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  1. #1201
    Quote Originally Posted by Whicker View Post
    are you sure?
    Mastery is reflected in the tooltip.

    Take the Holy value of 233,9% SP * 1,2 = 280.7. The previous value. Now take 233,9 * 1,128 = 263.8%.

  2. #1202
    High Overlord Whicker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaesebrezen View Post
    Mastery is reflected in the tooltip.

    Take the Holy value of 233,9% SP * 1,2 = 280.7. The previous value. Now take 233,9 * 1,128 = 263.8%.
    you're right, thank you for explaining.

  3. #1203
    The Patient Arainie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saphiramoon View Post
    It's balanced out by the change to mastery, which will now affect noncrit heals, that wouldnt have procced aegis anyway, and the possibility of PWS to crit (though PWS itself is nerfed by not being affected by 100% mastery anymore).

    All in all, its taking some from RNG absorbs and making it reliable actual healing, which is nice, but the overall result is very close to what it was before.
    Live:
    Greater Heal Base 75k Crit 150k (for simplicity), 40% mastery (for simplicity)
    (75k * 2.00CritCoeff) Healing + (150k * 0.5 DivineAegis * 1.4Mastery) Absorption = 150k Healing + 105k Absorption = 255k Effective Healing

    PTR:
    Greater Heal Base 75k. I can't be bothered to install PTR and check the numbers but let's say 32% absoription from mastery and 15% healing increase from mastery, correct me if I'm totally off here?
    (75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) Healing + ((75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) * 1.32Mastery) = 86.25 Healing + 113.85 Absorption =~ 200k Effective Healing

    All in all it's going to be a nerf, and quite a large one. It's going to be smaller than the numbers indicate due to the fact that absorption is almost always put to better use than overheals are, but it's still going to sting on top of every other nerf they're throwing at us! :P

  4. #1204
    Quote Originally Posted by Arainie View Post
    Live:
    Greater Heal Base 75k Crit 150k (for simplicity), 40% mastery (for simplicity)
    (75k * 2.00CritCoeff) Healing + (150k * 0.5 DivineAegis * 1.4Mastery) Absorption = 150k Healing + 105k Absorption = 255k Effective Healing

    PTR:
    Greater Heal Base 75k. I can't be bothered to install PTR and check the numbers but let's say 32% absoription from mastery and 15% healing increase from mastery, correct me if I'm totally off here?
    (75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) Healing + ((75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) * 1.32Mastery) = 86.25 Healing + 113.85 Absorption =~ 200k Effective Healing

    All in all it's going to be a nerf, and quite a large one. It's going to be smaller than the numbers indicate due to the fact that absorption is almost always put to better use than overheals are, but it's still going to sting on top of every other nerf they're throwing at us! :P

    Durp NVM :P shoulda read math better

    ---------- Post added 2013-02-19 at 11:26 PM ----------

    I think everyone agrees disc is getting nerfed, thats not the question. How badly they are getting nerfed is though.


    If your average gheal effective healing was 255k, and come 5.2 its 200k.


    That isn't too severe, it just means disc won't be 500x farther ahead on meters as the rest of the healers in the group. They will still be viable, just not OP like on live.

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  5. #1205
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaidye View Post
    Reading all the datamining again, I really don't understand where Blizzard is going with this (again assuming that datamining = fact, which can sometimes cause problems).

    They state they want us to use more PW:S, then nerf both its SP scaling and base absorb as well as nerfing the absorption scaling of mastery itself. Are we getting another mana cost decrease in the future in compensation for the loss in efficiency to a spell they want us to use more?

    I like that PW:S can finally crit, which is long overdue and gives us another stat that affects our spec-defining spell, but it will affect Rapture, especially for people running low damage heroics and whatnot.

