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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubalus View Post
    you will need some pieces to meet the ilvl req. for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds wll be willing to carry blue a;ts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.
    I will bet all my WoW gold that you can enter LFR without having a single valor item or even buying stuff from AH.

  2. #62
    my point is why gate gear behind rep at all?

    the only case where I was ok with this, was the firelands rep items (cloaks, rings, trinkets)

    cause at least you worked towards items in a relevant manner.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubalus View Post
    you will need some pieces to meet the ilvl req. for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds will be willing to carry blue alts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.
    need ilvl 460 to enter MsV lfr
    Everyone has so much to say
    They talk talk talk their lives away

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    my point is why gate gear behind rep at all?

    the only case where I was ok with this, was the firelands rep items (cloaks, rings, trinkets)

    cause at least you worked towards items in a relevant manner.
    Why gate gear behind bosses? I want them purples now.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    With the 100% bonus I hit revered about 8000/21000 with klaxxi just from the normal quests in the zone that I did while leveling. Reaching revered with most factions will go fast. Jesus, I'd rather think about how long it'll take you to get the VP.
    This right here. People worry too much about how slow it is to unlock the rep gear but fail to see that it takes longer to earn the valor points to purchase the gear to begin with. Pretty pointless to burn out doing dailies to get 4+ reps to revered in order to buy gear when it will take you 2 months of capping out VP to purchase all of that gear to begin with.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-17 at 07:19 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Bubalus View Post
    you will need some pieces to meet the ilvl req. for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds will be willing to carry blue alts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.
    Four of my 90's can do LFR without 1 single piece of rep gear. It's really not that hard to get the ilvl to get into the 1st tier of LFR.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    my point is why gate gear behind rep at all?
    Because Blizzard had a point before MoP launched, but backed off at the last minute then did a really bad job of communicating it's intentions.

    Valor gear is not meant for raiders. In fact, there was not supposed to BE any valor gear in MoP. At all. None. The VP gear was added to the rep vendors very late in beta, effectively last minute. Before that we were told that valor was going to be used for the upgrade system that ultimately came in 5.1. They changed their minds for 2 reasons. The upgrade system wasn't quite ready for launch and the devs thought that having no valor gear at all would be too much of a shock to players on top of the already extensive game changes that come with a new expansion. That is why VP gear is a lower iLvl than raid drops in normal HoF and TotES, and not significantly higher than drops from LFR. Basically they want you killing bosses as your primary source for gear, not visiting the Magical Armor Dispenser. Valor gear is mostly targeted at players who either do not raid at all or at most do LFR runs only, with the logic that if you are only doing LFR you have time to do the dailies to unlock the gear, especially since you will unlock gear far faster than you can earn valor even if doing them casually. Yes, Blizzard changed the system for the one where valor was used to supplement bad luck with raid drops. No, they did not make sure players were well enough aware of this change after 2.5 expansions under the old system.

    Blizzard already recognizes that MoP is very alt unfriendly. They are looking at ways to address that. I would not expect changes taking us anywhere close to how we saw things in Cata, where it was completely possible to have 10 fully raid-geared characters that are actively played at the same time. I would also not be at all surprised if they don't put any more valor gear into the game, and rely on the upgrade system only. I see this as especially true given their comments about not having such a drastic "catch-up" mechanic as we saw in both WotLK and Cata, where prior tiers are completely obsoleted by new 5-mans that drop equivalent gear, instead using LFR as a means of prepping new characters for current tier raiding.

    What I would like to see in 5.2:

    Remove rep requirement on T14 valor gear and make it cost JP instead

    Increased rate of JP gain

    New level 90 characters would gear up for current content using T14 LFR, vendor gear, and the upgrade system. Yay for non-painful progression raiding!

    Any new 5.2 5-man heroics drop gear equivalent to T14 LFR Hof/TotES (iLvl 483)
    Last edited by Gurbz; 2012-12-17 at 03:40 PM.
    All this complaining is simply further proof that Blizzard could send each and every player a real-life wish-granting flying unicorn carrying a solid gold plate of chocolate chip cookies wrapped in hundred dollar bills, and someone would whine that Blizzard sucks for not letting them choose oatmeal raisin.
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    If your guild demands you slip into an elephants butt and force yourself out in a regurgation then you can't blame Blizzard for supplying the elephant.

  7. #67
    The Lightbringer Mandible's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    1. Blizzard has stated many times that you don't need Valor gear.
    2. Valor Points haven't been a raid currency in years.
    What game are you playing? Also while you may not need it to raid the point is still that you need to do the rep to buy it in the first place.
    "Only Jack can zip up."
    The word you want to use is "have" not "of".
    You may have alot of stuff in your country, but we got Lolland.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Mandible View Post
    What game are you playing? Also while you may not need it to raid the point is still that you need to do the rep to buy it in the first place.
    And that is the point exactly. Gee, if you want instant gratification for no effort I hear solitaire is a good game.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Then don't do them. Basically your argument is that you want the reward, but don't want to put in the effort.
    Well to me, charms are as mandatory to raiding as enchantments are. By not getting them, you are effectively taking gear away from your raid group and being a scumbag. I don't want to be a scumbag.

