1. #1

    Question What Glyphs/Talents to use and when to switch to Berserker Stance when Fury in raids

    Hi!

    I am trying to setup a list with best talents/glyphs and when to use Berserker Stance at every single raid encounter. I've made a preliminairy list, but seeing I'm 'just' a normal raider (with just 1 HC boss down this tier) and not extremely good at theorycrafting at all, this list is probably FULL of errors. Can you guys take a look at it? If you spot any errors or want to add information, be sure to leave a post.

    Toughts in mind when I wrote the list. I haven't used Bladestorm at all. Anywhere. Collision mentioned in a topic he ran several simcraft simulations, and in every situation, Dragon Roar was better then Bladestorm (due to the lower cooldown and the fact that it lines up perfectly with Bloodbath, every second Colossus Smash and the Engineering Synapse Springs (or, possibly, the 5.1 trinket). Furthermore, I never noted the Glyph of Colossus Smash, seeing I was lazy and figured out that a raidgroup could already have someone else giving the Sunder buff. The Berserker Stances i've noted are ones where you get a significant ragebuff (so don't add 'maybe's' to the list).

    So, can you guys check it out? Thanks!


    What Talents and Glyphs to use as a Fury Warrior while raiding in MoP and when to use Berserker Stance?
    NOTE: the choices noted are merely 'standard'. Remember that this does not mean these are the best choises for YOU.
    Example: when having problems surviving it might be better for YOU and YOUR group to rather use a defensive glyph or to take another talent.



    Mogu'shan Vaults
    Stone Guards
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Raging Wind, Death From Above
    Berserker Stance:

    Feng the Accursed
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush / Raging Wind (heroic)
    Berserker Stance: During Arcane Velocity, Draw Flame and Epicenter

    Gara'Jal
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush
    Berserker Stance: During Voodoo Doll debuff

    Spirit Kings
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush/Raging Wind (TG only)
    Berserker Stance:

    Elegon
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Piercing Howl, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Whirlwind (If you stand on Elegon, you will be able to hit all energy charges)
    Berserker Stance: During Phase 3

    Will of the Emperor
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Piercing Howl, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Enraged Speed
    Berserker Stance: During Titan Gas (heroic)


    Heart of Fear
    Imperial Vizier Zor'Lok
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush
    Berserker Stance: During Force and Verve

    Blade Lord Ta'Yak
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush
    Berserker Stance: During Unseen Strike, Storm Unleashed (<20% life phase)

    Garalon
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Raging Wind
    Berserker Stance: possibly during Crash?

    Wind Lord Mel'Jarak
    Talents: Juggernaut, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Disrupting Shout, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Raging Wind / Rude Interruption
    Berserker Stance: During Rain of Blades

    Ambershaper Un'Sok
    Talents: Juggernaut/Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Raging Wind
    Berserker Stance:

    Grand Empress Shek'Zeer
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Disrupting Shout, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Raging Wind
    Berserker Stance: During Phase 3


    Terrace of Endless Spring
    Protectors of the Endless
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Disrupting Shout, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Rude Interruption
    Berserker Stance:

    Tsulong
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush
    Berserker Stance: Nightphases (the more stacks, the more you will benefit)

    Lei Shi
    Talents: Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush
    Berserker Stance: During Get Away!

    Sha of Fear
    Talents: Juggernaut/Double Time, Second Wind/Impending Victory, Dragon Roar, Safeguard, Bloodbath
    Glyphs: Unending Rage, Death From Above, Bull Rush/Raging Wind
    Berserker Stance:
    Last edited by Beauterham; 2012-12-14 at 12:28 AM.

  2. #2
    I made a berserker stance "guide" post a few days ago, but it's buried in some random thread...I'll dig it up for you. I don't mean to hijack your thread!

    Glyph note: Unending Rage and Death from Above are always used on every boss encounter, so you really only have to decide what your third glyph will be based on the fight.

    Upon reading your post, I agree with most of your glyph assignments except for Elegon, WOTE, Wind Lord and Sha of Fear.

    Elegon: I would swap Raging Wind for Whirlwind, as glyphing whirlwind allows you to hit all the energy charges when they spawn assuming you stand directly under Elegon.

    WOTE (Heroic): I would swap Bull Rush for Enraged Speed. I do this simply because having to dodge 10 devastating arcs in a row can be a pain and it's possible that you won't always be in the best position to dodge them. Enraged speed can mean the difference between a free 1 million damage strike, or even life and death if heroic leap is on cooldown. Also, most of the time the rage gains from Bull Rush won't be needed because you pretty much have unlimited rage from Titan Gas.

