5.2 Shaman changes

[sarasun]

Something like "Your Fire nova now applies a debuff that makes your chain lightning hit x% harder" could be nice. They have to find a way to fit FN in there.

[Protoman]

Something like "Your Fire nova now applies a debuff that makes your chain lightning hit x% harder" could be nice. They have to find a way to fit FN in there.

Not sure but I think they might have made FN an Enhance only spell, so EQ might be a better choice for a CL buff. Personally I think they should have kept FN for Ele but esp Resto to have a quick and simple instant AoE attack for solo and group play.


Regarding the new changes.....I wish they utilized the ability to tweak spells and talents based on spec so a talent worked differently for Enh vs Resto vs Elem.......trying to make one talent/spell work for 3 totally different playstyles doesn't always work out well and balance would be alot easier to achieve so the whole class doesn't suffer if they try to nerf something for Resto. I would love to see Enhance have a longer lockout on our Wind Shear, up to 4 sec so its comparable to the lockout of rogues and monks. Making Elem Blast behave different for Resto vs Ele/Enh is an example of tweaking a spell/talent based on spec.....EB is just lame for a healer and does not have the same feel of using it at all compared to as a dps spec.

I still hate the totem nerfs, totally uncalled for IMO and took away one of the few remaining benefits of using a totem. Totems design and balance seems to be clunky and poorly done to me, they have made some major changes to totems and the buffs/nerfs and other tweaks come in chunks when they should have just taken the time to do it all at once, properly.......with these recent nerfs its about time that totems get more HP since they have longer CD's plus can be silenced/locked out.

Glyph changes look good, I like the duration increase on FLS, but I wish they would just merge the GW glyph with GW and give us a standard mobility tool since GW is pretty useless in PVP without the glyph.

[Socialhealer]

but I wish they would just merge the GW glyph with GW and give us a standard mobility tool since GW is pretty useless in PVP without the glyph.

yeh until thats done i dont really consider blizzard to know shit about pvp, ghost wolf is like blink for a mage, its just mandatory without it u'll never escape any situation.

[demoncleaner]

Buffs to either dps specs aoe would make them overpowered. Ele has great aoe. Enh does as well, it's just delivered via a clunky system. They just need to rework fire nova into a conal or 360 whirl type attack. Remove magma and chain lightning and just adjust the numbers to make it roughly equal to our current toolset. Aoe doesn't need to e complicated.

[shell]

Part of me is still holding out hope that they'll bring back the Repulsion Totem from early beta. And since I'm biased towards elemental, make it elemental only . Shamanistic Rage is a welcome addition but I don't know if it will help keep us from being trained. I don't really know how the totem worked since it never made it but repelling enemies sounds good, in theory. On the other hand, part of me doesn't want anymore new abilities jamming up my keybindings either.

[Glyphtics]

Buffs to either dps specs aoe would make them overpowered. Ele has great aoe. Enh does as well, it's just delivered via a clunky system. They just need to rework fire nova into a conal or 360 whirl type attack. Remove magma and chain lightning and just adjust the numbers to make it roughly equal to our current toolset. Aoe doesn't need to e complicated.

Elemental and Enhance AoE is only good after a certain threshold. For instance, on Sha of Fear Heroic, every other class does significantly better AoE damage until there are 5 or 6 adds out, and even then, Elemental and Enhance are already behind on overall add damage, and are unable to catch up. I personally think they need to rework how Flame Shock is applied, because having to stagger a 10 second cooldown, just to do any AoE at all, is bull shit to be honest. No other class is hindered to such a degree (Clunky system), and even then, their AoE ability just isn't as strong compared to pretty much every other class. :\

I'd like to see an attack similar to a Warrior's whirlwind, with maybe a 2 second CD, so we're not fucked around by having to sit on Lava Lash, and that can effected by Unleash Elements. AoE in T14 was all about quick 'snap' AoE, on targets that die within a few globals. Specs like Enhance just get left in the dust because of significant ramp up time, compared to other classes / specs.