    I like that they are buffing our healing done to offset our mastery nerf, but isn't that counter productive when they are turning the crit part of every crit into an absorb? I'm not sure about the numbers (correct me if I'm wrong, obviously), but it looks like we got a 6% nerf to our absorbs and a 6.4% buff to our heals via mastery. That would be all good and dandy if we were allowed to keep our crit heals, and our bonus absorb at the end from DA instead of completely losing our crit heals to absorbs.

    I'm also going to come out and say that, as a healer, it is very satisfying to pop Inner Focus and Greater Heal on a tank that is going down fast, and seeing his health pop up again with a nice little DA buffer. I would be very sad to lose that.
    Fact: The ability for PW:S to crit more than makes up for the 6% base reduction, so there's your PW:S buff.

    Also, if you're running a 'low damage heroic' and the damage is so low that it won't pop a single crit-bubble, then you don;t really have to worry about mana, do you?

  6. #1206
    Quote Originally Posted by KidCanuck View Post
    Fact: The ability for PW:S to crit more than makes up for the 6% base reduction, so there's your PW:S buff.

    Also, if you're running a 'low damage heroic' and the damage is so low that it won't pop a single crit-bubble, then you don;t really have to worry about mana, do you?
    I'm quite certain that every disc would've prefered to see the shield itself being increased based on your crit chance (similar to SS atm).

    So how would you consistently proc rapture on, say wote hc, if your PW:S suddenly became twice it's normal size? This also happens to be a quite mana consuming fight as disc, at least during progression. If there's a fight where you can place a PW:S on a tank every time weakened soul falls off, no PW:S critting isn't a huge issue (well, if you have a monk tank it's still an issue though), but on fights where this isn't possible (wote hc, garalon, amber-shaper, etc) it definitely is.

  7. #1207
    You would put it on the tank. Also, on will.. A 200k shield isn't hard to pop >.>

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  8. #1208
    - Shadowform increases damage by 25%, up from 20%.


    I just jumped off my chair and did a movie style fist pump
    Redsparowe#2548 <Crayola Inc>, Lightbringer EU

  9. #1209
    Quote Originally Posted by Redsparowe View Post
    - Shadowform increases damage by 25%, up from 20%.


    I just jumped off my chair and did a movie style fist pump
    http://i.imgur.com/ftM3eaP.gif

    Stream: twitch.tv/DryeLuLZ
    Twitter: @Dryelulz

  10. #1210
    Quote Originally Posted by Drye View Post
    yeah i accidentally choked on my tea. was kinda like this

  11. #1211
    Quote Originally Posted by HolyLathusDisc View Post
    You would put it on the tank. Also, on will.. A 200k shield isn't hard to pop >.>
    That's why I got more rapture procs on a 9:30 wote than you did on a 12:20? Popping a 200k shield consistently is very difficult on Will. If you are fine popping one every 30 seconds (like you), sure you can just put it on the tanks/spark soakers, but if you want to get a rapture every 12-15 seconds you time it on a raid member so it goes off from titan gas (like me) that'd be impossible if it could crit. Yes, for players who compensate for poor play by using too much spirit this won't be an issue.
    Last edited by Cookie; 2013-02-20 at 12:57 AM.

  12. #1212
    Quote Originally Posted by Arainie View Post
    Live:
    Greater Heal Base 75k Crit 150k (for simplicity), 40% mastery (for simplicity)
    (75k * 2.00CritCoeff) Healing + (150k * 0.5 DivineAegis * 1.4Mastery) Absorption = 150k Healing + 105k Absorption = 255k Effective Healing

    PTR:
    Greater Heal Base 75k. I can't be bothered to install PTR and check the numbers but let's say 32% absoription from mastery and 15% healing increase from mastery, correct me if I'm totally off here?
    (75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) Healing + ((75k * 1.15HealingIncrease) * 1.32Mastery) = 86.25 Healing + 113.85 Absorption =~ 200k Effective Healing

    All in all it's going to be a nerf, and quite a large one. It's going to be smaller than the numbers indicate due to the fact that absorption is almost always put to better use than overheals are, but it's still going to sting on top of every other nerf they're throwing at us! :P
    The balancing I was referring to was compared to the previous PTR build, that it's a massive nerf to the live situation I dont think anybody doubts it anymore .
    The actual numbers are 18.16% going to the heal portion and 36.33% going to absorbs if I read the blue post correctly, so fairly close to your values.

