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  1. #1

    Stop blaming healers.

    I was in a LBRS run the other day on my paladin, decided to use heals. Dungeon was going pretty good. I'm confident in my ability to heal and took the time to learn what spells are useful for what situation (and use healbot for quicker button access). I've raided with priest and druid before, sometimes topping, and I'm pretty familiar with how healing is supposed to work.

    First time I've run this place at the appropriate level (blitzed it at max before). We get to a boss (can't remember the name) that decides to polymorph 3 of us at the same time, including me. It seems like it must have lasted 6-7 seconds. The boss switched targets, and attacked a DPS, killing him in about 5 seconds, before I was even able to cast any heals (I was spamming the holy shock button to cast as soon as it broke, but it was too late).

    It happened again, and the tank died this time. We wipe, and as we're running back, I ask if there's a way to avoid the polymorph mechanic. Nobody tells me anything. I find out that someone attempted to kick me. No, it didn't pass, but it told me that someone thought I was responsible for the wipe. I did everything I possibly could, and any healer would have had the same results (impossible to heal = they die). The next time we got lucky enough for me not to get poly'd, and the fight went without a single hitch.

    Why do people immediately jump to blame the healer when someone dies? Why do they assume that it wasn't something they were standing in, or a mechanic they were unable to avoid, or worse yet, the healer was CC'd?

    I know what I was doing (even though I wasn't familiar with the mechanic there, but should we be reading tankspot or some crap for old 5 man dungeons? No). There are a lot of bad healers, sure, but death isn't always their fault. Stop trying to blame them, it makes people not want to heal anymore.

  2. #2
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    People have come to expect full heirlooms. And that brings with it a sense of tanks being invincible.
    Unsubscribed as of 03/10/2014.

    If you dislike where WoW is headed in your mind, quit. Really. Sitting around complaining about "promises" that may or may not have been made isn't doing anything to help your cause. It's just making you look more and more like the constantly complaining and perpetually offended.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    People have come to expect full heirlooms. And that brings with it a sense of tanks being invincible.
    The tanks aren't always invincible, though. I am currently leveling on another server (and I've done both tank and heals) and can get decent gear from dungeons anyway. In fact, this brewmaster tank was quite frail. Actually, out of all the 5 mans I've done, LBRS has been the only one with real wipes.

    Until heirlooms are cross-realm, people will have to learn that many people won't have heirlooms.

  4. #4
    You just took your negative experience and projected it onto the whole of WoW. Tanks get blamed, too. Even DPS do, though not as much. It also depends on the people.

    I've been kicked from H AN in Wrath for dying on the first boss a few times. My tank toon (an alt) had 27k HP, decent dodge/parry values, was defense capped for raid tanking and completely gemmed/enchanted. My gear was a mix of 200 blues/epics and crafted 226 gear. I was told off the bat, before we even started the run that my gear was bad. I tanked that very same instance on my main when he had 21k HP (def capped), within the first week of the xpack, when most people had gear of my level or worse and weren't nearly as familiar with the instance either. Meanwhile, the healer in that run was wearing a mix of greens and blue items that were either barely enchanted or not at all. His/her gear, while significantly worse than mine, was fine for the instance. The skills were not. We got the first boss down after all, with me dying in the end.

    Another DK in the group said he'd tank since he had better gear. So he put it on (had more HP, but wasn't even def capped), pulled the 2 large bugs right before the next boss and started dying fairly fast, without paying much attention to the small adds at all. One bug actually went to the healer... I switched presences, taunted... and we still died, due to the lack of any decent heals. And I got kicked. That sucked balls, but I didn't think that everyone was out to get the tanks. I just thought there were a lot of idiots that don't bother to actually analyze the situation before assigning blame to their liking.

    Also, your votekick actually failed, meaning the majority voted nay, but you still felt like like "people" are blaming you? Basically, not only this is a bad example because it's anectodal evidence, it's not even good anecdotal evidence either.
    Last edited by Creotor; 2012-12-13 at 04:37 AM.

  5. #5
    Herald of the Titans Lovestar's Avatar
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    Because it's extremely easy for crappy or mediocre healers to be 100% carried by good groups, and then completely choke if actual pressure occurs. Usually they think they're an "awesome healz" because no one dies, but if you observe their actual actions, they spend most of the time jumping around or standing there doing nothing. In lulls, instead of contributing to group damage, they stare at the wall and drool. If they die for some reason, the group doesn't even notice since no one really needed a healer anyway. When some kind of emergency actually does go down, they fail hard.

