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  1. #161
    I've avoided responding to this thread... But I think I will since I have nothing better to do (sick atm).

    Swtor, over the past year, has been a great example of how NOT to run an MMO.

    We had an incredibly smooth launch. The queues were annoying but the fact that we didn't have a super server was more annoying. If they didn't have the technology to support a few million players on 6 servers they should have at least launched with an instant, free transfer service so people could shuffle around between servers when the tide of launch day players subsided.
    The end game PVE was buggy, but that's to be expected at launch. The fact it wasn't fixed was very odd. But hey, they plan on launching new stuff all the time so what does it matter if t1 wasn't great? And t2 was right around the corner.
    Ilum was okay. Not perfect. But alright. There were countless ways they could have improved it, but they instead just shut the whole thing down. Worst solution ever.
    1.2 was the best patch swtor ever had. It fixed most the fps issues and bugged, helped with balance a little in pvp, and introduced a great raid. The rakghoul event was extremely fun.

    Then things went from good to terrible.
    6 month dead zone of content. Cobbled together transfer service. Staff fired. Great ideas scrapped. Nothing new on SSSP since guild summit.

    F2P is announced! Finally, the model I thought they should have launched with. Will they focus on a IP/RP league system or a lotro turbine coin system with an in-game unlock system? No. They went with a EQ2 like freemium model that was even worse than EQ2. They focused on punishing F2Pers instead of improving the lives of subscribers. Why? Probably because they haven't figured out how to add new features to give to subscribers. But it was a workable model. I bought all my unlocks off the GTN for cheap (including artifact gear authorization). But then they broke their F2P system and started "losing" peoples unlocks.

    Now we are here. The most mismanaged MMO I have ever seen. Great game. Terrible dev team. There are so many ways they could improve their game but they just keep doing the wrong things. Over and over.

    Will we see a F2P revival like we saw in AoC or Lotro or Dcuo? Probably not. This system doesn't do everything in its power to expand its player base and it will pay for it.
    Lv40 (Firefall) Dragonfly, Mammoth, Nighthawk, Arsenal, Tigerclaw
    Lv50 (FF14) Paladin, Warrior (Swtor) Agent, Warrior, Knight, Inquisitor, Trooper, Consular, Smuggler, Hunter
    Lv60 (NWO) Rogue, Fighter, Wizard, Guardian, Cleric (Rift) Rogue
    Lv80/85 (GW2) Thief (WoW) Rogue, Mage, Priest, Hunter, Warlock, Warrior, Death Knight, Paladin, Druid, Shaman

  2. #162
    HK I hear what you are saying and agree, but there is one major problem and reason why they won't change their current setup. Because there are too many derptards that are using the cartel market and making it profitable for bioware and EA. So while a lot of players are upset and enraged there are still many that are throwing money at the cartel market like it is going out of style. There is one guy on my server that claims to have spent 25,000 dollars on the cartel market as well as 23,000 on buying credits (verified on the credits and that he is rich IRL). When you have people throwing money like that at bioware and credit sites you are never going to see things change because they think money equals customer satisfaction.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem4aDr3am View Post
    HK I hear what you are saying and agree, but there is one major problem and reason why they won't change their current setup. Because there are too many derptards that are using the cartel market and making it profitable for bioware and EA. So while a lot of players are upset and enraged there are still many that are throwing money at the cartel market like it is going out of style. There is one guy on my server that claims to have spent 25,000 dollars on the cartel market as well as 23,000 on buying credits (verified on the credits and that he is rich IRL). When you have people throwing money like that at bioware and credit sites you are never going to see things change because they think money equals customer satisfaction.
    Good lord, if I had 25k and was rich I wouldn't be wasting my life playing this game. The dude must REALLY love SWTOR, lmao.

    So yeah, EA pretty much has no reason to improve the game because their making shit loads off of those damn cartel packs(obviously the most bought thing in the cartel market). Those things are pure gambling, I've spent $30 on them and still havn't got that damn chair mount. Just a bunch of worthless shit.