    If your average gheal effective healing was 255k, and come 5.2 its 200k.


    That isn't too severe, it just means disc won't be 500x farther ahead on meters as the rest of the healers in the group. They will still be viable, just not OP like on live.
    That's not the average gheal, that is a critical gheal, the only time we actually benefit from full mastery.
    The non-crit gheal will be 75k*1.18=@89k

    Considering a 15% crit, the average gheal is @105k, including aegis. Considering gheal is a 2.5 seconds cast with no haste, that's 42k hps for gheal spam. Hardly impressive.

  13. #1213
    Cookie, it's a shame that your first response to people is to be rude, disrespectful and childish.

    I was not mana starved on will whatsoever as disc, I was popping raptures as needed perfectly fine and didnt have much of an issue getting them to pop either. If you know where the damage is going to be next. Knowing when to best utilize rapture without spamming bubbles praying one pops isn't an issue.

    If you just randomly put bubbles on people praying to get a proc on will. Yes you will be mana starved.

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  14. #1214
    Quote Originally Posted by HolyLathusDisc View Post
    Cookie, it's a shame that your first response to people is to be rude, disrespectful and childish.

    I was not mana starved on will whatsoever as disc, I was popping raptures as needed perfectly fine and didnt have much of an issue getting them to pop either. If you know where the damage is going to be next. Knowing when to best utilize rapture without spamming bubbles praying one pops isn't an issue.

    If you just randomly put bubbles on people praying to get a proc on will. Yes you will be mana starved.
    A bit like you I guess?:P No, I bet you weren't mana starved on WotE when you use 11,5k spirit, I use just above 9k. The funniest part about your response is that you used almost exactly as many PW:S as me, the only difference is that close to every single one of mine procced rapture (except if I used it on a soaker/tank with rapture on cd) while just below half of yours didn't (which considering how sparsely you used it is strange in itself, should've been more if you just pressed it randomly). If you want to use additional spirit and get a rapture proc every 30 seconds that's your choice (even if it's bad), but if you are using so much spirit that rapture proccing is irrelevant you shouldn't talk about how easy it'd be to get a critting PW:S to proc. You can not proc rapture just as it comes off cd on WotE if you just use it on the tanks.

    Regarding the changes, shadowform to 25% is great, sps won't be crushing the meters anytime soon but these changes are honestly enough for me to be somewhat okay with our state. We should be simming slightly below the average, but we'll benefit more from the crit trinket than most other specs (admittedly not as much as the other dotters) and we have more options regarding talents. Nerfing atonement is something I would like to see done, I was hoping it'd be accompanied by buffs to our other spells though, but quite frankly I don't mind too much as long as it gets done (completely mindless, and makes us op on any fight with damage buffs, regardless of how bad/good we are in other areas).

    Blue post: http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...sues-part-iii/
    Last edited by Cookie; 2013-02-20 at 01:43 AM.

  15. #1215
    Quote Originally Posted by Cookie View Post
    A bit like you I guess?:P No, I bet you weren't mana starved on WotE when you use 11,5k spirit, I use just above 9k. The funniest part about your response is that you used almost exactly as many PW:S as me, the only difference is that close to every single one of mine procced rapture (except if I used it on a soaker/tank with rapture on cd) while just below half of yours didn't (which considering how sparsely you used it is strange in itself, should've been more if you just pressed it randomly). If you want to use additional spirit and get a rapture proc every 30 seconds that's your choice (even if it's bad), but if you are using so much spirit that rapture proccing is irrelevant you shouldn't talk about how easy it'd be to get a critting PW:S to proc. You can not proc rapture just as it comes off cd on WotE if you use it on the tanks.