[rogas]

Having elemental blast/unleashed fury be able to reset AND spread flame shock on all surrounding targets in a 8 yard radius would solve ALL elemental problems!

[sarasun]

Elemental and Enhance AoE is only good after a certain threshold. For instance, on Sha of Fear Heroic, every other class does significantly better AoE damage until there are 5 or 6 adds out, and even then, Elemental and Enhance are already behind on overall add damage, and are unable to catch up. I personally think they need to rework how Flame Shock is applied, because having to stagger a 10 second cooldown, just to do any AoE at all, is bull shit to be honest. No other class is hindered to such a degree (Clunky system), and even then, their AoE ability just isn't as strong compared to pretty much every other class. :\

I'd like to see an attack similar to a Warrior's whirlwind, with maybe a 2 second CD, so we're not fucked around by having to sit on Lava Lash, and that can effected by Unleash Elements. AoE in T14 was all about quick 'snap' AoE, on targets that die within a few globals. Specs like Enhance just get left in the dust because of significant ramp up time, compared to other classes / specs.

While I agree the ramp up time for enhance is way too high, I have to say that, once ramped up, the damage is fine. We just have to get there faster, and without having to delay our hardest hitting ability.

[Deleted]

Nice changes but , having a hard time to decide wich spec to play , Enha or Ele :P

[Forsedar]

Having elemental blast/unleashed fury be able to reset AND spread flame shock on all surrounding targets in a 8 yard radius would solve ALL elemental problems!

I feel that would not solve a single thing. The best idea that I have read thus far is:

Increase the cast time on Lava Burst and Chain Lightning, but increase its damage done (so haste becomes stronger). Also, Shamanism bandaid fix (again).

[Frostinferno]

I would like to see more synergy with Ele's aoe. Buff Earthquake's damage through Lightning Shield stacks and then allow it to consume Lightning Shield charges to become instant cast. Likewise it would be cool if, during Ascendance, Earthquake would also change into something stronger too, like say an erupting volcano. This would make popping Ascendance for aoe a much more viable option as opposed to almost always saving it for single target.

[Deleted]

While I agree the ramp up time for enhance is way too high, I have to say that, once ramped up, the damage is fine. We just have to get there faster, and without having to delay our hardest hitting ability.

But it's not only the ramp up time. For our AOE to work, we need 20 or 30 seconds aoe time because our aoe is hitting like a wet noodle per attack.

Take a feral, he does the same amount of damage in 5 seconds as we do in 20 seconds. After that, he's energy starved, so we get to catch up a little.

But most tiers up until now had a lot of fights with short AOE bursts (DW heroic, ice tombs on 4th boss DS).

FN should be on a 10sec cd but a lot harder hitting and with only making explode the current target. Say "The flame shock on your current target 'explodes', dealing 800% of FS damage to all nearby targets". They could still leave some of the AOE damage in the multidot part, but move a big part into a more bursty ability. That way, we wouldonly need a FS to get our AOE damage and we have some more burst on adds that die within 5 sec.

[rogas]

I feel that would not solve a single thing. The best idea that I have read thus far is:

Increase the cast time on Lava Burst and Chain Lightning, but increase its damage done (so haste becomes stronger). Also, Shamanism bandaid fix (again).

ofc ... let's go back to the boring stationairy-caster-days ;-/

You're clearly concerned about high damage/dps output. I'm talking about gameplay. I really fail to see how a longer CL/LB casttime would improve our gameplay.

[demoncleaner]

Elemental and Enhance AoE is only good after a certain threshold. For instance, on Sha of Fear Heroic, every other class does significantly better AoE damage until there are 5 or 6 adds out, and even then, Elemental and Enhance are already behind on overall add damage, and are unable to catch up. I personally think they need to rework how Flame Shock is applied, because having to stagger a 10 second cooldown, just to do any AoE at all, is bull shit to be honest. No other class is hindered to such a degree (Clunky system), and even then, their AoE ability just isn't as strong compared to pretty much every other class. :\

I'd like to see an attack similar to a Warrior's whirlwind, with maybe a 2 second CD, so we're not fucked around by having to sit on Lava Lash, and that can effected by Unleash Elements. AoE in T14 was all about quick 'snap' AoE, on targets that die within a few globals. Specs like Enhance just get left in the dust because of significant ramp up time, compared to other classes / specs.

