1. #1

    Small question about Fury trinkets

    I tried to sim the new 5.1 trinket + CC then 5.1 trinket and LFR Lei Shen and Lei Shen turned out to be slightly better... The problem is that sim doesn't account upgrades because my CC is upgraded... Any idea if the 8 ilevel upgrade puts CC above Lei shen LFR or equal or still slightly behind? Thanks in advance! (If you can, answer for both TG and SMF though at the moment I stand on SMF)
    Last edited by Kazlofski; 2012-12-14 at 03:54 PM.

  2. #2
    Add ,upgrade=1 to your CC trinket line

    Like when I sim I use the following line for my darkmoon card:

    trinket2=relic_of_xuen,id=79327,upgrade=2

  3. #3
    OP, have you tried Ghost Iron Dragonling with hit/xp/crit sockets? Afaik it's best trinket atm for fury if you can reforge hit and xp away.

  4. #4
    It most definitely isn't.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Reyzzz View Post
    OP, have you tried Ghost Iron Dragonling with hit/xp/crit sockets? Afaik it's best trinket atm for fury if you can reforge hit and xp away.
    tomcruiselaugh.gif

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhia View Post
    It most definitely isn't.
    Because you say so? Okay then, gtfo.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Reyzzz View Post
    Because you say so? Okay then, gtfo.
    If you're struggling to reach hit/exp cap and are sacrificing crit for it (or you can't reach it even with the trinket), I can see it being a very good trinket. But for me the hit/exp would basically tun into mastery through reforging, which isn't anything amazing.

    Great entry level trinket, but not much more.

  8. #8
    At the gear level one would have to be for all 1200 hit/exp on the dragonling to allow you to reforge to 1200 crit on the rest of your gear (and if this is the case this means that a) you have very badly itemised gear with hardly any native crit/hit/exp on it b) very low gear level, soemwhere around ilevel 460) crit is worth between 0.6 and 0.7 strength. Which means that 1800 crit is equivalent to about 1170 strength. Relic of xuen is 956 passive strength with the proc averaging out to 908 strength, meaning it's worth about 1860 strength overall.

    If your gear level is such that crit is closer to 1 strength (in my current gear crit is worth 1.05 strength) then your gear is good enough that the 1200 hit/exp will mostly be converted to mastery on the rest of your gear rather than crit. At that kind of gear level mastery is worth 0.5 - 0.6 strength, so obviously worse than relic of xuen.

    Relic of xuen isn't even a bis trinket, heroic lei shen and 5.1 rep trinket are (at least for non-engi), so when dragonling is considerably worse than relic it can't possibly be a contender for "best trinket atm for fury".
    Last edited by Rhia; 2012-12-15 at 04:49 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Maxie View Post
    If you're struggling to reach hit/exp cap and are sacrificing crit for it (or you can't reach it even with the trinket), I can see it being a very good trinket. But for me the hit/exp would basically tun into mastery through reforging, which isn't anything amazing.

    Great entry level trinket, but not much more.
    Considering stat weights on both trinkets:

    Ghost Iron Dragonling

    5.85*600 xp
    5.85*600 hit
    4.28*600 crit
    = 9588 PP

    Relic of Xuen

    according to wowhead, together with proc Relic of Xuen is count as 1865-1965 static strength, which yields 2.98*1865-2.98*1965 = 5557.7-5585.7 PP

    So according to my math, GID is 39% more powerful without counting the proc to summon the dragonling
    Last edited by Reyzzz; 2012-12-15 at 04:57 PM.

  10. #10
    Show me a gearset where 1200 hit/exp on the trinket doesn't turn into mostly mastery on other pieces of gear? While your maths might be accurate at very low levels of poorly itemised gear (multiple slots with haste + mastery) as soon as you start using properly itemised gear (and it's possible to have almost full 463 gear with crit+exp/hit) that 1200 expertise/hit just means you reforge to a bit more crit, but mostly mastery, elsewhere.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhia View Post
    Show me a gearset where 1200 hit/exp on the trinket doesn't turn into mostly mastery on other pieces of gear? While your maths might be accurate at very low levels of poorly itemised gear (multiple slots with haste + mastery) as soon as you start using properly itemised gear (and it's possible to have almost full 463 gear with crit+exp/hit) that 1200 expertise/hit just means you reforge to a bit more crit, but mostly mastery, elsewhere.
    Gearsets exist only on paper, in reality after each upgrade you have to evaluate each item individually, and to quote myself

    if you can reforge hit and xp away.

  12. #12
    If you're reforging hit/exp away then you need to use the stat weight of the stat you're reforging the hit/exp to when weighing up the trinket. If the trinket allows you to reforge 600 hit elsewhere into mastery, then it is wrong to use the stat weight of hit for evaluating the trinket, as your gearset overall hasn't gained any hit, it has gained 600 mastery. Likewise if it allows you to gain 600 crit elsewhere you use the stat weight of crit, etc.

    The only time the stat weights you posted are accurate are if you cannot reach hit/exp cap from your gear without using the 600 hit and exp on the trinket, which, again, is only the case in very low level/poorly itemised gear.

    Out of curiosity I put together a 463 pieces only bis set (which is either crit/hit or crit/exp on every piece possible, crit/mastery on two pieces, crit/haste on two pieces, and haste/mastery on one piece) leaving one trinket slot open, gemmed as crit, crit/hit and str/crit (though I should properly gem exp/crit in reds in this situation, but for simplicity's sake), reforging haste/mastery towards hit/exp caps. i was able to reach hit cap while being 300 rating short of exp cap, without touching any of the crit on gear, so in this case the dragonling would be worth about 900 crit, 300 exp, 600 mastery. So in this situation dragonling would be competitive with relic of xuen. As soon as ilevel increases a bit and I can reach hit/exp caps without the trinket its value plummets as most of its hit/exp just results in more mastery. This typically occurs around ilevel 470.

    And in my gearset right now (492 ilevel) every single point of hit/exp on the trinket is converted to mastery on other slots, meaning that it is basically 600 crit + 1200 mastery, making it very very far from bis.
    Last edited by Rhia; 2012-12-15 at 05:38 PM.

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