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  1. #1

    Ideas for new survivability for Elemental Shaman

    After GC said 3 times that Elemental Shamans are too fragile, we will certainly see something new for 5.2

    What is your guess and idea?
    Looking at the spec and considering that it hasn't got any simple and very powerful abilities (like block, deep, disperse) but always seem slighty cumbersome (capacitor totem, flame shock and shock CD, healing tide 1 shot) I think we can expect something nice but with a "but"

    To give an idea of what other casters have:
    Mage:
    • 15s CD blink that breaks stuns
    • 30s CD 60k shield
    • 2 Ice Blocks with a 30% heal
    • 6% physical dmg with Molten armor

    Warlock:
    • 2 min CD 30% heal and 25% more healing for 12s
    • 10s CD shared damage and healing with pet or 1 min CD giant shield(think it's 85k) or 3 min absorb all dmg for 8 sec but take 50% of the dmg taken during that over 8s
    • 2 min CD Health Stone
    • 30s CD 65k shield absorbing magic damage
    • More armor, 10% more hp, 10% more healing with Fel Armor

    Boomkin:
    • 15% dmg reduction in moonkin form,
    • 30s CD leap forward into stealth(usable while silenced)
    • NS healing touch or 2 min CD 30% heal
    • 120% more armor and 20% more health in Bear Form
    • 1 min CD 20% dmg reduction (usable while stunned)
    • Off-healing
    • Tranq.

    Spriest:
    • 30s CD cannot be targetet by ranged attacks for 3s
    • 30s CD vanish for 6 sec (deep jk, usable while stunned) or 2 min CD 30% heal or 90s CD 20% of HP absorb when under 30%
    • 60% more armor with inner fire
    • 15% dmg reduction in shadow form
    • 2 min 90% dmg reduction for 6 sec (usable while stunned and silenced)
    • 1,5 min CD grip
    • 6 min CD lifeswap

    Elemental:
    • 30s CD 25% more HP below 30% or 1 min CD 40k shield or 40% dmg reduction for 6 sec
    • off-healing
    • Healing Tide
    • Lots of armor
    Last edited by Enaina; 2012-12-16 at 06:16 AM.

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire shell's Avatar
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    As much as I would like to hope that we're going to get something in 5.2, I'd rather not be disappointed if we don't. However, whatever we get IF we get something, I just want it to be something that prevents us from being tunneled, has a reasonable cd, and a reasonable length.

    If they give us a new dr with a totem or attach a dr to a glyph, I'll probably laugh hysterically...and then cry. A lot of people are saying just give us Sham Rage but we share enough abilities as it is.

    I don't really have anything that I've thought through but a second wind type ability could be good. Not passive or maybe not as long-lasting, but usable under the effect of some type of crowd control whether its stuns or some other cc.
    Last edited by shell; 2012-12-16 at 08:03 AM.
    These words in my mouth... where did they come from? I don't think I'm the one that put them there...

  3. #3
    Should bring back the original astral shift.

    When stunned, feared or silenced you shift into the Astral Plane reducing all damage taken by 30% for the duration of the stun, fear or silence effect.

    Or give us a passive damage reduction like boomkins, considering we always get trained.

  4. #4
    The Elemental's current proactive definsive capabilities aren't too hot for PvE, either...

  5. #5
    Warchief
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    You forgot the most important defensive skills of Mages and Warlocks, they're Invisibility and Soul Shatter. Blink is not a defensive skill, the boss will still kill you if you pull aggro and blink away.
    Btw, Mages have only 1 ice block each 5 mins, not 2.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by thebdc View Post
    The Elemental's current proactive definsive capabilities aren't too hot for PvE, either...
    I'm fine with it currently.

    Astral Shift solved the Problem that you got nothing for predictable big hits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
    Btw, Mages have only 1 ice block each 5 mins, not 2.
    Most People in PvP play with Cold Snap, therefore they got 2 Ice Block.


    Personally i would like to see something different like old Astral Shift, but in the direction of it.

