View Poll Results: Do you Support Assault Weapons Ban?

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  • Yes

    2,141 61.66%
  • No

    1,331 38.34%
  1. #2021
    Quote Originally Posted by Moadar View Post
    What is being suggested by anti-gun people won't do anything. Its not effective. Smaller clips and scary accessories being banned will not save one life. He could have killed all the people he did with 10 round clips duct taped in pairs, 4 seconds to flip the clip and keep firing. He could have done it with a shotgun.

    I'm all for effective changes, but none of the above will change a thing.
    Then what would you suggest? because where we are now...isn't working. What would be effective?

    I doubt he could put 11 shot gun slugs in one kid and still get 19+6 more in the amount of time he did. The report is he offed himself when he heard the police sirens being a small town they were there pretty quick.

  2. #2022
    Scarab Lord GreatOak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tombstoner139 View Post
    Even with a 10 year wait for a 2 round "Legitimate" hunting rifle. If someone wants you dead, they will find a suitable replacement weapon.
    The killer in the latest incident would have used some substitute substitute. for example kitchen knife. yes in that case the death count would be lower but the incident would still take place. i think that's the goal for banning all guns.
    They can make their own magazines very easily, or wrap them.
    "It woudl be funny as hell if the abodinal snoawman walk in the background" -Confucius

  3. #2023
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    You guys realize that Switzerland has conscription right? I mean seriously, that's your model for freedom? Mandatory military service?
    I'm beginning to think that military service should be required in order to vote or run for public office.

  4. #2024
    Quote Originally Posted by Sealed Shut View Post
    lol, don't be such a hypocrite. point out the ignorance please. point out the fantasy.
    You sit there with blinders on all snug thinking you are and will always be taken care of by others. i actually feel bad for you.
    Sorry you're not making ANY SENSE WHATSOEVER.
    This is not a discussion you just want to fight.

  5. #2025
    Scarab Lord GreatOak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chasey View Post
    Then what would you suggest? because where we are now...isn't working. What would be effective?

    I doubt he could put 11 shot gun slugs in one kid and still get 19+6 more in the amount of time he did. The report is he offed himself when he heard the police sirens being a small town they were there pretty quick.
    1. Better enforced background checks
    2. No private loopholes
    3. Mandatory training
    4. Enforced locks when children and other vulnerable people are in the home.

    Beyond that, we just need to educate people more about guns and make sure mentally ill people are cared for.

    Heavy handed bans dont solve anything.
    "It woudl be funny as hell if the abodinal snoawman walk in the background" -Confucius

  6. #2026
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    Are you really, really, trying to tell me that US v Cruikshank ruling has nothing to say about the second amendment? I suggest you read the ruling again.
    United States v. Cruishank ruled that the First and Second Amendments only limit the federal government.

  7. #2027
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    What does it matter if the crimes are being done with guns or not if overall crime is lower in all major categories?
    Deaths from gun shots aren't! Mass killings aren't!

    And with that, I'm out... great debate, pretty civil! I can't say I agree with everything but I learned a few things. Thanks.

  8. #2028
    Quote Originally Posted by Sealed Shut View Post
    such twisted logic. we should ban alcohol because the guy down the street who's been arrested multiple times for drinking & driving could break into your home and steal your liquor.
    infringing on the rights of law abiding people because there are evil people out there is just wrong. you continuously want to address the tools but not the people. you will never solve the problem like this.
    Drinking alcohol is a human right?

  9. #2029
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    1. Better enforced background checks
    2. No private loopholes
    3. Mandatory training
    4. Enforced locks when children and other vulnerable people are in the home.

    Beyond that, we just need to educate people more about guns and make sure mentally ill people are cared for.

    Heavy handed bans dont solve anything.
    And not you, I agree with you. It was towards Moadar. I really don't think huge clips would be a bad idea limiting either...thats just me.

  10. #2030
    Quote Originally Posted by Moadar View Post
    What is being suggested by anti-gun people won't do anything. Its not effective. Smaller clips and scary accessories being banned will not save one life. He could have killed all the people he did with 10 round clips duct taped in pairs, 4 seconds to flip the clip and keep firing. He could have done it with a shotgun.

    I'm all for effective changes, but none of the above will change a thing.
    We have fought about effectiveness but i agree with you here. None of these changes will have any effect and they are doing this for shpw. Mayor Bloomberg made the dumbest comment ive heard about rounding them up. Everyone knows they cant round up guns. People wont stand there and let the.government do it. Its a polical show nothing more. Its not even a debate because.they cant get guns in circulation back. You are trying to lessen the damage without solving the problem. You are trying to put a bandaid on a gun shot wound.

    These shootings have been military esq fps style. This kid just did what he did so many times in a video game. So either help the mentally illo block them from having this stuff ingrained in them.

  11. #2031
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Again, they are just the same as any other semi auto hunting rifles, and more people die from bare fists. You really think <1000 victims in this huge country warrants punishing tens of millions of good gun owners? You talk about us living in fear yet you buy into the media sensationalism and emotional outbursts. Banning these does nothing when you can find them illegally. I can go down to Englewood and find a FULLY automatic gun if I wanted to, and buy it illegally.
    You can, a sociopath can't. One less wielding it. Job done.