    The packs remind me of those shitty asian f2p games. You have gambling f2p mechanics everywhere you look.

  4. #164
    Got the game at release and pretty much been playing it since, well this and LOTRO. I've lost all interest in WoW, playing the same game for 6+ years tends to have that effect.

    I'm a gamer who doesn't find enjoyment out of the end game but the story and how it is presented, TOR and LOTRO hit the nail on the head for me in that respect, i'm just taking my time casually doing story quests. I can see why people wouldn't like it though, after all i don't like tomatoes.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by wombinator04 View Post
    Good lord, if I had 25k and was rich I wouldn't be wasting my life playing this game. The dude must REALLY love SWTOR, lmao.

    The packs remind me of those shitty asian f2p games. You have gambling f2p mechanics everywhere you look.
    Erm, who says he's wasting his life? He's clearly got a ton of expendable income/savings, so who's to say that he hasn't been traveling/enjoying other things, and decided to drop a bit (for him) of cash on another activity he enjoys?

    And the packs sell super well. You can find them in almost a lot of cash shops (CoH had it, CO has it, and some others have it as well) because they're cheap to implement, and very profitable for the developers. I'm not a fan of them, but clearly enough other people like them and they don't really affect me at all, so meh.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem4aDr3am View Post
    There is one guy on my server that claims to have spent 25,000 dollars on the cartel market as well as 23,000 on buying credits (verified on the credits and that he is rich IRL).
    He spent the $25,000 on enough CC to buy his unlocks so he can finally play F2P comfortably. :P

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    He spent the $25,000 on enough CC to buy his unlocks so he can finally play F2P comfortably. :P
    Look, I know its funny to make fun of their terrible model but you can easily get everything under the cap.

    Mock the model within the bounds of reality (its very easy, as it is bad.)
    Lv40 (Firefall) Dragonfly, Mammoth, Nighthawk, Arsenal, Tigerclaw
    Lv50 (FF14) Paladin, Warrior (Swtor) Agent, Warrior, Knight, Inquisitor, Trooper, Consular, Smuggler, Hunter
    Lv60 (NWO) Rogue, Fighter, Wizard, Guardian, Cleric (Rift) Rogue
    Lv80/85 (GW2) Thief (WoW) Rogue, Mage, Priest, Hunter, Warlock, Warrior, Death Knight, Paladin, Druid, Shaman

  8. #168
    Quote Originally Posted by hk-51 View Post
    Look, I know its funny to make fun of their terrible model but you can easily get everything under the cap.

    Mock the model within the bounds of reality (its very easy, as it is bad.)
    I figured that the ":P" would have made it pretty clear that I was just joking. You know, humor through hyperbole.

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    I figured that the ":P" would have made it pretty clear that I was just joking. You know, humor through hyperbole.
    The flu tends to mess with my humor dreydis. My b.
    Lv40 (Firefall) Dragonfly, Mammoth, Nighthawk, Arsenal, Tigerclaw
    Lv50 (FF14) Paladin, Warrior (Swtor) Agent, Warrior, Knight, Inquisitor, Trooper, Consular, Smuggler, Hunter
    Lv60 (NWO) Rogue, Fighter, Wizard, Guardian, Cleric (Rift) Rogue
    Lv80/85 (GW2) Thief (WoW) Rogue, Mage, Priest, Hunter, Warlock, Warrior, Death Knight, Paladin, Druid, Shaman

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Requiem4aDr3am View Post
    HK I hear what you are saying and agree, but there is one major problem and reason why they won't change their current setup. Because there are too many derptards that are using the cartel market and making it profitable for bioware and EA. So while a lot of players are upset and enraged there are still many that are throwing money at the cartel market like it is going out of style. There is one guy on my server that claims to have spent 25,000 dollars on the cartel market as well as 23,000 on buying credits (verified on the credits and that he is rich IRL). When you have people throwing money like that at bioware and credit sites you are never going to see things change because they think money equals customer satisfaction.
    Let's please refrain from calling people (even in hypothetical general senses) names just because they choose to spend money differently than you do. You don't know everyone who spends money on swtor to be able to make any sort of assessment of their character or mental capacities. Different people value things differently, and that is fine.

