The Spirit Kings and Shroud Bug? Or not?

[Deleted]

Hello fellow backstabbers. Long time user of the threads and help here but I needed to ask for some advice. A little background is that we are a returning guild/community who last played in wrath. We've only been back 2 or so weeks and we're beginning to tackle MSV 10m

Last week in my guilds raid, I used shroud of concealment + distract to help maneuver the raid into the middle of the room to allow for a clean pull. After our tank pulled, the boss ran over to the raid and 1 shot the tank. The wipe was called and we reset the encounter. On the 2nd pull the exact same thing happened and this is where my problem comes.

The MT is also the GM and was very quick to blame me and my usage of shroud on the wipe. Claiming that it makes the concealed members of the raid immune to the raid boss damage, therefor making him eat the frontal attack solo.

Now, our tanks maneuvering is erratic at best and it is almost impossibly difficult for the rest of the raid to stack on him for a clean pull to avoid the 1 shot cleave. My observations on both pulls is that after using his shield thingy [our MT is a palla] he tweaked his position slightly in relation to the raid by a couple of yards. Basically leaving him out of the group.

My reputation within the guild has somewhat took a bit of a nose dive with multiple players now simply believing I am the cause of the wipe. I consider myself an OKish player with a strive to bettee myself. So with that said I have trawled the internet for the last few days looking for any signs that this could indeed be my fault. However, my investigations have come up negative. Does anyone know of said bug or have had their own experiences with it. Has anyone used shroud on this encounter successfully?

Is it my fault or could it be the tanks positioning?

If it is indeed my fault then I'd happy hold up my hands but being a proud kinda guy, I guess I need some backing considering the crap Ive had to put up with since this incident.

Any and all help is much welcome and appreciated <3

Tnx

[Deafyx]

Hello fellow backstabbers. Long time user of the threads and help here but I needed to ask for some advice. A little background is that we are a returning guild/community who last played in wrath. We've only been back 2 or so weeks and we're beginning to tackle MSV 10m

Last week in my guilds raid, I used shroud of concealment + distract to help maneuver the raid into the middle of the room to allow for a clean pull. After our tank pulled, the boss ran over to the raid and 1 shot the tank. The wipe was called and we reset the encounter. On the 2nd pull the exact same thing happened and this is where my problem comes.

The MT is also the GM and was very quick to blame me and my usage of shroud on the wipe. Claiming that it makes the concealed members of the raid immune to the raid boss damage, therefor making him eat the frontal attack solo.

Now, our tanks maneuvering is erratic at best and it is almost impossibly difficult for the rest of the raid to stack on him for a clean pull to avoid the 1 shot cleave. My observations on both pulls is that after using his shield thingy [our MT is a palla] he tweaked his position slightly in relation to the raid by a couple of yards. Basically leaving him out of the group.

My reputation within the guild has somewhat took a bit of a nose dive with multiple players now simply believing I am the cause of the wipe. I consider myself an OKish player with a strive to bettee myself. So with that said I have trawled the internet for the last few days looking for any signs that this could indeed be my fault. However, my investigations have come up negative. Does anyone know of said bug or have had their own experiences with it. Has anyone used shroud on this encounter successfully?

Is it my fault or could it be the tanks positioning?

If it is indeed my fault then I'd happy hold up my hands but being a proud kinda guy, I guess I need some backing considering the crap Ive had to put up with since this incident.

Any and all help is much welcome and appreciated <3

Tnx

As a Rogue, that would be my main thought as well.

[Sanguinezor]

You do not need to use Shroud to position yourself in the center.
Boss patrols around and you can literally /walk to the middle of the room without pulling agro.

Other than that. I have used Shroud before and it has never caused any issues.
First hit from cleave on tank broke my shroud or i broke it from attacking boss. (Sheer seconds so hard to determine)

Will need to be tested

[Kael]

To the best of my knowledge, there's no shroud bug on Qiang. If your tank/leader is giving you grief, take a different approach; have the tank stand dead center in the group, you tricks, and throw a dagger at him*. Boss walks in, he doesn't melee anyway so even if ranged pull it makes no difference. Have a hunter MD, a ranged DPS pull during the countdown, whatever leaves the tank stacked ON the rest of the raid. If he's running OUT to pull or skimming sideways without warning on Flanking, he's committing suicide. Stacking on the opening and communication for movement are the only keys to surviving the first king.

*If you tricks/melee he may choose to swat you before walking at the group

As Sang pointed out, you can avoid shroud by walking into the room when Qiang is on the other side, as well, thereby avoiding the entire issue.

That said, I'm pretty sure SoC doesn't prevent any damage to anyone, ever. It's possible I'm wrong, but seeing as one of the primary stealth complaints (besides bugs! - and I count pets as a bug) in PvP is the instantaneous Destro AoE covering the entire room and knocking you out of stealth without warning or speculative AoE locations. Unless SoC is using stealth AND CoS, which it shouldn't, they should not be immune to any damage.

[Deleted]

Our approach:
- Stack up the raid inside the encounter-zone while the boss is away
- Have the tank taunt the boss from a distance
- Boss runs over to the already stacked raid
- ????
- Profit

By already being stacked up pre-pull and just having the tank taunt the boss into position, you guarantee a safe pull. Having 10 people running into the middle of the room is extremely awkward and somewhat stupid, I'd have to say. Strangely backwards way of doing things. Hell, how do you imagine rogue-less guilds pull off the fight? Stealth is completely unnecessary for every single fight in this tier of raids(and any other tier I can think of...).

Shroud has its niche in Challenge Modes. Leave it at that. It's only SLIGHTLY worth using in raids if you, for some bizarre reason, attempt to go for a speed-run of a raid and need to bypass unnecessary trash mobs. Apart from that, remove it from your action bars.

[celinamuna]

Use shroud to position entire group in center before pull, but never creates any problems. Plus if the group isn't pre-potting / hitting the boss before he devastates, they should rethink that.

[Deleted]

Hullo! Thankyou all for your input.

We did learn we could move to the centre of the room without pulling him after the first couple of fail pulls, so we no longer have any problems. Thanks tho for the tips. With regards to this being either a bug or a positioning fail, its becoming more and more clear that its the latter.

If anyone tho can replicate the problems Ive faced please update this thread. I will keep an eye on it for at least a couple of weeks.

Thanks again all and peace out <3