    What I'm trying to say is, blaming the healer is not always wrong. It's a job that's easy to get carried with, and it lulls you into a false sense of security that can suddenly demand extreme action without much warning — a situation less skilled or experienced heals choke in. The contrast between "pressure" and "lull" is much more extreme for healers than other roles, so when a heal fails, it's usually a catastrophic failure. And when heals isn't trying or isn't very good, everyone feels it.

    As a result, people who notice they died while watching group health bars sit really low without compensation may kneejerk to the assumption that the healer is just a drooling /followbot texting and Skyping while glancing at WoW every few minutes. Because there's an awful lot of those, unfortunately, and it's easy to get away with in a lot of dungeons where tanks can generally keep themselves alive without help.

    It's similar to kneejerking to a votekick on the tank if the group takes aggro because someone isn't aware of a mechanic that uncontrollably locks up the tank — because honestly, you encounter enough tanks who have no idea what they're doing that assuming incompetence unfortunately has a high chance of being correct.

    Now do temper this with the realization that, on the other side of the issue, you also have people who just blame everyone else for everything because they're bratty children throwing tantrums. They will generally just select someone in their head as the cause of their misfortune and seek vengeance with a votekick regardless of how much factual blame the victim actually has. But those types can target anyone, it's not role-specific.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    People have come to expect full heirlooms. And that brings with it a sense of tanks being invincible.
    they are xD at least when my mistweaver was healing them, level 75 tank? maybe 15k hp on a good tank? 62000 hp life cocoon...time for a fap before the mobs get through that cooldown, couple with auto attack heals SCK and renewing mist, i could easily tank dungeons on my mistweaver that has a pathetic 20% armor.

    but yeh in this case it does sound like idiots just expecting a healer to heal while cc'd, i dont know the boss myself but i imagine the triple poly must be stoppable someway

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Seegtease View Post
    I was in a LBRS run the other day on my paladin, decided to use heals. Dungeon was going pretty good. I'm confident in my ability to heal and took the time to learn what spells are useful for what situation (and use healbot for quicker button access). I've raided with priest and druid before, sometimes topping, and I'm pretty familiar with how healing is supposed to work.

    First time I've run this place at the appropriate level (blitzed it at max before). We get to a boss (can't remember the name) that decides to polymorph 3 of us at the same time, including me. It seems like it must have lasted 6-7 seconds. The boss switched targets, and attacked a DPS, killing him in about 5 seconds, before I was even able to cast any heals (I was spamming the holy shock button to cast as soon as it broke, but it was too late).

    It happened again, and the tank died this time. We wipe, and as we're running back, I ask if there's a way to avoid the polymorph mechanic. Nobody tells me anything. I find out that someone attempted to kick me. No, it didn't pass, but it told me that someone thought I was responsible for the wipe. I did everything I possibly could, and any healer would have had the same results (impossible to heal = they die). The next time we got lucky enough for me not to get poly'd, and the fight went without a single hitch.

    Why do people immediately jump to blame the healer when someone dies? Why do they assume that it wasn't something they were standing in, or a mechanic they were unable to avoid, or worse yet, the healer was CC'd?

    I know what I was doing (even though I wasn't familiar with the mechanic there, but should we be reading tankspot or some crap for old 5 man dungeons? No). There are a lot of bad healers, sure, but death isn't always their fault. Stop trying to blame them, it makes people not want to heal anymore.
    try not to take it personally, they blame the tank for no reason too (looking at you warrior who dps' in defensive stance) The real lesson here is that it's probably the dps fault because they're a dime a dozen, easily replaceable, and statistically stupid as hell not knowing any mechanic and blindly shooting at whatever moves in front of them. If anyone would like to argue that point, i point you to LFR.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Sivick View Post
    try not to take it personally, they blame the tank for no reason too (looking at you warrior who dps' in defensive stance) The real lesson here is that it's probably the dps fault because they're a dime a dozen, easily replaceable, and statistically stupid as hell not knowing any mechanic and blindly shooting at whatever moves in front of them. If anyone would like to argue that point, i point you to LFR.
    I see your evidence, and i raise you both tanks standing in front of boss getting debuffs, tanks not taunt switching, tanks facing boss wrong way. Healers not dispelling.... well healers not dispelling as healing can't be that hard =\

  9. #9
    Stood in the Fire jd812's Avatar
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    because its always either the tank or healers fault . hasn't playing this game taught you that yet? lol

  10. #10
    That's pretty much the hardest boss from the 15-60 dungeon grind. Don't worry about it, it's the idiot pug killer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eroginous View Post
    Unfortunately for you, dictionaries are not authorities on the definitions of words.
    Ezekiel 23:20, Ezekiel 16:49-50, Mark 10:25, James 5:1-6, Luke 16:19-31, Matthew 19:21, Numbers 5:11-31

  11. #11
    It's true, at some point the wow community forget the truth of the game: it's always a hunters fault.

