Jedi Knight - Guardian: Gearing & Speccing

[WarpedAcorn]

So I bit the bullet and came back to play SWTOR. I rerolled a JK with one of my fancy new character slots and decided to give Guardian a go (I already have a Sentinel). But I am a little curious about how to spec and gear.

When I played an Assassin/Shadow, the "best" way to PvP and Level was in the Tank (KC/Darkness) tree and with DPS gear. For PvE it was in the shared tree (Balance/Madness). Is something like this the case with the Guardian?

I've read things all over the place, but what keeps coming up is Tank spec in DPS gear or full tank gear with a Hybrid build. So I'm more than a little confused and would really appreciate some input.

[Deleted]

When I played an Assassin/Shadow, the "best" way to PvP and Level was in the Tank (KC/Darkness) tree and with DPS gear. For PvE it was in the shared tree (Balance/Madness). Is something like this the case with the Guardian?

I've read things all over the place, but what keeps coming up is Tank spec in DPS gear or full tank gear with a Hybrid build. So I'm more than a little confused and would really appreciate some input.

I think it depends on what you want to do, do you want to power level to 50 ASAP (go full DPS tree and gear) or take your time and learn the tanking potential (go tanking tree and tanking gear)? At max level do you want to tank HM's & Ops or DPS them? In PvP do you want to be a tank, damage dealer or a bit of both?
When I levelled my Juggernaut I went from 1-50 in the immortal (tanking) tree and geared for tanking....stacking defence, shield and absorbtion. I'm not saying that is the 'best' way to do it but it allowed me to get used to my keybinds and learn the abilities for tanking in group environments also I didn't find it painful as I mostly used my DPS companion and kept his gear up to date so the mobs dropped at a reasonable rate.

I love the protection aspect of tanking in PvP so I currently use full tanking gear (a part from the 2 DPS armouring mods to get the 2 set bonus) and a hybrid talent setup (27/12/2) which gives excellent protection/ball carrier abilities but is rubbish for damage.
I have to say Unremitting is absolute class for PvP tanking.....sorry I couldn't help myself.

I'm not an expert but may be able to answer some of your easier questions if you let me know what you want to focus on.

Good luck

[WarpedAcorn]

Thanks Bolverk. I'm really looking to focus more on the tanking aspect in both PvP and PvE. I've got plenty of DPS characters at this point. =)

[Elgand]

I tank in PvP and PvE on my guardian. I run full defense/vigilance. The Defense tree is fully specced with guardian slash, and the remaining points are in the vigilance tree. I prefer this spec because it works well both in PvP and PvE. My gear is War Leader where necessary, and Vindicator where it makes sense. The Vindicator implants have more endurance than the War leader, and the Vindicator implants also have accuracy so I chose them.

There are three primary specs for tanking in PvP. Two of these specs are really hybrid specs, and do not function well for PvE. I tried the popular Tank/DPS hybrid build with an even split between Focus and Defense, and did not like it. You lose the 4 second stun from the defense tree, and also lose the increased focus generation from the defense tree. It does put out more damage through force sweep and zealous leap, but isn't worth it imho.

The other option is Vigilance/Defense. It does lend itself to huttball more, because you can't be pushed or pulled after leaping. I disliked the spec because again you lose the focus generation and 4 second stun.

In full defense with the remainder in vigilance I routinely do 150k-300k damage in a warzone, and 100k+ protection. If I am below 100k protection it is because the enemy team is undergeared.

As Focus/Defense I would do 200k-350k damage with 40kish protection. Zealous leap is nice, but i missed the stun ALOT.

I haven't ran Vigilance/Defense since the expertise changes, so my information is somewhat outdated. In this spec I achieved the same dps as Full Defense/vigilance, but had more burst. It was very nice for fighting healers. It is also amazing for huttball.

All three of these specs rely on soresu form. The only spec I would recommend for PvE and PvP is Full defense with the remainded in vigilance.

[WarpedAcorn]

Thanks for the info. So in a PvE environment you would not recommend a Vigilence/Defense spec? That's the one I keep hear as "recommended", but that might be endgame when you have crazy gear and you need the bonus damage from Vigilence to maintain aggro.

As for PvP, what should the stat priority be? I remember that guarded damage comes straight off your HP, so Endurance should be a higher value than Shield or Absorbtion right?