    "Everytime you get stunned,feared or silenced, you protect yourself with a Shield that absorbs X% of your total hp, the Shields lasts until fully triggered, cannot occur more than once every minute"

    Numbers should be about 20%-30%, with less it may be too weak and with more it would soak probably too much damage outside of Enemies' CD's.
    Last edited by Kralljin; 2012-12-16 at 11:23 AM.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  7. #7
    Dreadlord zenga's Avatar
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    I honestly hope they do more than just giving us 1 defensive cd. I expect a nerf to purge and totemic restoration in the (near) future, definitely if they change/nerf blood fear. Then a 30s grounding will be too good for resto shamans imo.

    So with that in mind I'd go for:

    - Adding lava burst back to the unleashed fury flametongue effect (for whatever % that is reasonable), and a small buff to lightning bolt, this talent has great potential for pvp, but the trade off is too expensive atm. It could become a contender for pve as well this way.
    - Wind shear gets 2 charges for ele. each takes 20s to recharge (like how double time works with charge for warriors, i.e. an ele could cast 2 wind shears in a row, but then both need 20s to recharge). Our interrupt was the best in the game and an iconic ability for ele, I'd love to have back the very best interrupt in the game, relative to other specs.
    - Frost shock glyph: frost shock now also consumes lightning shield stacks (but for a reduced effect).
    - Each lightning shield orb gives us 2% dmg mitigation
    - Astral shift usable during stuns.
    - Thunderstorm adds a 2s stun (that dr's with other stuns in the game). And after using thunderstorm you take 50% less damage for x seconds.
    - Totems usable during blanket silence.

  8. #8
    They should change EQ to something survival related since its useless atm anyway.

    Something like:
    - long CD
    - instant cast
    - huge avoidance to all sources for few seconds
    - small aoe around you with 100% chance to knockdown enemy, then slowdown for rest of its duration (like earthgrab totem).

    Thats what Earthquake means btw and what it allways did in WC3. aoe dmg with movement slowdown and huge change that enemies will miss target.
    Last edited by Diphal; 2012-12-16 at 01:45 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Diphal View Post
    They should change EQ to something survival related since its useless atm anyway.

    Something like:
    - long CD
    - instant cast
    - huge avoidance to all sources for few seconds
    - small aoe around you with 100% chance to knockdown enemy, then slowdown for rest of its duration (like earthgrab totem).

    Thats what Earthquake means btw and what it allways did in WC3. aoe dmg with movement slowdown and huge change that enemies will miss target.
    Anything that EQ did in WC3 was Damage to buildings and slowing down ANY Non Air Unit entering the EQ, nothing more.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  10. #10
    Scarab Lord Nest's Avatar
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    Elementals should be able to use totems during silences.
    Dumb nerf to Resto that nerfs both Elemental and Enhancement... :<
    Heyoo!

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
    You forgot the most important defensive skills of Mages and Warlocks, they're Invisibility and Soul Shatter. Blink is not a defensive skill, the boss will still kill you if you pull aggro and blink away.
    Btw, Mages have only 1 ice block each 5 mins, not 2.
    This is more in terms of PvP since that is where GhostCrawler said we lacked CDs. And yea blink is survivability, it removes stuns

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-16 at 03:01 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by shell View Post
    As much as I would like to hope that we're going to get something in 5.2, I'd rather not be disappointed if we don't.
    He said it 3 times on twitter. I cannot imagine anything else

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Kralljin View Post
    Anything that EQ did in WC3 was Damage to buildings and slowing down ANY Non Air Unit entering the EQ, nothing more.
    Ok mr. accurate, GL with doing damage to buldings in WoW.

    Its more lore related. When u imagine earthquake and what it does-> you cant hit a damn thing, while taking some damage and moving rly slow, maybe even falling down on your ass. Obviously units were not affected by damage in WC3 because the spell would become too strong.

  13. #13
    Herald of the Titans Emfg's Avatar
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    Boomkin:
    15% dmg reduction in moonkin form,
    30s CD leap forward into stealth(usable while silenced)
    NS healing touch or 2 min CD 30% heal
    120% more armor and 20% more health in Bear Form
    1 min CD 20% dmg reduction (usable while stunned)
    Off-healing
    Tranq.

    Elemental:
    30s CD 25% more HP below 30% or 1 min CD 40k shield or 40% dmg reduction for 6 sec
    off-healing
    Healing Tide
    Lots of armor

    Bear form isn't viable AT ALL, you do know that? Off-heals are also INCREDIBLY weak because healing touch is a 2.4 sec cast. Boomkins also don't have an absorption shield or an effective AoE root.