  11. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by scamander View Post
    ...on old threads in this very forum is actually really funny.
    People mentioning that they are dropping WoW for this and never going back, only to have their Sigs / avatars updated to Pandaria ones.
    Saying that this will be the MMO that everyone compares future MMO's to in the future.
    Well, of course everyone thought that.
    It´s a Star Wars game (one of the most beloved IPs at all) made by Bioware (at that time the best RPG company ever). And they had a massive budget and a long time to work on it (so it wasn´t rushed).
    Who could have thought that this perfect gathering could go wrong ?
    I never saw TOR as a WoW killer but i was sure that they would become a major player and a much needed big competitor to wow.

    Although it´s interesting that the EALouse blog that got so many flak at the time in the end turned out to be 100% spot on. Remember ?
    First, the project leaders did not know what they were doing. Jeff Hickman was the saddest excuse for a producer I’ve seen. All he did was drink the Koolaid and suck up to the right people. He was the perfect yes-man, and this reached down to almost all managers.
    or
    And you know what they’re most proud of? This is the kicker. They are most proud of the sound. No seriously. Something like a 20Gig installation, and most of it is voiceover work. That’s the best they have. The rest of the game is a joke. EA knows it and so does George Lucas,they’re panicking , and so most of Mythic has already been cannibalized to work in Austin on it because they can’t keep pushing back launch.

    And it was really visible how they panicked, considering the massive lay-offs that followed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    I really don't get why people slobber all over BioWare's writing in the first place, because it's pretty terrible in general, but the writing in this game doesn't even meet that standard. The general consensus is that the Agent story is the best, and it's only interesting during chapter 2.
    The stories were all over the place and much too rushed. The imperial agent is the best example. Instead of exploring the story you got a new swerve every two quests.Hey you are working for this guy. Now he is a traitor. Oh now you are mind controlled. You are mind controlled no more but are hunting a rep agent. Now he is dead and there is an even bigger enemy group. yada yada yada.
    I found the mind-controlled angle really interesting but it was over so quick it barely had any effect. The whole storyline was like watching a movie in fast forward.
    Last edited by Yriel; 2013-01-02 at 09:21 PM.

  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by wombinator04 View Post
    Good lord, if I had 25k and was rich I wouldn't be wasting my life playing this game. The dude must REALLY love SWTOR, lmao.

    So yeah, EA pretty much has no reason to improve the game because their making shit loads off of those damn cartel packs(obviously the most bought thing in the cartel market). Those things are pure gambling, I've spent $30 on them and still havn't got that damn chair mount. Just a bunch of worthless shit.

    The packs remind me of those shitty asian f2p games. You have gambling f2p mechanics everywhere you look.
    Other people having more money than you are "wasting their time".... maybe some perspective would serve you well.


    You know why that chair is rated "SUPER RARE".... do you? Probably not... maybe. However you could still put up the effort and buy it off the GTN.

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by hk-51 View Post
    I've avoided responding to this thread... But I think I will since I have nothing better to do (sick atm).

    Swtor, over the past year, has been a great example of how NOT to run an MMO.

    We had an incredibly smooth launch. The queues were annoying but the fact that we didn't have a super server was more annoying. If they didn't have the technology to support a few million players on 6 servers they should have at least launched with an instant, free transfer service so people could shuffle around between servers when the tide of launch day players subsided.
    The end game PVE was buggy, but that's to be expected at launch. The fact it wasn't fixed was very odd. But hey, they plan on launching new stuff all the time so what does it matter if t1 wasn't great? And t2 was right around the corner.
    Ilum was okay. Not perfect. But alright. There were countless ways they could have improved it, but they instead just shut the whole thing down. Worst solution ever.
    1.2 was the best patch swtor ever had. It fixed most the fps issues and bugged, helped with balance a little in pvp, and introduced a great raid. The rakghoul event was extremely fun.

