remove the rep requirement for valor gear.

[Nathane]

rep has never been just about vanity items. You could always leave the game.

[Bryntrollian]

You can spend valor without doing dailies, its called item upgrades...

[Beefhamer]

heres my idea.

exalted on main = unlocks items for alts

there is no fucking way im doing the golden lotus grind again on my warlock.

First off, you only need revered to get valor gear. Revered only takes about two weeks on your first character. Then you buy the commendations for rep which makes you gain rep much faster for all your toons. With that your alts will have Klaxxi revered before halfway through the quest line. And it takes a week to week and a half to finish of revered on alts. This is hardly any work or effort involved. Sure its dailies but they are all simple with a few exceptions for Shadow Pan.

All this smacks of people wanting the easier or fastest way of doing things. VP gear is not needed for raiding nor was this lot geared for raiders. It was meant for non raiders to progress and get a full set of raid quality without raiding. I would take 2.5 or more months of capping valor to get a full set. That is more time than an average raider takes. Not to mention they have to do the dailies. So if you want the non raiding gear you have to do the non raiding solution.

Upgrading raid gear with VP was always intended for this expansion. Which again says, rep vp gear was not intended for raiders. Dailies provide VP which tells me the rep gar is for the daily people.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 12:51 AM ----------

I think flavor/vanity items are the things that should be tied behind rep. like the tigers, and so on. if you make cool items, people will grind for them. like frostsabers or w/e.

if you make enough of these items that people want, people will still do dailies for them. I just think valor gear should be separate entirely. cause if you dont want to do dailies on alts, basically you are using valor on upgrades solely.

why did they change the cata system? regardless of your opinion on the expansion as a whole, getting valor items wasnt a long process with a gate. got 1250vp? you can buy a ring right away. also, JP items were useful and JP was easier to get, but thats another topic. it's a gate (rep) on top of another gate (valor, which has a lower cap this xpac), which seems unneccesary.

I see no reason to gate access to vp items other than forcing people to do dailies. no, you dont need them, but in cata this was a non-issue. you just went to the vendor and spent your valor.

You need exalted for the vanity items. All Vp gear is at revered. Which takes two or less week to get. If you raid and have bad luck and didn't raise your rep then that is your own fault. You knew it was there and was needed. At least Blizzard moved all the gear to revered. Some was at exalted.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 12:54 AM ----------

Valor gear requiring reputation is a non-issue now. Raiders should be spending their valor on gear upgrades, and non-raiders have a way to progress their character still.

Now what needs addressed is 45 dailies required by raiders each week. Charms go a long way to solve the 10 man vs 25 man gear imbalance, but making them only available through daily quests was absolutely stupid.



Back in my days, games were supposed to be fun. And I don't find doing chores as fun.

Charms are an optional bonus roll. If you want to receive the bonus of an extra roll then do your 45 dailies. If you did the dailies to get the rep you should easily have 3 months worth in you currency tab. Blizzard should never change this. They are not going to give you free loot without the extra effort. Well I guess you may be able to get some with pet battles in the near future.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 12:56 AM ----------

I dont want things handed to me.

but having to grind rep just for the right to SPEND your valor points, is dumb.

it's like..oh cool, I got 2000 valor points. I'd sure love to spend them, but I cant unless I do all these daily quests! this is more of an issue for alts than anything, most people are using them on upgrades, but alts in blues dont have valor items to upgrade yet.

if rep is required for items, make the items cost gold. and put the valor items on another vendor.

And again you are not listening to anyone. You can use them to upgrade your existing gear. If you are not raiding and not doing dailies to build rep then you have no need to spend valor.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 12:58 AM ----------

From what I can remember, the original idea for 5.1 is that all you alts would gain Revered status, if you gained Exalted status on 1 character. I could have missread that, but I'm quiet sure this was the original idea.

Although, I dont really care for gearing up my alts at the moment. It is kind of weird that you gain a decent amount of valor by doing LFR, Scenario's and Dungeons, but there is no way of spending it (ok, upgrades), if you dont do the daily grind again on your alt. Which I can totally understand, enough is enough.

I think Valor gear should be more appealing for Alts then it is now. An alt is not worth spending 2 hours a day doing dailies. The problem is for most (raiding) people, that they hardly used any valor on valorgear. But for those 1-2 alts, who arent raiding often, it would be a big welcome if they could profit from the rep gained by the main.

They were going to make it automatic they changed it so you have to buy commendations. No automatic bump to revered just faster rep gains.

