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  1. #1

    Why is hunter design so lazy?

    Lets analyze how the hunter specs are designed:

    • Signature shot (Explosive Shot, Chimera Shot, Kill Command)
    • Focus builder (Cobra Shot, Cobra Shot, Steady Shot)
    • Extra button (Black Arrow, Aimed Shot, Bestial Wrath)
    • Press lit up button (AiS!, LnL, Focus Fire)

    It seems like they just literally copy and fucking paste abilities. What makes it even worse is, this design has remained unchanged since Cata, so what have they done to fix it? They add three tiers of damage cooldowns, and they make the only unique hunter mechanic, ISS, irrelevant. It just really feels like whoever is in charge of hunter design has absolutely no idea what they are doing - this issue doesn't occur in any other pure class either - compare Demonology to Affliction, Subtlety to Assassination, Arcane to Fire, etc.

    That isn't the only issue, the class itself has no real flavor either. Our damage is fine as of the most recent patch, maybe even good, but the class really does not require a whole lot of effort to play, nor does it require much in the way of planning or forethought. I really feel like they could do a lot better, perhaps give us a spec with no focus builder (instead relying on focus regen), or a spec that has no pet and instead has more complex player mechanics. Maybe it'd be unfair to rock the boat and change up the specs, but I can't be the only one who feels this way.
    Last edited by Gunba; 2012-12-19 at 03:33 PM.

  2. #2
    dis guy know what he be talkin aboot

  3. #3
    Stood in the Fire
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    Brings up some great points.

    infracted - no meme's, please.
    Last edited by Dracodraco; 2012-12-19 at 04:22 PM.
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  4. #4
    Are you mud?

    Playing alt hunter sucks, all the specs feel the same.
    Quote Originally Posted by Offhand
    I think this thread proves that in WotLK, not only has being bad and lazy become acceptable, but a defendable position and point of pride for some people.

  5. #5
    Infracted - no meme's, please.
    Last edited by Dracodraco; 2012-12-19 at 04:22 PM.

  6. #6
    They all have varying cooldowns and proc rates. It's refreshing enough in my opinion.

    Also, you have to manage your pet a bit as BM to ensure you use Kill Command properly.

  7. #7
    Hunter isn't the class for you, obviously.

  8. #8
    Rely on focus regen? Are you serious?
    Last edited by Mokaproductionist; 2012-12-19 at 05:55 PM.

  9. #9
    High Overlord
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    They all have the same feel, but at a top top level, they all play very very differently.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Divinespeed View Post
    They all have the same feel, but at a top top level, they all play very very differently.
    This......I think the bigger problem is that hunter's do not have the utility and/or big raid CDs that a lot of other classes have. We also do not have gimmicky abilities that make us essential for fights like other classes. The hunter design is steadily improving and is arguably the best it's ever been imo. Aside from the CD and dps issues (which are getting slooooooooooooowly remedied) I like the design of the class quite a bit.

  11. #11
    It's simple. That doesn't always mean lazy.


    "meme's" jesus christ

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunba View Post
    or a spec that has no pet and instead has more complex player mechanics.
    yes please

    make it happen bli$$ard

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Divinespeed View Post
    They all have the same feel, but at a top top level, they all play very very differently.
    Can you give me some examples? I really don't agree with this at all. There is arbitrary bullshit like not using entrapment on top of melee, or the fact that survival AOE becomes better with less targets. People might over focus on simple mechanics because we have no complicated ones (i.e. using Focus Fire correctly for an extra 200 dps), but this is just an artificial disparity.

  14. #14
    my issue with the devs and hunters is they seem to forget about them when building raid content. more then half the fights right now have issues with regards to pets. without a "petless' spec we are forced to work around the issues or flat out be sat during progression because they fail to consider pet mechanics in with everything else.

    The other issue is GC has even commented that hunters have too many buttons, and on top of more buttons then every other class we HAVE to manage a pet as well.

  15. #15
    Epic! RaoBurning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis003 View Post
    my issue with the devs and hunters is they seem to forget about them when building raid content. more then half the fights right now have issues with regards to pets. without a "petless' spec we are forced to work around the issues or flat out be sat during progression because they fail to consider pet mechanics in with everything else.

    The other issue is GC has even commented that hunters have too many buttons, and on top of more buttons then every other class we HAVE to manage a pet as well.
    Warlock says hi, but your point is noted all the same.

    I wouldn't call it lazy so much as copy pasta, I guess? Each spec being similar makes it easy to adjust my play style and action bars when I feel like trying a new one. BM is just different enough due to high pet reliance that I feel like it's a real alternative to the other two.

    So, yea, not lazy. Just, umm... spec swap friendly.
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  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by hksin11186 View Post
    Warlock says hi, but your point is noted all the same.

    I wouldn't call it lazy so much as copy pasta, I guess? Each spec being similar makes it easy to adjust my play style and action bars when I feel like trying a new one. BM is just different enough due to high pet reliance that I feel like it's a real alternative to the other two.

    So, yea, not lazy. Just, umm... spec swap friendly.
    Since when are warlocks not raiding in affliction with Grimoire of Sacrifice? They get rid of their pet. Last time I checked affliction was the top spec.

    I actually like the hunter feel, I'd love an option like Grimoire of Sacrifice though. Having a pet is just so stupid sometimes.

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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehstool View Post
    Since when are warlocks not raiding in affliction with Grimoire of Sacrifice? They get rid of their pet. Last time I checked affliction was the top spec.

    I actually like the hunter feel, I'd love an option like Grimoire of Sacrifice though. Having a pet is just so stupid sometimes.
    especially when you have to hit a /petattack macro 6-10 times to make it actually attack your target instead of running off somewhere else.

    the pet AI is very very old... its something they need to either make work with ALL ENCOUNTERS or make it so we have the option of going without the pet.

  18. #18
    I just wish there was a fight where hunters would actually shine.

    Every dps gimmick in Wotlk/Cata/Mop raids does not benefit hunters as much as it does for other classes (since most of them are haste related). We only shine on Patchwerk style fights (after the double buff).

    I think the class design is fine tbh.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunba View Post
    Can you give me some examples? I really don't agree with this at all. There is arbitrary bullshit like not using entrapment on top of melee, or the fact that survival AOE becomes better with less targets. People might over focus on simple mechanics because we have no complicated ones (i.e. using Focus Fire correctly for an extra 200 dps), but this is just an artificial disparity.
    SV AoE becomes better with more targets. ISS + Serpent sting on every target = essentially ignoring the AoE Cap (aside from the base multishot), something many other classes can't do.

    OT: Yes, the specs have been pretty similar for quite a long time. As much as I'd like and want a petless spec, I don't think it really lines up with their vision of the class. And I don't see something with no focus builder being okay, either. Managing your resource is something they want you to have to do, passively giving you enough to do everything is unlikely (like rogues just rely on passive regen of energy, but they also rely heavily on combo points). I'm not saying there aren't ways to give things some more variety, but I don't think its really that simple.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis003 View Post
    especially when you have to hit a /petattack macro 6-10 times to make it actually attack your target instead of running off somewhere else.

    the pet AI is very very old... its something they need to either make work with ALL ENCOUNTERS or make it so we have the option of going without the pet.
    Oh yeah, earlier tonight when I had to bring a wind serpent for the magic damage debuff for amber shaper. I wanted to keep it on passive and /petattack it onto the amber monstrosity or who ever was targeted by reshape life. Turns out wind serpents like to put on their debuff and run back to you if they are on passive. So... Yeah.

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