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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Methanar View Post
    Was their war on Scientology a success?
    It's not a war, it's just a bunch of bored people messing with people they don't like. That's really it.
    Also the people that did that and the people that did this are different people.

  2. #82
    Immortal Manakin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hastings95 View Post
    No, religion does not kill people, people who manipulate people using religion kill people. Personally, I greatly dislike religion, I do, but it really doesn't do the killing, it's just a tool commonly used to manipulate people to get them to do the killing. You said something about the Crusades, that wasn't religion, that was the manipulation of it.
    Fair enough, i gave a wrong example... But without christianity there wouldnt of been any of the faith crusades launched, man wouldnt of slaughtered mass's of innocent people simply because they refused to accept religion forced upon them.

    So to each end man and religion is to blame, it can bring out the worse of each person.

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Spectral View Post
    You know what's worse? Actually hurting people.[COLOR="red"]
    I hate it when people claim physical violence is the worst you can do to someone.

  4. #84
    The Lightbringer DEATHETERNAL's Avatar
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    Religious focused response:
    As a nation, we do deserve punishment. By that same token, every individual from myself to Hitler to the most pious and righteous man alive deserves punishment and condemnation. We should not revel in what may or may not be the punishment of others as even when it is just punishment; it is punishment we ourselves deserve as well. Beyond that, God does not punish joyfully, He does it with a heavy heart as He loves even the most wayward of his flock. It is our place to try to save those we can, not be joyful in the condemnation of others when we deserve the same thing and when God takes no joy in such undesired but necessary condemnation. In that, the WBC fail to recognize and follow one of the two prime directives of Christianity, to act as Christ like as is possible (the other being to have Christian faith). Christ warned while primarily trying to save all who would listen before His sacrifice; He did not come simply to tell us how screwed we are and take joy in our state of failure.

    Do not try to just be cheerleaders of condemnation; there is no joy in condemnation and such action by you is not needed or wanted by God. Try instead, to save (which is clearly not the goal of WBC).

    Political focused response:
    You cannot censor or bring legal action against these people (for what they say, if they commit an actual crime go for it) regardless of what they say as their speech is not harming anyone (hurt feelings don’t count otherwise I want the whole Democratic party censored ). To do so would be to continue the trend we are already on of destroying liberties that are actually specified within the Constitution, while at the same time forcing one group to give liberties to another group at the expense of the liberty of the first group when the second group is not constitutionally owed such liberties. If we continue does this path, then we will have a government that has no limit in its power. You may think it good to limit the liberty of another, but the moment that you do so, you condemn yourself or your children or your children’s children to have their liberty limited unjustly using as precedent the limitation of liberty that you yourself supported.

    I also refer to my previously stated solution to the WBC for those of you who have these people picketing at funerals (go all Jesus throwing out the money changers at the temple on them).
    Quote Originally Posted by DEATHETERNAL View Post
    Trying to remove constitutional rights isn’t the way to go. The best way to deal with people like this is to make it reasonably clear they are not allowed on some piece of private property (a church in this case), wait till one of them is stupid enough to go onto said piece of private property, and then shoot them for willfully trespassing (whether it’s legal to do so or not).

    Quote Originally Posted by Manakin View Post
    So to each end man and religion is to blame, it can bring out the worse of each person.
    Several of the most murderous regimes in history were atheistic. ANYTHING can bring out the worst in each person or be used as an excuse by a person as we are all inherently evil.
    Last edited by DEATHETERNAL; 2012-12-19 at 05:20 AM.
    And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him.
    Revelation 6:8

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Hastings95 View Post
    Wait....so limiting free speech, and that evolving into something where people can be punished for speaking out of turn, or against the government, etc, is based off of speculation?
    See: Soviet Union.
    See: Nazi Germany(Scroll to Nazi Germany section of article)...
    Yep, still speculation and still bad speculation at that. You really think our society is similar to Nazi Germany or Communist Soviet Union? Maybe you should brush up on your history, but the reality is that simply because those societies oppressed free speech does not in any way whatsoever mean that the same would be the case here in the United States. Again, just THINK about it logically. Do you honestly believe if the government added ONE MINOR law to address extremist freedom of speech than suddenly ALL of our freedom of speech would go out the window? This scenario is utterly implausible. Just think about it.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Alixie View Post
    I hate it when people claim physical violence is the worst you can do to someone.
    I hate it when people claim saying mean things is worse than murder.