[Elgand]

Correct, My experience has been mitigation stats Endurance>Defense>Shield>Shield Absorb. Offensive stats STR>Accuracy to 100>Power> don't know after power, used to be surge/crit completely unsure now as i haven't been able to work out the math etc. Vig/Defense for PvE will function, but in my experience the defense tree offers more innate resists. Blade barrier, Shield specialization, and Warding call are all quite necessary for tanking. The vigilance builds I have seen are nearly full vigilance, with only a minor emhpasis on Defense. There may be a good hybrid, but I haven't seen or used it.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#50...0MZcGrMMhzzM.2

This would likely work well for PvE, but not take advantage of most of the PvP elements attainable from vigilance. It allows for a good amount of mitigation, but commanding awe wont be as functional in PvE. The defense tree with guardian slash will stack sunder just as well, and takes advantage of shield specialization. This spec will work for PvE, with the primary difference being overhead slash instead of guardian slash. For PvP it needs some tweaks, namely with removing the channel time on force hold/choke.

[Deleted]

If you want to tank in PvE, as Elgand has stated, I would avoid hybrid skill setups concentrate on the Immortal/Defense tree, I ran with a 32/7/2 setup when I was PvE tanking, that said I have never been a cutting edge PvEer.

For PvP tanking, taking up the roles of protection, interrupts, solo defence of a base or ball carrier I would look at This. Some of the info is a little out of date, particularly the gear, but the overall advice is still sound. The 27/12/2/ spec allows you to keep your 4 sec stun on backhand/hilt strike but it opens up Unstoppable/Unremitting. The 20% damage reduction and 8 seconds CC immunity + your CC breaker is an absolute dream when solo defending a base.

As with Elgand I use mostly War Leader but use 2 Vindicator armouring mods for the 8% heal on intercede/guardian leap. Remember when hp are getting a little low to use endure pain/enure before you leap and use enraged defence/focused defence as this will increase your maximum hp thus increase the size of the 2 self heals (as they heal for a % of your max hp). Sorry if that was too obvious but I thought I would mention it.
I make no attempt to get damage numbers, I use smash and sweeping strikes to lower the accuracy of attackers rather than rack up numbers etc. but my style fits my team.....I am in the team to keep people alive longer, interrupt the opposing team's healers, defend bases or carry the ball, not kill people or rack up damage numbers.

---------- Post added 2012-12-12 at 07:31 PM ----------

Sorry I wrote the above before #6 and #7 were posted but went afk before posting

[WarpedAcorn]

Thanks guys. =)

[Elgand]

Well you did me a huge favor man. Whilst making that spec for you I noticed ALOT of things that have changed since I last played. It looks like Vigilance/Defense is a completely viable and actually the best spec possible for tanking in PvP. Overhead slash is just THAT much better than guardian slash, Commanding Awe is THAT much better than shield specialization, and unremitting is AMAZING.

Basically with my old playstyle I would have a my stun to keep people from running away, but with Unremitting I simply can't be cc'd and stick to them like no other. Guardian slash has a 15 second cooldown with nothing lowering that number, while overhead slash is currently at a 9 second cooldown with the Vigilance talent. Overhead slash also pumps out quite a bit more damage. Commanding Awe is a flat 4% less damage, while Shield specialization is 4% shield chance, which in real world scenarios means about 2% less damage. Losing hilt strike may suck, but it's really not as valuable as Unremitting.

In this spec im putting out 250k+ damage per warzone, with 100k+ protection easily. I don't feel any less tanky, and in fact with Focused Defense popped and commanding awe feel unkillable.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#50...zMZcGrMMhzzM.2

Enjoy it man. Im sure this spec will work well in operations too, I plan on working through EC with it this Thursday to see if there is any real change. I should have more threat, but sunder wont stack quite as fast. Having more damage reduction from commanding awe should be nice.

[Odegon]

nice build but I have a question:

Is it viable to make 0/23/18 build and use it in soresu form?

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#50...MhzzMZur0rdc.2

maybe something like this?

[Deleted]

nice build but I have a question:

Is it viable to make 0/23/18 build and use it in soresu form?

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#50...MhzzMZur0rdc.2

maybe something like this?

As I said earlier I am far from an expert but to me that build is leaning more towards higher DPs numbers at the sacrifce of survivability.
I think in PvE unless you outgear your environement that set up will make for interesting times for your healer.
In PvP I know there is an argument that says the defensive abilities/skills are not as useful as in PvE as a decent team will use their casters on the Juggs/Guardians so their defensive/shielding abilities/skills have no effect but I still find I stick around a lot longer when I go with a more defensive skill setup.
Yes by using Soresu form you can stick your guard on someone and working taunt into the group fights will give you noticable prot numbers, IMHO you will not be able to fully carry out your protection/interrupt/defending/ball carrying duties as effectively.
Again just my hummble opinon but I think every PvP tank spec needs - Inner peace, Hilt Strike, Stasis Mastery, WARDING CALL and Unremitting.