    And its not effort that bothers me. Its that there's no alternative means of acquiring them, as I personally hate doing dailies. I'm not alone in that sentiment, either.

  10. #70
    Herald of the Titans thunderdragon2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Descense View Post
    Just wait for new raid patch and we will probaly get a new valor vendor (and the faction vendors will be usles).
    nope, knowing blizzard they will tie it to another faction....

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 12:24 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Suizid View Post
    I will bet all my WoW gold that you can enter LFR without having a single valor item or even buying stuff from AH.
    msv yes but not hof or terrace unless your lucky

  11. #71
    Pit Lord velde046's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windfury View Post
    You can earn valor other ways than dailies. You cannot however spend that valor (on gear) without dailies. That's the OP's issue.
    Well tbh with the new Commendations in place farming rep on alts is a breeze really...
    Just raise a faction or two til honred, get their gear and you can probably enter LFR and get the rest. Besides when you do the dailies you also get Valor so it's win-win...

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 01:31 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    heres my idea.

    exalted on main = unlocks items for alts

    there is no fucking way im doing the golden lotus grind again on my warlock.
    With the Commendation it's piss easy getting to revered where you can get all the shiny epics (plus the ones you can already get at honored) this is whining imo.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by thunderdragon2 View Post

    msv yes but not hof or terrace unless your lucky
    Item upgrades let you get a 471 ilvl without ever stepping outside of heroic dungeons.

  13. #73
    Pandaren Monk Asmodias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    this is mostly qq about alts. to spend your valor that you get from raiding, you need to grind out reps. which to be honest, is stupid. I get a currency from raiding, and I have to do DAILIES just for the RIGHT to spend it?

    who thought of this crap?

    my warlock alt has no desire to do any dailies, I do enough of them on my paladin. but, if I want to spend my valor, I have no choice.

    rep should only be required for VANITY items. valor items should be on their own vendor, cause if I choose to raid on a character, I shouldnt be forced to do dailies just to spend my valor. all this system does, is FORCE people to do dailies that they dont want to.

    being forced to do dailies to spend a currency you primarily get from raiding = dumb.
    I guess I am confused here. Let me see if I understand the situation. You are raiding on an alt. You earn Valor for raiding on the alt. You can't spend the valor without grinding rep on the alt. Is that correct?

    Assuming that it is, here is where my confusion is. I would imagine, as a raider, that you are getting gear from the raids, yes? If you are getting gear from the raids, why do you need to buy valor gear?

    At the rate we get valor (1k a week) it's going to take you a week and a half to get a single valor item (this assumes that you are capping valor on your alt). This amount of time is going to significantly increase if you are not capping valor on your alt. In the time it takes you to earn the valor to purchase a single rep item, you could have raided all 16 bosses, the entire LFR and Sha of Anger twice (not counting Galleon as his timer is wonky).

    I would also imagine that you have a decent idea of where your best in slot gear comes from. So you know if you go out of your way to grind rep for a piece of gear, it's potentially going to be replaced by actual raid gear.

    You can also use your valor to upgrade epic loot twice. And in 5.2 you will be able to convert it to Justice Points to help upgrade any Blue gear you may still have.

    Also note that there are plenty of ways to cap valor without having to run an dailies at all.

    I just don't see where you are forced to do dailies.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 05:52 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by thunderdragon2 View Post
    nope, knowing blizzard they will tie it to another faction....

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 12:24 PM ----------



    msv yes but not hof or terrace unless your lucky
    You don't have to be lucky to get into HoF or Terrace without any valor gear or stuff from the AH. You also don't need any of the profession gear either. All you need is time to farm. By the time you outfit yourself in 463 blues... You should have enough Justice Points to raise them to 471. Once that's done, you win. No valor gear. No purchased AH gear. No profession made gear. No dailies done. No rep earned.


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  14. #74
    Herald of the Titans thunderdragon2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Item upgrades let you get a 471 ilvl without ever stepping outside of heroic dungeons.
    remember that ur getting 35 jp 42 with guild perk per boss, and you'll need 1500jp per item, also i just found this gem so ill link it from the front page blue tracker

    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...-dungeons-now/

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 03:19 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Asmodias View Post
    I guess I am confused here. Let me see if I understand the situation. You are raiding on an alt. You earn Valor for raiding on the alt. You can't spend the valor without grinding rep on the alt. Is that correct?

    Assuming that it is, here is where my confusion is. I would imagine, as a raider, that you are getting gear from the raids, yes? If you are getting gear from the raids, why do you need to buy valor gear?