    Then things went from good to terrible.
    6 month dead zone of content. Cobbled together transfer service. Staff fired. Great ideas scrapped. Nothing new on SSSP since guild summit.

    F2P is announced! Finally, the model I thought they should have launched with. Will they focus on a IP/RP league system or a lotro turbine coin system with an in-game unlock system? No. They went with a EQ2 like freemium model that was even worse than EQ2. They focused on punishing F2Pers instead of improving the lives of subscribers. Why? Probably because they haven't figured out how to add new features to give to subscribers. But it was a workable model. I bought all my unlocks off the GTN for cheap (including artifact gear authorization). But then they broke their F2P system and started "losing" peoples unlocks.

    Now we are here. The most mismanaged MMO I have ever seen. Great game. Terrible dev team. There are so many ways they could improve their game but they just keep doing the wrong things. Over and over.

    Will we see a F2P revival like we saw in AoC or Lotro or Dcuo? Probably not. This system doesn't do everything in its power to expand its player base and it will pay for it.

    Nah, Bioware are great developers. It's just that EA is Satan and deserves to be taken into the woods and be "let go".

    The population has been growing at a some what steady pace since F2P and I still have hope for Bioware. It's just EA I am afraid of.

  14. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Kneepel View Post
    Nah, Bioware are great developers. It's just that EA is Satan and deserves to be taken into the woods and be "let go".

    The population has been growing at a some what steady pace since F2P and I still have hope for Bioware. It's just EA I am afraid of.
    You talk as if Bioware Austin is anything like the rest of Bioware.

    At this point Bioware Austin is more like Mythic than Bioware.
    Lv40 (Firefall) Dragonfly, Mammoth, Nighthawk, Arsenal, Tigerclaw
    Lv50 (FF14) Paladin, Warrior (Swtor) Agent, Warrior, Knight, Inquisitor, Trooper, Consular, Smuggler, Hunter
    Lv60 (NWO) Rogue, Fighter, Wizard, Guardian, Cleric (Rift) Rogue
    Lv80/85 (GW2) Thief (WoW) Rogue, Mage, Priest, Hunter, Warlock, Warrior, Death Knight, Paladin, Druid, Shaman

  15. #175
    I had high hopes for it. During my leveling, I found I felt I was playing a single player game. Never finished leveling.
    Quite often, the difference between an idiot and a genius is simply a matter of success rate.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by ariakul View Post
    I'm having flashbacks to the Star Wars Galaxies disaster whenever I play this game now..............

    Do they not have a test server for testing?

    The one thing that is going to kill new people from playing: MOVEMENT.

    I made a "real" free to play account, between the 2 hour cool down on using the teleport, and not getting sprint until level 15.............. it is soooooooooo frustrating to play. People will spend most their time in game.................RUNNING. Heck, I found myself committing suicide to just move faster.
    Not to mention they also get less experience and no resting experience so they will have to travel a long time all at the same level grinding.

    For me though what is the most annoying thing is the lack of inventory space and the caps on credits and commendations.

    At max level the credit cap kills you, you can't buy anything even halfway decent on the GTN. People sell unlocks way over the price anyone who needs them can afford. When leveling its not much of a bother because you don't buy too much, but at certain times like speeder training or a level that needs a lot of new abilities its a pain. Free players get locked out of credit case options and many other things while leveling up.

    Commndations are annoying because you can really only buy one thing at a time (the limit and higher prices double whammy this one). If you don't keep track of them they just get automatically discarded if your at the low limit.

    The inventory is a pain, you constantly need to send your companion away to make space. If your away from a vendor you have to start throwing things away (resulting in less money later)

    Other then those major flaws I hate how you are locked outta the simplest things like companion appearance or not showing helmet. It's not like these are constant services that need people working day and night to maintain. They are simple on/off switches. If you are gonna make people pay for things at least make them pay for things you know need people to maintain and be paid.

  17. #177
    Herald of the Titans Keosen's Avatar
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    The none fanatics ones knew that shit will hit the fan sooner or later because of EA, it was no secret.
    Check this thread for example http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...8#post14433718

    Classic EA's overhyping victims, you can't just build a hype of this magnitude and expect to live on it's own.