  12. #2032
    Quote Originally Posted by Chasey View Post
    Then what would you suggest? because where we are now...isn't working. What would be effective?

    I doubt he could put 11 shot gun slugs in one kid and still get 19+6 more in the amount of time he did. The report is he offed himself when he heard the police sirens being a small town they were there pretty quick.
    Pull the plug on shotgun and you got 8 shots. 12 gauge and buckshot or slugs is at the extreme end of lethal in close quarters. Thats 8 dead people and reloading a shotgun doesn't take long.

    Licensing per a course is one idea that could be beneficial.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-19 at 05:04 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Trunksee View Post
    We have fought about effectiveness but i agree with you here. None of these changes will have any effect and they are doing this for shpw. Mayor Bloomberg made the dumbest comment ive heard about rounding them up. Everyone knows they cant round up guns. People wont stand there and let the.government do it. Its a polical show nothing more. Its not even a debate because.they cant get guns in circulation back. You are trying to lessen the damage without solving the problem. You are trying to put a bandaid on a gun shot wound.

    These shootings have been military esq fps style. This kid just did what he did so many times in a video game. So either help the mentally illo block them from having this stuff ingrained in them.
    100% agree with this.

  13. #2033
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    Correct. The second amendment is binding for the federal government, but not the states. Now, suddenly, it is being brought up as binding for states and DoC as well as a right. You do not have a right to firearms. The federal government, in the second amendment, does not have the right to remove your rights to firearms. That does not mean the states or cities you live in do not have the rights to remove your rights to firearms, regardless of what the NRA believes.

    Edit -> I may have mixed US v Heller with US v Cruikshank in my first reply about militias to him, and if I did so, I apologize.
    Have you heard of the Fourteenth Amendment? United States v. Cruikshank also ruled that the First Amendment doesn't limit state and local governments. I know liberals hate freedom of speech, but the First Amendment also covers the establishment clause. This means that prayer in school is now legal and that state governments can establish state churches. Enjoy.

    As stated in my massive post earlier, the United States Constitution doesn't create any new rights, it only protects pre-existing a natural right. This is not an "opinion," it is straight from the Founding Fathers, the United States Supreme Court, classical liberal philosophers and legal experts. I suppose you look at the Second Amendment again: "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

    Note the "shall not be infringed," which indicates a protection on a pre-existing right, as opposed to creating a new one.

  14. #2034
    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    That are HEAVILY outweighted by their cons. Aka, if someone wakes up with the need of killing 30 kids, you just made his task easier.
    Or, if your gun gets stolen, you just released a weapon of massive damaging potentials on the black market thank you.
    For some reason you think getting rid of guns makes things safer. it will only change the method of the crime.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1220230

    I think most guns on the so called black market are not stolen... just sold by people who dont care.....

    http://www.armslist.com/

  15. #2035
    Scarab Lord GreatOak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djalil View Post
    You can, a sociopath can't. One less wielding it. Job done.
    Sociopaths aren't incapable of buying illegal weapons
    "It woudl be funny as hell if the abodinal snoawman walk in the background" -Confucius

  16. #2036
    The Insane Bakis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tombstoner139 View Post
    For some reason you think getting rid of guns makes things safer. it will only change the method of the crime.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1220230

    I think most guns on the so called black market are not stolen... just sold by people who dont care.....

    http://www.armslist.com/
    So the 600 000 legal guns that gets reported as stolen every single year doesn't mean a thing, totally neglectable?
    The method of crime resulted in 0 deaths vs 26, what would you prefer.
    Russia isn't afraid of US dude. That's why they are sending their bombers like 60km out of your shores. Infact they give 0 fucks. They know you wont dare to touch them.

  17. #2037
    Quote Originally Posted by Bakis View Post
    So the 600 000 legal guns that gets stolen every single year doesn't mean a thing, totally neglectable?
    So lets ban everything than can be stolen and used in a crime? Good bye cars!

  18. #2038
    The Lightbringer
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phader View Post


    Same Calliber gun both semi automatic. One legal under the original ban one not.
    Both should be legal. /thread

  19. #2039
    Merely a Setback Rukentuts's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moadar View Post
    So lets ban everything than can be stolen and used in a crime? Good bye cars!
    Yeah, because that's totally valid comparison since cars were designed specifically to kill.
    Quote Originally Posted by GreatOak View Post
    Hey, as a transabled, transethnic, non-binary, genderqueer, neo-communist, indoor-capable republican otherkin I am offended by your callous display of ignorance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Both of those links don't provide any evidence. They make unsubstantiated statements

  20. #2040
    The whole thing is a joke and makes for too many questions. Who is going to take my guns from me? What happens if I say no? Do I get reimbursed if I give my gun to the government? Where do all of these guns go?

    Probably the most obvious question is, why take guns from law-abiding citizens in order to try and prevent criminals from using them? Because criminals totally follow laws and bans, right? Yes, there is no need for an assault rifle, but that doesn't mean they should be banned. A shotgun could have done just as much, if not more, damage at that school as an assault rifle.

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