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  1. #1
    Bloodsail Admiral Ryuji's Avatar
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    Is Destruction really as bad as people say?

    I've been toying with the idea of getting my warlock to 90 and I've always loved Destruction spec. Dunno why, it just is one of those "feels right" moments I guess.

    However, I've noticed that most 'locks I come across on my main in LFR, normal raids and whatnot are Affliction or Demo spec'd. Is it personal preference or is Destruction just that bad? How is it in AoE compared to the others? How is it when needing to move? Single target? 2-3 targets?

    From what I've been reading and from a few logs I've looked at, Destruction seems far behind. Why is that and how could that be improved? Is it skill factor or just the mechanics of the spec that is holding it back compared to the other two?
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  2. #2
    Even when played optimally, Destro just doesn't hold up to Affliction for single target (though it's close to Demo) or Demo for AoE - it's just the way the class is built right now. Side note, though - if you want to screw around and see some high numbers, play Destro on Elegon in an LFR or something - the damage bonus from killing sparks is hilarious with Chaos Bolt.

  3. #3
    It is viable - as in, for any other class it would be a solid spec. It is potentially the top Warlock spec in non-AoE add fights.
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by nse360 View Post
    Even when played optimally, Destro just doesn't hold up to Affliction for single target (though it's close to Demo) or Demo for AoE - it's just the way the class is built right now. Side note, though - if you want to screw around and see some high numbers, play Destro on Elegon in an LFR or something - the damage bonus from killing sparks is hilarious with Chaos Bolt.
    This is true, but kinda misleading.

    Destro is by no stretch of the imagination bad. It's the weakest lock spec on single target by a small margin, but that speaks more to the overall strength of Affliction and Demo at the moment. It suffers from the same issue Frost and Arcane did until the Fire nerfs. Affliction, like Fire was, is so good in almost every raid situation (with Demo filling any gaps) that most people ignore Destruction because there's no reason to learn a new spec just to do slightly less damage than you are already doing.

  5. #5
    The Patient
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    Mechanically Destro performs extremely well in every boss encounter. I like it a hell of a lot more than I thought I would after playing it on the Beta. Unfortunately, Aff generally does it better, with small exceptions. Demo does almost as well as Aff in most situations, so there's really no reason to go Destro unless you like the play style. I've recently swapped from Destro to Aff and noticed a rather large DPS increase everywhere except on adds.

    Is it bad? Absolutely not. We've cleared normal modes with me as Destro with relative ease, and I still use it on HC Tsulong, HC Gara'jal, and HC Feng. Is it as bad as simmed? Resounding NO. It does perform better than simmed in most cases. Is it on par with Aff and Demo? Unfortunately, not in 10 man. 25 man we see high Destro parses taking advantage of overkill damage, which really doesn't help the raid either. Controlling for that, Destro is a it behind. But not enough to stop you from playing it unless you are against a brick wall and need a bit more DPS you can't get from playing a bit better.

    If you're in a hard-core progression guild racing for firsts, you'll want to avoid Destro. If you're having trouble on normal bosses, chances are your group just has to clean up its play, not so much a spec fault. For HC, if you're hitting that brick wall, you might want to come back to Destro a bit later.

  6. #6
    Destruction is OK, but the problem is Affliction is simply better and if you choose to play destruction then you believe that your own enjoyment is more important that the enjoyment of the 24 other people you are raiding with.

  7. #7
    Herald of the Titans nocturnus's Avatar
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    As for theoretical damage output, destro is good. Very good. The fact that Aff is better doesn't make it a bad spec. Frankly speaking the theoretical difference between destro and demo is negligible (116834 vs 119214). Personal skill, gear and RNG will be bottleneck in most cases, not the fact that demo does 2% more theoretical damage.

    So if you like destro's playstyle, there is no reason, whatsoever, that you shouldn't play it. Also I think destro's AOE (note AOE, not multidot) potential, is higher than affliction's.

    I think this is the first expansion where all classes and specs are well balance with a maximum difference of 18% between the highest ranked and lowest ranked class.

    That said, I use affliction on bosses and destro on trash.
    Last edited by nocturnus; 2012-12-14 at 01:27 PM.

  8. #8
    I play Destro on all of my single target bosses. Usually lucky enough to snag very high rankings also. It's middle of the pack, lower than the two other two Warlock specs...but still better off than a lot of other specs. It's definitely doable to play.

    That being said, for AOE heavy fights, I do stick with Demonology. Namely Stone Guard/Wind Lord/Empress/(*cough*meterpad)Protectors.
    Last edited by Quenden; 2012-12-14 at 03:55 PM.