    Wind Lord: IMO, rude interruption is inferior to unending rage due to the adds not casting frequently enough for you to have a very high uptime and also the fact that you get a full rage bar every time the boss casts rain of blades. In addition to that, execute hits like a truck with the debuff on the boss, and you will want to be able to pool more rage for more damage.

    Sha of Fear: Sometimes those shielded adds spawn somewhat near the boss, allowing you RB/WW cleave, so I usually go with Raging Wind here. However, if the adds never spawn in that position then you would have been better off with bull rush, the choice is yours.

    Also, keep in mind that for most fights where Bull Rush is listed, you can swap it with Bloodthirst/Shield Wall/Enraged Speed if for some reason you think you need the extra survivability or mobility. The DPS loss is minimal.

    Berserker Stance:


    Quote Originally Posted by Gromnak View Post
    Berserker stance is very good and can be used for substantial DPS increases on several encounters this tier. I'll list the situations where I personally use berserker stance below. I can currently only comment on 6/6H MSV and 5/6H HoF but I will add more when I do the other fights on heroic (if necessary).

    DISCLAIMER: If you die trying to use any of the following methods to increase your DPS, that is your own fault. Good luck and have fun! =)

    MSV Normal & Heroic

    Stone Guard: Depends on the situation, if you are chained to a derp ranged/healer that doesn't come to melee then swap to zerker for a dps increase.....or run to them and lose dps =)

    If you have high HP from good gear, then you can run over a cobalt mine on purpose for a full rage bar with no fear of dying, should probably get your disc priest to shield you just to be safe though.

    Also, remember to stand in amethyst pools for rage until someone yells at you, then just say you were lagging.

    Feng: Arcane velocity + Draw Flame + Epicenter if your guild lets it go off for some reason

    Garajal: Voodoo Doll debuff + if you use vigilance on the tank

    Spirit kings: Qiang's massive attack (only worth it on heroic, normal/LFR damage is too low for good rage gains) + attacking Meng when he's at high energy (use enraged regen/healhstone/DBTS to avoid dying), swap to zerker stance when the shadow shield goes up if you know someone in your guild is gonna fail.....one broken shield won't wipe the raid if everyone is topped off, and it gives you a full rage bar!)

    Don't be afraid to take a tick or two of Subetai's volley for rage if you are at full hp, just say you were lagging again.

    Elegon: Burn phase (Last 30%)

    WotE: Titan Gas (Titan Gas is always up on heroic mode)


    HoF Normal & 5/6 Heroic:

    Vizier: force and verve, attenuation....get hit by the rings by "accident" towards the end of the phase to not risk dying. Also, swap to berserker stance a second before he mind controls people just incase he chooses you. If you happen to get mind controlled with berserker stance up....congratulations you just got 120 rage!

    Blade Lord: Before each Unseen Strike goes off swap to zerker stance, in the last phase sub 20% you should be in zerker stance the entire time getting full or near-full rage executes off.

    Garalon: Swap to zerker for each Crush and then swap back, if it's normal mode then you can stand in pheromones for rage, on heroic it's too risky as they deal a lot more damage.

    Wind Lord: Swap to zerk stance before each Rain of Blades for a full rage bar (note: you can parry it all by using DBTS, but you should just take the damage for a DPS incresae unless your HP is so low that doing so would kill you, in which case you should indeed use DBTS), stand in the first Whirling Blade (leaving boss) for a good chunk of rage.......and if you're on normal mode try to coordinate a wind bomb explosion with a ranged friend for more rage, then he can just say he was lagging.

    Amber Shaper: Burning amber slime pools on the ground......stand in them a lot on normal. On heroic, only stand in them if you have high health and you are low on rage, just remember to blame it on latency issues if you get caught.

    Berserker stance is also pretty useful for all of phase 2 due to the massive stomp and all the little slimes hitting you to due WW/RB cleave aggro + more slime pools. Phase 3 can be worth it as well, depends on the raid damage.

    Empress: Swap to zerker for each explosion, swap to zerker for the last phase (constant raid damage)


    Terrace Normal

    Protectors of the Endless (Elite): Stand in the defiled ground for a bit, just enough to not get yelled at....and then when you are at full or near-full HP, go ahead and take a tick of the expel corruption explosion and just rinse and repeat. You'll probably have the debuff on you as well to generate even more rage.

    Tsulong: Berserker stance is used for the whole Night phase due to constant raid damage, remember to delay resetting your stacks as long as possible for more rage.