    Regarding the changes, shadowform to 25% is great, sps won't be crushing the meters anytime soon but these changes are honestly enough for me to be somewhat okay with our state. We should be simming slightly below the average, but we'll benefit more from the crit trinket than most other specs (admittedly not as much as the other dotters) and we have more options regarding talents. Nerfing atonement is something I would like to see done, I was hoping it'd be accompanied by buffs to our other spells though, but quite frankly I don't mind too much (completely mindless, and makes us op on any fight with damage buffs, regardless of how bad/good we are in other areas).

    Blue post: http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...sues-part-iii/
    I have not said a single thing to you in this post degrading your play style, yet anytime you reply to people on these forums you constantly flame and bash people telling them how they are terrible and you are such a pro player. Really gets old listening to childish tactics any time you post.


    1) If I choose to use spirit as my geming, because I switch between holy and disc every other fight, then thats my choice and not yours to come on these forums trolling me with your "Im better then u and ur bad" It's my playstyle, it's gotten me this far and I want you to stop trolling people on these forums non stop with your constant "I am better then u and ur bad" posts. Its extremley childish and makes you look rediculous.

    2) If I killed the boss as disc, with mana to spare and didn't have issues getting rapture when I needed it. Then who cares, this is just another one of your "im better then you" troll posts.


    3) Your argument, "how can you pop 200k shields on WOTE HC" Well, that isn't going to matter come 5.2 because WOTE will be null and void and hard to compare the new changes on a fight you will never get to test it on.

    4) Again, it's about timing your raptures on a fight like WOTE. A bit more on topic, in 5.2 should there be a fight similar to WoTE you will probably see the priests rolling holy anyway. The only reason I personally went disc for HC WoTE was because our raid composition sucked[no hunter/rogue] and we had to pug the last slot because our bad hunter gquit after a night of attempts because he couldn't figure out how to manage the sparks by himself... he didn't even know how to play survival which made it even worse. So I chose disc to help pad the soakers since we didn't have much of a reliable source of soaking.

    5) We ended up pugging a friends alt tank, our monk tank in the kill. He was quite exceptional I might add, we switched our guardian druid to his alt rogue who was only 480 Ilvl for just soaks, granted his DPS was terrible. It explains our "slower then yours" WoTE HC kill. So I was primarily using a lot of shields on soakers just to make sure nothing went astray, and was SSing the tanks because the monk tank we brought in was a little undergeared.


    Generally, should there be a WoTE HC fight, as I said before. People will probably be holy. Granted blizz doesn't make it a rediculous fight based on raid composition.....

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  16. #1216
    I didn't even notice that in addition to the divine aegis nerf they also snuck in a PW:S nerf. Lol It really has become hilarious how hard we're getting hit lol

  17. #1217
    The nerf was only to offset that PW:S can crit now, the crits make up for the 6% nerf.

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  18. #1218
    Still, you're insane you think disc didn't need to be nerfed, but you're even more so if you think this many nerfs is what the class needed. The same thing happened during the MoP beta.

  19. #1219
    o.o I do think disc needed to be nerfed, and I think every one of these nerfs are justified.

    The only one that strikes me as odd is the new DA nerf, but we will see how it plays out.



    Trust me, I am voting for holy priests to rise all the way :P Down with disc.

    5.2 Disc Priest Guide | Retired(Playing Aion)

  20. #1220
    Quote Originally Posted by vanityking View Post
    I didn't even notice that in addition to the divine aegis nerf they also snuck in a PW:S nerf. Lol It really has become hilarious how hard we're getting hit lol
    The nerf was only to offset that PW:S can crit now, the crits make up for the 6% nerf.
    Hard to read what i wrote above?

    PW:S was not nerfed by 6%. Mastery is shown in the tooltip. Mastery was changed (reduced for absorbs), this is the 6% reduction you see in the PW:S tooltip.

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