  12. #12
    Scarab Lord ringpriest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dokhidamo View Post
    People have come to expect full heirlooms. And that brings with it a sense of tanks being invincible.
    I'd say pretty much this. Even in situations like endgame heroics where they should know better. As a healer, I've been yelled at or kicked for losing tanks in heroics where the tank had empty slots and wearing healer cloth, or where the tank and dps were standing in multiple aoes at once that combined to tick for more than the tank's health.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by jd812 View Post
    because its always either the tank or healers fault . hasn't playing this game taught you that yet? lol
    One of these complain threads is made every 2 days. It seems that many people haven't realized it yet.

  14. #14
    It's a healer's game.

    The tanks and DPS just haven't yet realized they are the pawns expected to know their moves.

  15. #15
    Brewmaster
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    You can actually say that is often tank or healer's faults.

    Why?

    Because their role is more important ergo more responsabilities.

    I tank/heal/dps everytime and of course when i tank or heal i have my extra responsabilities to take care off. If i dont do it , i dont even need them to blame me i blame myself for doing something wrong.

    Dps's fault is when , rarely , there is a sort of enrage timer or adds to kill or some particualr mechanic to take care of.. or moving out of fire .

    But as i just explained before.. its more likely to be healer's or tank's fault.

  16. #16
    Life of a healer:
    -keep everyone toped, pay atention to stuff, preserve mana, etc > group thinks you are mediocre, they all are imba, no one cares about you
    -screwthat.jpeg
    -go watch tv shows, let peoples health bars drop, do last second saving heals, group thinks you are the second coming of christ, you get invited to more events/better guild

    SO, WICH ONE ARE YOU?

  17. #17
    Brewmaster
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    Thats so wrong its unbelieveble .

    A good healer is the healer that pull before the tanks because he is too bored and full of mana .

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Justforthis123 View Post
    You can actually say that is often tank or healer's faults.

    Why?

    Because their role is more important ergo more responsabilities.

    I tank/heal/dps everytime and of course when i tank or heal i have my extra responsabilities to take care off. If i dont do it , i dont even need them to blame me i blame myself for doing something wrong.

    Dps's fault is when , rarely , there is a sort of enrage timer or adds to kill or some particualr mechanic to take care of.. or moving out of fire .

    But as i just explained before.. its more likely to be healer's or tank's fault.
    It's more likely, but not exclusive. In our particular case, it was really no one's fault, just an unfortunate timing for a poly. I ran it again today and no wipe, not even close. I also did not get poly'd. Sometimes, really, no one is to blame. It's just an unfortunate circumstance.

    It's just frustrating for someone to blame me for something that's totally out of my control.

    Quote Originally Posted by Creotor View Post
    You just took your negative experience and projected it onto the whole of WoW. Tanks get blamed, too. Even DPS do, though not as much. It also depends on the people.
    It's not an isolated occurrence. It's happened on my other healers too. This particular event simply reminded me of it. That is, the mindset that "if healthbars are not full, the healer is doing something terrible and should be kicked."

  19. #19
    there a few rules I follow when in dungeons.

    - If the tank dies, its the healers fault
    - If the healer dies, its the tanks fault
    - If the DPS dies its their own dam fault.

    but yeah with the introduction of heirlooms its made most low level dungeons a faceroll experience so people ignore mechanics, kind of annoying really but not much can be done about it.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Justforthis123 View Post
    You can actually say that is often tank or healer's faults.

    Why?

    Because their role is more important ergo more responsabilities.

    I tank/heal/dps everytime and of course when i tank or heal i have my extra responsabilities to take care off. If i dont do it , i dont even need them to blame me i blame myself for doing something wrong.

    Dps's fault is when , rarely , there is a sort of enrage timer or adds to kill or some particualr mechanic to take care of.. or moving out of fire .

    But as i just explained before.. its more likely to be healer's or tank's fault.
    No it is not. It is most of the time the fault of dps who are haphazardly dpsing stuff, standing in crap, and generally not doing their job. I'll give you an example. Stonecore first pack. Tank pulls, there's no CC, the tank got sick of waiting for it and asking. DPS starts nuking whatever and mobs run allover the place as the tank desperately tries to hold aggro. The casters transform and start AoEing. No one interrupted it. Then the fears start on me. Chain feared. and people started dying. First thing I get to hear "WTF HEALER=!?!?!" Who's fault was that? Yes the DPS because they first of all failed to CC, then failed to interrupt, and finally failed to focus their DPS.

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