take by 10%.
    Seeing how damage taken exceeds your own "hps" in most scenarios, avoidance is the better choise. Obviously my math is pure estimate and by no means accurate, but this pretty much sums it up.

  3. #3
    Immortal Soisoisoi's Avatar
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    People go avoidance spec as DKs still? Just stack Mastery and win, sheesh.


    OT: Because you benefit more from Mastery and the other stats than you do with Haste. I rarely find myself in need of a rune to DS whilst tanking.

  4. #4
    High Overlord rhapso's Avatar
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    dodge/parry still is a good stat, even though its not as good as mastery, since you can time your death strikes and dodge/parry (and miss) are pure RNG.
    But imagine a world where you're running around with 0% avoidance, that would be pure hell - you still need some avoidance ;-) and haste is just really really weak in terms of survival, you can't get to high levels of haste anyway.

    if you're trying to get a good set for soloing stuff, that's a different story, but please dont try to tank actual content with haste/mastery gear.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by rhapso View Post
    dodge/parry still is a good stat, even though its not as good as mastery, since you can time your death strikes and dodge/parry (and miss) are pure RNG.
    But imagine a world where you're running around with 0% avoidance, that would be pure hell - you still need some avoidance ;-) and haste is just really really weak in terms of survival, you can't get to high levels of haste anyway.

    if you're trying to get a good set for soloing stuff, that's a different story, but please dont try to tank actual content with haste/mastery gear.
    Haste is king on Lei-shi actually, as there's no physical damage only magic. And haste > all stats on magic dmg only fights.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Pieterman View Post
    because 10% more haste would give you 10% more death strikes, therefore 10% more "hps" whereas 10% more avoidance will reduce the damage you take by 10%.
    Seeing how damage taken exceeds your own "hps" in most scenarios, avoidance is the better choise. Obviously my math is pure estimate and by no means accurate, but this pretty much sums it up.
    You can't say 10% avoidance is the equivalent of 10% damage reduction, that's obscene. Also, getting more Death Strikes also means faster Blood Shield generation which is equal to damage reduction.

    OT: Haven't done any math on this, but I'd assume the haste gain for DKs just isn't worth it currently and that's why people prefer avoidance after hit/exp and mastery.

    Quote Originally Posted by falagar112 View Post
    Haste is king on Lei-shi actually, as there's no physical damage only magic. And haste > all stats on magic dmg only fights.
    If you're going to go out of your way to set up your gear for Lei Shi specifically, stamina is the best survival stat.
    Last edited by Vereesa; 2012-12-10 at 08:27 PM.
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  7. #7
    Bloodsail Admiral Hugh Wattmate's Avatar
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    Because haste is only good if you are already hit/exp cap. Doing that means less mastery and a smaller shield. If you were to go with haste the state order would be:

    Stam till 600k (ish) > Hit > Exp > Haste > Mastery > Strength > Parry > Dodge.

    You would end up in current gear to get that 10% haste with under 100% master and around 17% parry 9% dodge with hit and exp caps. So its not worth going for haste at least not in current kit. Not just this but you would just end up hitting DS more and getting more BS's but that means smaller shields more often instead of big shields that last longer. Its much better to get hit for large damage and build a big shield up or to build a shield up and then take a big hit and soak it than having crap loads of tiny shields. You need that mastery to help live after the big hits.
    Last edited by Hugh Wattmate; 2012-12-10 at 08:38 PM.

  8. #8
    I'm currently going hit>exp(7.5)>mastery>haste and at ilvl 497 with mostly well itemized items I only end up with 1391 haste >_>
    On top of it not being hard to stack haste is also not as good as it could be both for dps and survivability

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-10 at 10:46 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by falagar112 View Post
    Haste is king on Lei-shi actually, as there's no physical damage only magic. And haste > all stats on magic dmg only fights.
    Idk about haste on a boss where you already get loads of RP through ams.
    Armories:
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Nillo View Post
    Idk about haste on a boss where you already get loads of RP through ams.
    It's just reforging, it's worth it. You get even more DS's in and your Blood shield doesn't matter so Mastery is crap and Avoidance doesn't matter so that's crap too.

    I just went in with full DPS gear and easily survived. If you have survivability issues get Spellbreaking on your tanking weapon. And get a priority of HIT > EXP > HASTE, no need to change gems or enchants though.

  10. #10
    Haste is a very weak stat for blood. Pretty much a waste.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Haste is a very weak stat for blood. Pretty much a waste.
    Not on a pure magical fight like Lei'shi.

  12. #12
    Haste is actually stronger than Hit/Expertise on the overall scale for survivability, and that's even with a low weight attached to healing done. However, in terms of convenience, you will notice hit/expertise far more easily, as haste benefits you uniformly and passively.

    I don't remember how it ranks for DPS compared to hit/expertise.

  13. #13
    High Overlord rhapso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSHA778 View Post
    Haste is actually stronger than Hit/Expertise on the overall scale for survivability, and that's even with a low weight attached to healing done. However, in terms of convenience, you will notice hit/expertise far more easily, as haste benefits you uniformly and passively.
    It depends HEAVILY on what content you're working on and what focus you have. IF you actually not want to die, then haste isn't going to help you. It gives you more OVERALL dps/hps, but nothing against unfortunate burst - which is the most common cause of tank death. If you want to minimize the chance of dying by such an event, pure mitigation stats help you way more.
    And you're healers won't notice if you've taken 100dmg less on every hit, but they will notice if you've died ;-)

    And OT: Dodge and Parry help you tremendously with DS timing. You don't have to spam every DS instantly only to get a minimal heal + minimal shield. Imagine you parrying a boss 3 times. A DS in that case is useless (survivalwise). Wait a bit, w/o capping rune, and use it as soon as you have taken some dmg and it helps you more than changing your stats.

    Tyvi wrote a beautiful article about that topic (Timing DS and the correlation with avoidance) on EJ:
    ht tp: // elitistjerks . com/f72/t130560-blood_tanking_actively_mitigating_since_before_cool/#Timing_Death_Strike
    So before you say parry/dodge is louzy, read this article. Sorry for the cutted link.

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