  18. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by Keosen View Post
    The none fanatics ones knew that shit will hit the fan sooner or later because of EA, it was no secret.
    Check this thread for example http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...8#post14433718

    Classic EA's overhyping victims, you can't just build a hype of this magnitude and expect to live on it's own.
    It really is quite interesting to see how far SWTOR has come since those days. Even looking at the single thread that you've linked it shows just how easy it is to delude players into buying an MMORPG with some interesting leveling scheme and many many promises.

    I mean gems like this:
    I agree with this guy, this game will become the most played MMO in the western market within a years time, I have also been in MMO gaming for over 12 years and seen this pattern happen more then once, it was only a matter of time before a game dethrones WoW, Sw:tor has what it takes because the story is something new just like how WoW theme park approach dethroned EQ1.
    shows how far a few fancy previews will go towards turning people into zealots.

    It's also interesting to see that these people who once fervently defended Bioware and SWTOR are now nowhere to be seen on this section of the forums.

    It's pretty sad to see how poorly thought out SWTOR's design was. They were so incredibly short-sighted as to thinking that some extra audio, meaningless dialogue options (I marry my companion and and all I get is a stim and her permanently ignoring me?), and poor story writing (Mainly the planet quests. Just how many McGuffins are there in the galaxy?) would keep people playing when it is the endgame that keeps people subscribed.

  19. #179
    Field Marshal Cathaia's Avatar
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    I really have been thinking a bit, trying to find a way to put "my last year with SWTOR" down. First of all I still have an active sub, but I don't see myself renewing it anymore in the near future. When I started playing at early access, I was all into the game, and it lasted for a couple months after all; we had a small group of people playing together and just took everything slowly, while of course others were grinding down everything, disappearing as quickly as they showed up.
    The class stories caught me well enough, and I played through 6/8 after all, but even though I tried for a while now, I just can't make myself to at least finish the Trooper who has been in the 40's for half a year already. If it was just for the class stories, I would have done them all, but the rest of the grinding process really wore me out. It just didn't get more exciting doing all those quests over and over again, and the endgame content just couldn't hold up for long to keep me busy (plus adding the fact that I am quite allergic to the notorious "SKIP ALL, skip all trash packs, skip all bosses you don't need to kill to open doors" spamming I witnessed in those few times I used the group finder). For I'd say at least 6 months now I only logged on to raid with the guild, and even that has been running out as we dropped from 2 groups to 1, giving me the chance to retire completely which I did.

    Thinking about it, there are so many small things I complained about already when I saw the first public beta feeds ("are THOSE really all the races we are getting? They all look the same, just with different facepaint *sob*, where are my proper Star Wars races?" <- old SWG player striking in -> "space combat? really? THIS is all we are getting? *sob*"), and the rest just added up over time. I have always been playing more than one game at a time, so to me it was obvious I am done with SWTOR when my main focus was moving away from it more and more every day; I stopped checking forums/reddit on it, e.g.
    Many other people have already summed up the major flaws that nobody can deny, so it would be pointless to add them again - I'll just stick with my opinion: It was fun while it lasted, but what they did (or did not!) to the game just wore me out, and I am moving on. History repeating.
    I am really getting too old for this.

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Argroth View Post
    Commndations are annoying because you can really only buy one thing at a time (the limit and higher prices double whammy this one). If you don't keep track of them they just get automatically discarded if your at the low limit.
    .
    I didn't find the commendation limit to be too bad. I usually made sure to spend them on Item Mods (enhancements, mods, hilts, armoring).

    The 30 inventory limit does stink.

    What sucks with the unlocks off the GTN though, is that if it bugs out (which seems like there is a 50-50 chance) you are screwed. Plus people selling them for more than they are worth.

    What doesn't make sense though, for Cartel Unlocks: Epic Equipment unlock is like 600 cc, then the account wide one is 1700. Um, this is like a Grocery Store selling a single can of beer for $1, but then offering a 6 pack for $9.

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