    At the rate we get valor (1k a week) it's going to take you a week and a half to get a single valor item (this assumes that you are capping valor on your alt). This amount of time is going to significantly increase if you are not capping valor on your alt. In the time it takes you to earn the valor to purchase a single rep item, you could have raided all 16 bosses, the entire LFR and Sha of Anger twice (not counting Galleon as his timer is wonky).

    I would also imagine that you have a decent idea of where your best in slot gear comes from. So you know if you go out of your way to grind rep for a piece of gear, it's potentially going to be replaced by actual raid gear.

    You can also use your valor to upgrade epic loot twice. And in 5.2 you will be able to convert it to Justice Points to help upgrade any Blue gear you may still have.

    Also note that there are plenty of ways to cap valor without having to run an dailies at all.

    I just don't see where you are forced to do dailies.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-18 at 05:52 AM ----------



    You don't have to be lucky to get into HoF or Terrace without any valor gear or stuff from the AH. You also don't need any of the profession gear either. All you need is time to farm. By the time you outfit yourself in 463 blues... You should have enough Justice Points to raise them to 471. Once that's done, you win. No valor gear. No purchased AH gear. No profession made gear. No dailies done. No rep earned.
    remember you can only upgrade your jp gear at 2 pieces per cap and u get 35-42 jp per boss atm

    also note that the shield wall rewards are even better tan MSV normal loot
    Last edited by thunderdragon2; 2012-12-18 at 03:22 PM.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubalus View Post
    you will need some pieces to meet the ilvl req. for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds will be willing to carry blue alts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.

    Heroics drop 463 (Upgrade possible to 469) JP gear is 458 (upgraded to 466) Therefore, you can quite easily get into LFR (MsV is 460 - gear from there to 470 for HoF + ToES)

    So, you're quite wrong

  16. #76
    I can understand why they'd gate valor gear behind rep, I always felt like getting valor gear was too easy. You grind a few super easy 5man heroics, get valor and buy gear equivalent to raiding. Didn't seem fair to me.

    I think Blizzard did it wrong tough. They should add a barrier to test players before they can use (or get) VP gear, but rep isn't one. They aren't challenging either, just time-consuming. For me it worked great, I'd have grinded the hell out of these reputations anyway (69 Exalteds atm!!), but I bet players who don't share my passion for questing must be feeling forced to do something they don't want and, worse even, something that isn't related to raiding gear at all.

    I think Blizzard should have made heroics and dailies reward Justice Point, make Justice Point more useful then it is right now (more items being sold with it) and make Challenge mode reward Valor. Make it so you can get a decent amount of Valor even with Bronze, you wouldn't have to be a total badass to get it, but make it harder and less repetitive then dailies or 5man heroics.

  17. #77
    Herald of the Titans thunderdragon2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galbrei View Post
    I can understand why they'd gate valor gear behind rep, I always felt like getting valor gear was too easy. You grind a few super easy 5man heroics, get valor and buy gear equivalent to raiding. Didn't seem fair to me.


    make Challenge mode reward Valor. Make it so you can get a decent amount of Valor even with Bronze, you wouldn't have to be a total badass to get it, but make it harder and less repetitive then dailies or 5man heroics.
    making challange modes the only source of valor outside raiding would mean they'd have to nerf them and make them CR which blizz said they wouldn't do

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    this is mostly qq about alts. to spend your valor that you get from raiding, you need to grind out reps. which to be honest, is stupid. I get a currency from raiding, and I have to do DAILIES just for the RIGHT to spend it?

    who thought of this crap?

    my warlock alt has no desire to do any dailies, I do enough of them on my paladin. but, if I want to spend my valor, I have no choice.

    rep should only be required for VANITY items. valor items should be on their own vendor, cause if I choose to raid on a character, I shouldnt be forced to do dailies just to spend my valor. all this system does, is FORCE people to do dailies that they dont want to.

    being forced to do dailies to spend a currency you primarily get from raiding = dumb.
    Admit that you think Cataclysm was designed better than TBC or Wrath first. Because that's what you're saying. Cataclysm had the best game design of any WoW expansion. I just want people to start admitting that's what they want.
    "There is good and evil in this world; we must find the black and white in the gray."

  19. #79
    Herald of the Titans thunderdragon2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    Admit that you think Cataclysm was designed better than TBC or Wrath first. Because that's what you're saying. Cataclysm had the best game design of any WoW expansion. I just want people to start admitting that's what they want.
    the only thing i liked about the cata system was the jp gains at the start of cata they that gear mattered as you now get under half the jp per boss from heroics than now, also they should never have removed the jp from completing a heroic when valor capped

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Bubalus View Post
    for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds will be willing to carry blue alts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.
    You can enter the last part of LFR without a single epic. Granted, this is an extreme example and everyone is going to have epics at that point, but it is possible to reach ilvl 470 and enter HoF/ToES LFR without a single piece of epic gear, let alone valor.

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