    Lei Shi: You can get hit by Spray by "accident" but that's pretty risky and I personally don't do it. The "Get Away" phase is nice for rage though, make the most out of that.

    Sha: Not many viable uses on this fight, just don't try to avoid the shadow circles if they are going to land on you, swap to zerk stance and stand in them instead. Use Berserker stance for Death Blossom as well.

  3. #3
    Thanks for the response dude! Helps a lot.

    I've implemented some of the changes you mentioned (It's kinda late now, so I'll give it another look tomorrow). I didn't add all your Berserker Stance situations btw, seeing I want this to be an easy checklist that could help out a lot of players, not only hardcore raiders, but mostly 'normal' raiders. I don't think telling them to pretend they are lagging is something normal raiders are waiting for. Eventhough the situations you mention are quite useful to know, good thing it's directly underneath the first post.

    Thanks again!

  4. #4
    A good thread this. I must say I do agree with the choices as they stand now (assuming they were changed at some point). Good job man! I think I'm gonna use this for reference so I won't forget to swap out stuff on bosses even though a lot of it is on farm.

    I would however possibly go Bladestorm on wind lord on heroic. Adds will go down faster, making the boss go into his frenzy mode quicker which allows for a quicker kill. I haven't theorycrafted it, but seeing that DR would hit like a truck when he's frenzied I might be wrong. As I said, I haven't theorycrafted it so it's hard to say which is the superior. Worth a thought though
    Last edited by vonVaffel; 2012-12-14 at 12:42 AM.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by vonVaffel View Post
    A good thread this. I must say I do agree with the choices as they stand now (assuming they were changed at some point). Good job man! I think I'm gonna use this for reference so I won't forget to swap out stuff on bosses even though a lot of it is on farm.

    I would however possibly go Bladestorm on wind lord on heroic. Adds will go down faster, making the boss go into his frenzy mode quicker which allows for a quicker kill. I haven't theorycrafted it, but seeing that DR would hit like a truck when he's frenzied I might be wrong. As I said, I haven't theorycrafted it so it's hard to say which is the superior. Worth a thought though

    Apparantly, at least for SMF, Dragon Roar beats Bladestorm on every scenario. For Titan's Grip Bladestorm 'might' be better in certain scenario's, but unless someone can actually prove it with some simcraft results I'll just leave it like this.

    Underneath Collisions post, explaining why Dragon Roar is better then Bladestorm:

    Every. Single. Scenario.

    Trust me, I didn't want to believe it either. But it all comes down to cooldown-synergy.

    Bladestorm hits 6 times at 120% weapon damage from both hands.
    MH is 31k per hit, OH is 26k. So, 6x 31k + 6x 26k. Add them all up, and that's 342k damage.

    Dragon roar hits for 220k on the same profile, so by those numbers alone Bladestorm is better.

    But you can also do 1.5 dragon roars for every bladestorm.

    So, multiply that all together.

    220k * 1.5 = 330k damage, or only slightly worse than bladestorm.

    This isn't even considering that dragon roar lines up perfectly with bloodbath and your engineering tinker. It also doesn't prevent you from doing other actions for 6 seconds. Once you add in cooldowns, dragon roar becomes about 4-6% better than bladestorm.

    For TG, more than likely bladestorm is still better. But I'll have to run that another day.

    Just wanting to add, that on fights where you don't have to use a scenario specific glyph (like Rude Interruption, Enraged Speed, etc.) AND you are Titans Grip, you can also consider taking Glyph of Raging Wind. This glyph makes Whirlwind a slightly better replacement for non-bloodsurge proc Wildstrikes.

  6. #6
    I would beg to differ on that. If you check the top 10 man heroic fury warrior logs, you'll find me at 5th. fury warrior. The others above me are also using bladestorm on that fight. You cannot sim windlord in itself, making it hard to prove my point that bladestorm is better than DR on that particular fight. The aforementioned post you quote doesn't take into account the fact that it's AoE we're talking about here.
    Again, I'm only advocating BS usage on wind lord, not any other bosses.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by vonVaffel View Post
    I would beg to differ on that. If you check the top 10 man heroic fury warrior logs, you'll find me at 5th. fury warrior. The others above me are also using bladestorm on that fight. You cannot sim windlord in itself, making it hard to prove my point that bladestorm is better than DR on that particular fight. The aforementioned post you quote doesn't take into account the fact that it's AoE we're talking about here.
    Again, I'm only advocating BS usage on wind lord, not any other bosses.
    Agreed.

    We have like 5 warriors in my guild and the ones using dragons roar just could not keep up. Bladestorm just pulls way ahead.

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