Ele's aoe is fine. One of the better aoe specs in the game. Enh aoe can put out stupid numbers in certain situations. But it's borderline useless in quite a few scenarios. And that's where the problem is. We are mechanically limited.

[Kralljin]

Ele's aoe is fine. One of the better aoe specs in the game. Enh aoe can put out stupid numbers in certain situations. But it's borderline useless in quite a few scenarios. And that's where the problem is. We are mechanically limited.

Ele is dependant on the situation.

More than 10 mobs => Ele AoE blow, EQ / Magma totem don't do much damage and Cl is still hitting 5 target

Long AoE Phase => Ele AoE is pretty mediocore because Balance / Sp will start multidotting

Short AoE with few Mobs => Ele is pretty good


Short AoE sessions favor Elemental, on the long run however Specs with a "DoT based" AoE will catch up.

Personally i would like to see that LS charges reduce the casttime of EQ or that Magma totem puts a debuff on the target(s) so that they take more dmg from EQ, not much just a small push for the EQ / Magma totem.

[demoncleaner]

Ele is dependant on the situation.

More than 10 mobs => Ele AoE blow, EQ / Magma totem don't do much damage and Cl is still hitting 5 target

Long AoE Phase => Ele AoE is pretty mediocore because Balance / Sp will start multidotting

Short AoE with few Mobs => Ele is pretty good


Short AoE sessions favor Elemental, on the long run however Specs with a "DoT based" AoE will catch up.

Personally i would like to see that LS charges reduce the casttime of EQ or that Magma totem puts a debuff on the target(s) so that they take more dmg from EQ, not much just a small push for the EQ / Magma totem.

Ele is actually really good at more than 10 mobs. While CL only hits 5 mobs...it hits the mobs really hard and isn't effected by the aoe cap. Honestly the only people I see beating ele in that situation are classes that can bypass the cap.

I assume by long aoe phase that you mean something like the stone guard or will. And yes ele falls behind on those. But that's because they can't multi dot, not because ele has bad aoe.

[Kralljin]

I assume by long aoe phase that you mean something like the stone guard or will. And yes ele falls behind on those. But that's because they can't multi dot, not because ele has bad aoe.

Stone Guard isn't AoE, it's cleave and WotE is Multi dot.

Windlord Mel'jarak may be the best example, there are many Adds that live long enough, i'm slightly below avg. in terms of Add Dps on Wind Lord heroic, Recklessness phases however allow me to pull ahead, mostly.

[Deleted]

Stone Guard isn't AoE, it's cleave and WotE is Multi dot.

Windlord Mel'jarak may be the best example, there are many Adds that live long enough, i'm slightly below avg. in terms of Add Dps on Wind Lord heroic, Recklessness phases however allow me to pull ahead, mostly.

Windlord heroic is perma AOE with short burst phases. But in the end, you average at 4-7 mobs. Pretty optimal for Elemental - still they are mediocre at best. They are not top at that level though the fight mechanics are optimal for Elemental.

[demoncleaner]

You see middle of the pack(raidbots 10h all parses) and say mediocre, I see middle of the pack and think well balanced. Also that's the only fight that I know of that would come close to qualifying to long term aoe. Ele needs a boost(its getting a couple) no one will argue that. But aoe is not a place that spec needs help in.

[Kralljin]

You see middle of the pack(raidbots 10h all parses) and say mediocre, I see middle of the pack and think well balanced. Also that's the only fight that I know of that would come close to qualifying to long term aoe. Ele needs a boost(its getting a couple) no one will argue that. But aoe is not a place that spec needs help in.

Exclude Boss Dps, majority of the dmg done during Windlord Fight is Boss Dps.

Only Logs that exclude Windlord itself are valid for AoE Dps Discussion, which i think is not case for Raidbots.