[Leonard McCoy]

As for this canard that VP gear wasn't meant for this expansion for whatever reason, or intended for raiders. Let's dispell that particular myth right now.

Stephen Reis ‏@StephenReis123
@Ghostcrawler Why did you end up deciding to keep valor gear in the game? Their was talk that you wouldn't have any this expac.
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11:38 AM - 18 Dec 12 · Details
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18 Dec Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler
@StephenReis123 Even though we think it's important to the game, players can get really frustrated with the RNG of boss drops.
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RNG OF BOSS DROPS. So yes it was designed with raiders in mind. Raiders at all levels.

[Beefhamer]

What I would like to see in 5.2:

Remove rep requirement on T14 valor gear and make it cost JP instead
Pretty sure this won't happen. They have stuck to their guns saying you have to raid to get raid Tier gear.

Increased rate of JP gain
LFR bosses should drop JP and any thing that would normally give you VP should convert to giving JP when capped for the week/total.

New level 90 characters would gear up for current content using T14 LFR, vendor gear, and the upgrade system. Yay for non-painful progression raiding!
The current VP gear should become the new JP. I hope they drop the rep requirements since they would be adding new VP gear and new reps.

Any new 5.2 5-man heroics drop gear equivalent to T14 LFR Hof/TotES (iLvl 483)

I do believe this will be the case since they said the next tier LFR gear will not be as good as the last tier gear. But then they may change their minds on that since current LFR is close to current tier gear.

[Tyrven]

When did the world firsts clear 16/16 heroic? Oh, right. It was before 5.1. You don't need valor gear, even the 496s (those rings are at honored, btw).

Need no some don't. This is an old and worn out stance though. It is the same as saying Bill Gates made over a billion dollars with out a college degree so nobody should go to college.

Actions speak louder then words. Blizz says we don't need the valor gear then adds in increases and new ways to get valor. Watch their actions instead of listening to their words.

I didn't say what if any rep you needed to get the rings, you do need rep honored or not. That doesn't change anything one way or another beyond cutting down on the amount of quests or days it takes ppl to unlock them.

[thunderdragon2]

...why do you need to?


I know you want to cling to the Pre-MOP model, but this expac, its primary purpose is gear upgrades. That's the the rep gear is lower ilvl. If you're spending it on Rep gear, you're just gimping yourself.

you are also gimping yourself and your team if after 1 month you have had no luck and are still sitting in blue and 476 gear

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 09:22 AM ----------

You can spend valor without doing dailies, its called item upgrades...

still need epic pve gear to use your valor with the item upgrade system maybe hes unlucky in lfr

[Granyala]

1) You're making too many assumptions. In most cases, there is a few bosses that you need all items from. This is where you would use your charms.
2) Look at it from an entire raid's prospective instead of a singe character's. Instead of 3 chances a week, its 30 or 75.

So basically... without a doubt, charms will increase a raid's performance over time. The chance of a certain person getting a specific upgrade is small, but the chance of a person in the raid getting an upgrade is incredibly high.

You MIGHT get an upgrade. You MIGHT just as well get stuff you already have. I can count the useful items my raid has gotten (25man) on one hand. Most of the stime peeps just moan in TS because they got gold or sth they already have.

It's pretty ridiculous to assume charms to be mandatory if you're not world first material that wants every last .001%.
Since you're still here arguing, that means you still need gear for progression. Newsflash: You are not competitive World first material. Relax and enjoy the ride.

@Valor discussion: Blizzard doesn't need to remove dailies or rep requirements. Double rep essentially solved the problem. Doing 2 weeks of daily quests shouldn't bee too much to ask for frigging RAID LEVEL EPICS.

What I like to see them implement is some form of reputation-catch-up mechanism. Currently if you miss a day of your quests, there is no way to remedy what you lost. Not even partially. That is the single most severe flaw the daily system has and it sucks for weekend-players. (My friend quit due to this).

RNG OF BOSS DROPS. So yes it was designed with raiders in mind. Raiders at all levels.

As a SLOT FILLER. If you are unlucky for a long amount of time: yes. But that's more of a psychological thing than a progression-math thing. They want to dampen the frustration of "darn 3 months and the boss still lets me run around with this blue crap. (nods at guild hunters, these poor SoBs still didn't get the bow...)

However Valor is not mandatory to be able to progress, as many guilds have proven.

[DeadmanWalking]

you are also gimping yourself and your team if after 1 month you have had no luck and are still sitting in blue and 476 gear

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 09:22 AM ----------



still need epic pve gear to use your valor with the item upgrade system maybe hes unlucky in lfr

Yeah except that if you are having difficulty getting valor gear upgrade worthy gear to drop you can still upgrade your blues with justice points to near purple gear worthyness. All the more reason to not judge someone by the color of the words on their gear and judge them by their in game performance.

