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  1. #21
    I do NOT have a link to that addon. The one I used to use stopped working, and I haven't repped it yet. I assume it's still around. I'll poke around later.

    In my guild all dps nuke the legs both in the beginning and when they respawn. So obviously my BF uptime is low. Is that a wrong tactic? Should I be the only one that nukes the legs?
    Ehhhh....

    So at the start, blow them up because your strat involves a slow Garalon. But after, if a leg spawns, it sort of depends what melee is there.

    Pretend it's a ret paladin. He goes buck wild on the leg while you get on the leg and cleave. He does X damage to the leg, and you do, say, 80% of X. During that time, you also deal 50% of X to the body, and the ret does maybe 10% of X to the body. The leg dies. The ret is happy he put big numbers on the board.
    But this was a raid dps loss. If the ret was fully on the body, that whole X would be dealt to the body. The leg would be up a bit longer, but you are still dealing a very large chunk of your damage to the boss while you are destroying Garalon's leg. A raid using the first strat would end with bigger numbers for the ret, but Garalon would last longer. A raid using the second strategy, of making intelligent use of blade flurry, will win the FIGHT faster, even though the ret doesn't get his 2x numbers.


    Now, what if the melee is another combat rogue? Well, you should BOTH be on the leg. What if it's something towards the flurry end of the spectrum, such as an arms warrior? I think he should be on the leg too. But besides the sweeping strikes guy, my feeling is, get the other melee on the boss for higher raid damage.

    It can be REALLY hard to explain this to people, so you may not have the option. It's especially silly because recount won't support you to a naive raid leader, or a melee who doesn't understand what blade flurry is, or thinks it's the ripoff version of cleave or something. In general, any damage done to the leg is damage NOT being done to the boss. Because the leg dying hurts the boss, that's great, the leg should die- but the speed in which that happens is not very critical. Putting a ret or feral or enhance on the leg doesn't really help, because the damage they do to the leg is mostly damage NOT being done to the boss- but because of the target circle, their dps still looks optimal. In fact, the leg is going to die because the rogue is on it (and unlike them, is on it WITHOUT ignoring the boss), and they should focus on the actual kill target- Garalon.

  2. #22
    [Deleted.]
    Last edited by rayanne; 2012-12-18 at 09:56 PM.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by neithan88 View Post
    In my guild all dps nuke the legs both in the beginning and when they respawn. So obviously my BF uptime is low. Is that a wrong tactic? Should I be the only one that nukes the legs?
    That depends. I think for a whole lot of guilds (mine included) damage on normal garalon isn't an issue anymore, and as such, I think its hard to say having the majority of the dps obliterate the legs is "wrong." Now if somehow dps is still the deciding factor for whether or not you can kill the boss, then yeah, thats wrong. On the other hand, if you are killing the boss, good luck convincing everyone that you should be allowed to have full uptime on the legs while they get lower personal dps by sitting the body.

    The amount of leg damage possible in any given fight duration is finite. You therefore want to be hitting the maximum amount of that with pulling as little as possible off the body if you are trying to maximize raid dps. So if less efficient forms of damage are being pulled off of the body and this results in there being 0 legs up for several seconds, it would be optimal for the least efficient sources to stay off the legs to the point that there is a very small window between leg death and leg respawn. The only real exception is that when the body gets to 3% it will be more efficient to blow up a leg if there is one with the entire raid on it.

  4. #24
    If you're going to cleave over an entire fight like Garalon, reforge heavy Mastery instead of Haste, and you should see a big difference in your dps.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Ahdehl View Post
    If you're going to cleave over an entire fight like Garalon, reforge heavy Mastery instead of Haste, and you should see a big difference in your dps.
    That seems to suggest we'd just stick to our usual mutilate build, more or less?'

    Edit: My damage on Garalon was absolutely pathetic (very close to 100k) partly because I'm raw at combat, partly because I don't have a combat weapon of any kind, partly because our warlock wasn't sure to be on body or leg/boss. (Shadowcraft didn't like my 471 blue unless I made it 'dance--which seemed kinda crazy for a blue weapon; so I'm using a 497 dagger and hating it). It was also clear from later attempts that I simply lacked aggression with the spec.
    Last edited by Demeia; 2012-12-20 at 12:43 AM.

  6. #26
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by NotPrepared View Post
    Blade flurry will only cleave targets that are within melee range. On Garalon this means you will have to position yourself quite close to him. Standing in the leg circle is not enough, you need to be close enough to the body as well. Our rogue was having the same problem.
    Hmm I guess this might be the problem then. I was basically standing on top of the leg almost in the red circle. I was facing correctly I suppose, parallel to Garalon’s front-back line, but I might have to position more towards his body (in our case, since we attack the right legs, it means I have to stand more to the left)

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-20 at 03:52 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanguinezor View Post
    Perfectly tuned for Assassination is terribly attuned for Combat.
    Mastery stacking Assassination vs Haste Stacking Combat.
    If you reforge all your gear to haste and still cant peak 80k. Then you have a problem

    OP
    Patcherke, Can you link armory please?
    I doubt the reforging makes that huge of a difference, but anyway: here is my armory:

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...igena/advanced
    (currently assassination spec)
    So I don’t think my gear, reforges and things like that are the problem. (Yes I could have a better wrist enchant and I could have reforged a bit more into mastery instead of exertise, but I like to have a little smoother rotation)


    Edit: I was talking about normal Garalon still. So even with my shitty DPS we are able to get him down. But I like to perform the best I can, (without having to go through too much hassle for reforges for 1 fight per instance) and that wasn't the case on that fight.
    Last edited by mmoc7f082fdd70; 2012-12-20 at 03:04 PM.

  7. #27
    Herald of the Titans Kael's Avatar
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    patcherke- there really isn't much more that anyone can tell you without a log. Can't say how often flurry is up or working, if you have it active when you shouldn't (regardless of intent), if your attacks are landing as hard as they should, if you follow the combat basics (SnD, pooling points into higher insights, etc.) or even how long the legs were alive (and if you had the buff up while attacking them).

    It DOES sound like you're attacking the leg and flurrying the body (which you should; if you haven't been, do so, since (at least when I last checked) it doesn't properly double damage that's been flurried onto the leg, and because poisons procced on the leg will also cause double damage, and you'll want the +healing from the doubled physical hits, yatta yatta)... but this can also be a valid concern if you don't target swap on occasion.

    If you find your combat DPS is truly atrocious, you can always try running assassination for it, although unless the legs are getting nuked beyond belief you should be ahead with combat, especially if you ever have to feint.

    As your armory goes -- staying expertise capped is better for times you swap spec anyway.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Demeia View Post
    That seems to suggest we'd just stick to our usual mutilate build, more or less?'
    Correct.9T

  9. #29
    What is your reasoning for mastery beating haste during flurry?

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by patcherke View Post
    I doubt the reforging makes that huge of a difference, but anyway: here is my armory:

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...igena/advanced
    (currently assassination spec)
    So I don’t think my gear, reforges and things like that are the problem. (Yes I could have a better wrist enchant and I could have reforged a bit more into mastery instead of exertise, but I like to have a little smoother rotation)
    Was just checking through your char. Your mastery is only on 34% unbuffed.
    Extremely low for your gear as i am on 70% UB and i have terrible terrible gear in comparison(Gem Stacked ).
    Only thing i can think of is to actually try combat with full gems and enchants. Think your gear will perform alot better.

    Dnt have time at work to check the calculations but from just a brief scan over your gear stats.
    Combat > Ass for your gear

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