  7. #87
    Immortal Manakin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Well I don't know about other religions. I'm christian and god sure as hell doesn't say "kill those who don't believe in me".
    You shouldnt be so naive to believe theres only one make believe god right? Theres been plenty of people tapping that honeypot man But yes, there are religions that instruct people to kill non believers ect.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Manakin View Post
    Fair enough, i gave a wrong example... But without christianity there wouldnt of been any of the faith crusades launched, man wouldnt of slaughtered mass's of innocent people simply because they refused to accept religion forced upon them.

    So to each end man and religion is to blame, it can bring out the worse of each person.
    So does a lot of things. You can't blame it on the religion, or the cause of the act. It's the sole fault of the person who does the killing. As I said, I haven't killed anyone who isn't christian, I haven't hurt anyone in the name of my religion. Because it's not the religion that causes it.
    I'm the minister of mistakes. I'm the shaman of sh*tstorms. If there was a f**k-up pope. I'd have a 3 foot hat!

  9. #89
    Bloodsail Admiral Goatfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    Religion is a belief, not a motive. People create the motive to kill others in the name of the belief.
    Religion is used as a motive. I meant my words as I said them thank you very much. Religion is the main motivator in hundreds if not thousands of crimes small and of great proportion throughout history. Religion is the cause in those cases, with people as the trigger. Very few cases are guns simply existing the primary motivation for a crime, people in general don't just say "I have a gun so I should rob this bank simply because I have the gun, I don't even need the cash." People have said; "This person doesn't believe in my religion, so I'm going to prosecute him just because he doesn't believe in my religion."

    In fact, they have said that quite often indeed. Religion is used as a motivator for inhumane acts quite often. You can believe in religion yes, but it is a motivate at heart. I can believe in a gun, but it doesn't motivate me to do anything, it's just an object and not a system of beliefs brought about to "motivate people".

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Manakin View Post
    Fair enough, i gave a wrong example... But without christianity there wouldnt of been any of the faith crusades launched, man wouldnt of slaughtered mass's of innocent people simply because they refused to accept religion forced upon them.

    So to each end man and religion is to blame, it can bring out the worse of each person.
    Without religion we wouldn't have had the artistic age of Europe, or arguably the fall monarchies. It also has led to some of the most successful charities. Say what you will, but religion really helped us advance as a species and can bring out the best of a person.
    And yes man would have slaughtered innocents as they always have and always will. Violence is in our nature, and whether we are controlled through nationalism, fear, religion, false senses of superiority or anything else, we will always fight.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Manakin View Post
    You shouldnt be so naive to believe theres only one make believe god right? Theres been plenty of people tapping that honeypot man But yes, there are religions that instruct people to kill non believers ect.
    Allah
    Atum, Ra, Amun, Ptah.
    Aphrodite, Apollo, Zeus, Hades, Poseidon.
    Buddha

    I'm not that naive. I know of other religion's gods. I just don't look into their teachings.
    I'm the minister of mistakes. I'm the shaman of sh*tstorms. If there was a f**k-up pope. I'd have a 3 foot hat!

  12. #92
    Immortal Manakin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandragon View Post
    So does a lot of things. You can't blame it on the religion, or the cause of the act. It's the sole fault of the person who does the killing. As I said, I haven't killed anyone who isn't christian, I haven't hurt anyone in the name of my religion. Because it's not the religion that causes it.
    Wrong, some religions DO instruct there believers to kill non believers. But you seem so certain that religion cannot influence death? Why not, its perfectly reasonable to accept that people were killed in the name of religion. Be it sacrificial, or in wars.

    But be it anyway, you have not killed anyone in the name of your religion - good for you. No really, i just dont believe in fairy tales especially when some of them instruct people to kill and people have died over it.

  13. #93
    Was probably already mentioned but calling a bunch of imbeciles the most disgusting human beings on the face of the planet earth when on the other side of the globe 10 year olds get encouraged to behead tied up men seems quite retarded.

  14. #94
    Quick, give them as much attention as you can! If we talk about them and put a lot of thought and energy into their actions, we will surely deter them from doing all these awful things.

  15. #95
    Moderator Anakso's Avatar
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    We already have a thread on the WBC that has included discussion on this protest Here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...hate-group-WBC

    Feel free to talk about this there, or in one of the Sandy Hook threads.

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