    You also forgot to mention things ele shamans have. Because you guys also have an instant heal from your NS talent. 30% xtra HP every 30 seconds when below 35% hp (or less idk) is a lot stronger than Barkskin is tbh. Healing Tide is also stronger. Just saying.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Terahertz View Post
    Boomkin:
    15% dmg reduction in moonkin form,
    30s CD leap forward into stealth(usable while silenced)
    NS healing touch or 2 min CD 30% heal
    120% more armor and 20% more health in Bear Form
    1 min CD 20% dmg reduction (usable while stunned)
    Off-healing
    Tranq.

    Elemental:
    30s CD 25% more HP below 30% or 1 min CD 40k shield or 40% dmg reduction for 6 sec
    off-healing
    Healing Tide
    Lots of armor

    Bear form isn't viable AT ALL, you do know that? Off-heals are also INCREDIBLY weak because healing touch is a 2.4 sec cast. Boomkins also don't have an absorption shield or an effective AoE root.

    You also forgot to mention things ele shamans have. Because you guys also have an instant heal from your NS talent. 30% xtra HP every 30 seconds when below 35% hp (or less idk) is a lot stronger than Barkskin is tbh. Healing Tide is also stronger. Just saying.
    Healing Tide is good if everyone takes dmg, doesn't help if you get trained. And boomkins can NS Healing Touch + it's a 50% bigger heal. It's around 80k heal without crit, we can NS Healing Surge for 25k ish. Physical dmg reduction from the armor in bear form is around 18% more, so if you take physical damage it's 3% more + 20% more HP. The 20% more HP part is decent.

    And boomkin is probably not quite there yet, so it's bad to compare us with those. Don't underestimate their passive 15% dmg reduction in moonkin form.

  15. #15
    Typhoon, Cyclone, Entangling roots, Dash, 30 different charges. He left those off too.

  16. #16
    Dreadlord zenga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilvaAger View Post
    Typhoon, Cyclone, Entangling roots, Dash, 30 different charges. He left those off too.
    + all shit they get from symbiosis
    + all they are one of the highest dmg dealers currently in pvp

    either way, i don't see the point why 'other specs' come here to tell ele shamans dont have the problems they claim

  17. #17
    also rejuv is at least an instant hot, healing stream is but while rejuv requires dispells healing stream requires u poke it...

    riptide baseline would be nice for an on the move "i wont be locked out of, LIGHTNING BOLT, CHAIN LIGHTNING, TOTEMS, WIND SHEAR, THUNDERSTORM" heal, if someone catches me with an interrupt. but riptide alone wouldn't be enough.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by zenga View Post
    + all shit they get from symbiosis
    + all they are one of the highest dmg dealers currently in pvp

    either way, i don't see the point why 'other specs' come here to tell ele shamans dont have the problems they claim
    Yea exactly, I never actually said we needed one in my first post, yet people assume that.

    And yea list was just to give an idea

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Terahertz View Post
    Boomkin:
    15% dmg reduction in moonkin form,
    30s CD leap forward into stealth(usable while silenced)
    NS healing touch or 2 min CD 30% heal
    120% more armor and 20% more health in Bear Form
    1 min CD 20% dmg reduction (usable while stunned)
    Off-healing
    Tranq.

    Elemental:
    30s CD 25% more HP below 30% or 1 min CD 40k shield or 40% dmg reduction for 6 sec
    off-healing
    Healing Tide
    Lots of armor

    Bear form isn't viable AT ALL, you do know that? Off-heals are also INCREDIBLY weak because healing touch is a 2.4 sec cast. Boomkins also don't have an absorption shield or an effective AoE root.

    You also forgot to mention things ele shamans have. Because you guys also have an instant heal from your NS talent. 30% xtra HP every 30 seconds when below 35% hp (or less idk) is a lot stronger than Barkskin is tbh. Healing Tide is also stronger. Just saying.
    and ursol vortex or mass entanglement are not aoe rots ?

  20. #20
    "Lighting shield now also gives the wearer 15%-10% damage reduction

    Lightning shield is now exclusive to enhance and elemental and cannot be used by resto."

    Someone posted that on the official forums and I agree with it. Ele is super fragile and really needs the passive damage reduction and though Enhc is in a good spot it is also quite squishy.

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