Also if your guild wants you to pursue daily gear to get every advantage you can get then thats on you and your guild, not Blizzard. If Blizzard places an elephant on a stage with a 489 ring in its stomache and your guild tells you to slip in its butt and travel through its digestion system to get to the ring before forcing your way out via regurgitation then its not blizzards fault for putting the elephant there in the first place.

Your options are to do what your guild wants or don't. Its still on you and your guild.

[velde046]

But if you remove the daily requirements people might actually realise how shallow Mists is in terms of content!

Ah another person that has not played the game yet... because there has never been more content.

[carebear]

Make the Commendations stack, so two characters at revered = 200% reputation on the account. Let it stack 3-5 times? Idk.

[Seranthor]

dailies should be linked to fun/vanity items, not valor gear.

and before you say valor gear isnt needed for raiding, that may be true, but at the same time you are holding your raid back by not getting valor gear to fill slots occupied by blues.

So, by your own admission, valor gear is NOT need. What you are saying is your GUILD/Raid group is imposing that requirement on you.. NOT Blizzard, right?

[DeadmanWalking]

Ah another person that has not played the game yet... because there has never been more content.

They probably consider sitting in Orgrimmar while waiting for the LFD ques up as content.

I guess if you remove daily 'requirements', achievement hunting, rare hunting, scenarios, challenge modes, fight club, pet battles, pet collecting, mount collecting, LFR, Raiding, Heroic Raiding, transmogging, old dungeon farming, dungeons, heroic dungeons, farming, professions, auction house wars, daily quest chains, PVP, and PVE quests then mists is obviously quite shallow in content.

[Synstir]

Stacking sounds great... but not further that twice though...... otherwise it would become free.

[velde046]

I think flavor/vanity items are the things that should be tied behind rep. like the tigers, and so on. if you make cool items, people will grind for them. like frostsabers or w/e.

Ergo, gear is not cool.... at least not cool enough.
People are flat out lazy, that's what it is. I'm a casual player and only completed my rep grinds last week. Being 3 weeks into the expansion was already able to get into LFR with just one item from rep I think. And the tailoring head gear. So grinding for rep is not necessary, if you needed the items it would be different, but if I as a casual can get geared for LFR without hardly any Valor gear then people that really want to, should be able to also.

I'm not saying that I would object to a change where it was easier to get, but I do not think it is needed in any way. Perhaps they should remove the valor gear altogether, then there's no more grinding involved at all...? Didn't think so...

[Granyala]

fight club

There is no such thing as a "fight club".

/glare

[DeadmanWalking]

Make the Commendations stack, so two characters at revered = 200% reputation on the account. Let it stack 3-5 times? Idk.

You have got to be joking, its already stupid easy to get exalted with any faction. Hell you can get revered with one commendation for Klaxxi before you finish off 75% of the dread wastes quests and before you ever hit level 90. It use to take all the quests plus 7 to 10 days to get revered. I got exalted with tillers in 5 days and I became exalted with Cloud serpant within an hour.

If you add in several stacking commendations you might as well have blizzard come over and wipe your rear for you after you go bathroom in your pants because you are too lazy to actually walk into the bathroom.

---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 01:29 PM ----------

There is no such thing as a "fight club".

/glare

I'll stop talking about fight club when I get an invite to fight club, at which point I will be contractually obligated to follow its rules.

[Moradim]

So, by your own admission, valor gear is NOT need. What you are saying is your GUILD/Raid group is imposing that requirement on you.. NOT Blizzard, right?

technically it isnt needed, but stuff like elegon for example becomes much easier if people have better gear. so valor gear in a sense will speed up your progression.

[velde046]

you will need some pieces to meet the ilvl req. for lfr, full hc dungeon gear won't get you in there and by now not many guilds will be willing to carry blue alts thru normal raids to gear them up, could ofc buy ah crap to boost ilvl if people have gold to trow away.

It does if you use JP to upgrade the gear. Besides there's still World Bosses that can provide an epic...

[DeadmanWalking]

It does if you use JP to upgrade the gear. Besides there's still World Bosses that can provide an epic...

Woah, you are using way too much logic and reason for this conversation. You mean if I come out of orgrimmar and drop a world boss that spawns every 15 mins I get an item that I can trade in for purple boots that I can spend valor on? But if thats true then I can't hate the rep system so much....