  9. #9
    Epic!
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    Protectors an AoE heavy fight, whaaaaat ?
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Zumzumzum View Post
    Protectors an AoE heavy fight, whaaaaat ?
    Well no, but I number pad with doom. <3

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Kulu View Post
    Well no, but I number pad with doom. <3
    If you're going to jerk it, at least put also corruption.

  12. #12
    Scumbag dps and proud.

  13. #13
    The Patient Reolac's Avatar
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    On Simulations they are low but I believe the Action Priority is not very optimal for Warlocks.

    In terms of optimization I believe Affliction performs better on every fight this tier.

    Check out www.worldoflogs.com for a real-time analysis of spec vs spec.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Olliver View Post
    Destruction is OK, but the problem is Affliction is simply better and if you choose to play destruction then you believe that your own enjoyment is more important that the enjoyment of the 24 other people you are raiding with.
    If you are not in a super serious raiding guild ths comment holds no merit. SLIGHTLY less dps to enjoy playing your toon is well founded. I hate the new affliction but love the new destro play style. I don't serious raid at all anymore and on most fights I do better with destro mainly because aff is easy to screw up timing on things.

  15. #15
    Mechagnome Sweetz's Avatar
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    If you're really good at <insert warlock spec> then that's the spec you should play. All the specs are pretty close, so unless your guild suffers from not having sufficient AOE damage, you can play anything you like. Obviously if your guild struggles with aoe damage fights, you should boost them through with demo, but in my experience this is never needed.

    So if you're a really good destruction warlock, then there's no need for you to play affliction, unless there's a similar benefit from having multidot classes. Ideally you'd want to be able to play all 3 specs and swap when necesary, but if you aren't pushing for serious progress, destruction is perfectly viable so long as you play it well.

    To add to all of the above posters:
    Destruction doesn't do worse dps than Affliction, if the player is better at destruction than at affliction. In a perfect skillcapped world, you'll do 130k dps as affliction and 118k as destruction. Those 12k dps would matter, but those 12k do not exist in the real world, in the case of a pro destro warlock being sub par at affliction.
    Last edited by Sweetz; 2012-12-17 at 11:49 AM.

  16. #16
    Stood in the Fire UR1L's Avatar
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    Destruction isn't much behind. Affliction and Demonology is better however.

    But if you're not in a serious raiding guild then why would you care what's better? :P
    I play Destruction because it's fun and I don't raid at all atm. And in LFR I seem to be the top dps anyway so why not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sweetz View Post
    In a perfect skillcapped world, you'll do 130k dps as affliction and 118k as destruction. Those 12k dps would matter, but those 12k do not exist in the real world, in the case of a pro destro warlock being sub par at affliction.
    Those 12k do exist even if you're sub par at Affliction. And every serious PvEer should aim to get them. There's a reason top Warlocks choose Affliction and Demonology over Destruction. You should aim to be good at all specs not just one. If you're good at just one then you're not a good raiding Warlock.
    Last edited by UR1L; 2012-12-17 at 12:34 PM.

  17. #17
    Destro's burst is (way) better than Affli's or Demo's. Having on demand burst will help you get through a phase or kill an add quicker. So unless you're struggling with berserk timer (and even then the difference between the 2 isn't that great, if you know how to play Destro), then I believe playing Destro can make things easier for your guild.

    Add the self healing capabilities of ember tap (although generally not needed as we have plenty of defensive and self healing cooldowns), and you have awesome utility.

    That being said, I've been playing destro all this xpac so far, and I only regret not playing affli at Gara'jal heroic.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by darlissa View Post
    That being said, I've been playing destro all this xpac so far, and I only regret not playing affli at Gara'jal heroic.
    Destro is unbelievably strong on Gara'jal Heroic - on 25-man at least, played properly, it allows you to put one less person into the Spirit Realm for add duty.
    http://darkcontent.wordpress.com/ - blog (updated Oct. 8, 2013). Latest post: T16H Affliction Trinket Rankings in Combination, done in SimC 540-4.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Rustjive View Post
    Destro is unbelievably strong on Gara'jal Heroic - on 25-man at least, played properly, it allows you to put one less person into the Spirit Realm for add duty.
    Agree, but 10man guild ftl. Too few adds for consistent aoe..

  20. #20
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    We finally came back to MV this week-end after 5 weeks for some gear (and refresh ranks), I could (if my guild let me ) solo Garaj'al's adds in 25H mode, this is madness
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