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  1. #1

    Blade Flurry should not be nerfed that much.

    Since I'm overall super excited about this patch, I want to point this out as an aside:

    We will essentially not have a cleave with this nerf. I assume this nerf will be reduced before live. I actually doubt it will even be worth pressing the button in this case.

    If Blade Flurry is considered such an issue, why did it just come up now, with no warning, and with such a huge nerf? We only have one spec able to flurry as it is, and now you won't want to bring a rogue for a fight that requires it, instead of us being the best choice. World first guilds already ignore us on several fights as it is, taking away the one thing we are best at (and making us go from #1 to not even on the chart) is shocking.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-22 at 05:23 AM ----------

    1)- Is it possible they meant "25% less damage"? As in, striking for 75%? That would take us from clearly ahead of arms warriors to a bit ahead of them, and I don't see any nerfs to cleave. It seems shocking to take us from #1 to not on the list unless they were attempting to reduce other adjacent melee attackers, and they are not.

    2)- "Begging for SimCraft" should likely be a bannable offense. Since it isn't- can someone who can configure SimCraft actually check, with the live version, whether this will be worthwhile at all? I mean, to press the button in the case of two targets at 100% uptime. I know how to run a sim... but I don't know how to say "run a sim with 20% less energy regeneration". If you can make that mod and run that sim, then you'll just be able to take the melee, sinister, revealing, mastery, and eviscerate attacks, divide by 4, and add to the existing to predict if it's even worth cleaving in a full uptime scenario. Given that in an actual raid you spend some time not actually getting your flurry strikes to hit (for instance, boss adjusts to tank, or enemy runs through), and because we don't have buttons that we can time like hybrid melee, I imagine we'd need a bit of leeway- but if the nerf goes live like this, will it even be worth pressing versus two target dummies?

  2. #2
    What if they end up making Blade Flurry an AoE instead of a cleave?

  3. #3
    I guess we need to wait for complete patch notes

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    What if they end up making Blade Flurry an AoE instead of a cleave?
    That would make us very good at aoe damage then. But we already have two aoe moves, so I don't see this happening. We simply shouldn't eat this magnitude of a nerf to our ONLY flurry effect.

    I guess we need to wait for complete patch notes
    Nah, I'm good to bitch about it now.

  5. #5
    stay calm. this will never go live its as much ridiculous as the 3 sec cd on pyro was( ok its way more)

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ripslyme View Post
    stay calm. this will never go live its as much ridiculous as the 3 sec cd on pyro was( ok its way more)
    That's what people told me during the beta, in regards to the talent trees, as well...

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Incineration View Post
    That's what people told me during the beta, in regards to the talent trees, as well...
    100% agreed. I will never listen to "it's only beta" again. Seven times bitten, Eighth shy..

  8. #8
    blade flurry needs to apply to fan of knives
    Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. -Bertrand Russell
    There is not a flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people. -Howard Zinn
    The stars may be far away, but people still reach for them. -My Grandfather

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    Since I'm overall super excited about this patch, I want to point this out as an aside:


    1)- Is it possible they meant "25% less damage"? As in, striking for 75%? That would take us from clearly ahead of arms warriors to a bit ahead of them, and I don't see any nerfs to cleave. It seems shocking to take us from #1 to not on the list unless they were attempting to reduce other adjacent melee attackers, and they are not.
    From the "Spell Changes" section farther down the page:

    "Combat
    Blade Flurry now cleaves for 25% of normal damage, down from 100%."

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by ripslyme View Post
    stay calm. this will never go live its as much ridiculous as the 3 sec cd on pyro was( ok its way more)
    Why won't it go live? Rogues don't need blade flurry to raid, it's a niche advantage that messes with balancing on encounters with high cleave uptime so it's being toned down to the point where having multiple rogues doesn't have a signifigant impact on enrage timers or encounter success.

    Windwalker monks are getting a new "cleave" ability in 5.2, it's toggle-able like blade flurry and gives the monk 20% 'more' damage over the targets it hits, seems about right with the blade flurry nerf.

  11. #11
    Brewmaster
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    Why people who dont know/play combat rogues post in this section ?

    Blade flurry has always been the combat rogue's special way of play.

    Take that away and its like taking away wings to paladins.

  12. #12
    I welcome this nerf. Blade Flurry has always been way too OP for cleave fights. This probably puts it even with Assassination for cleave fights, which is how it should be. I don't really enjoy feeling obligated to play Combat on every fight with two targets just because of a cleave that makes up 40% of DPS.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Valsh View Post
    Windwalker monks are getting a new "cleave" ability in 5.2, it's toggle-able like blade flurry and gives the monk 20% 'more' damage over the targets it hits, seems about right with the blade flurry nerf.
    Well, no, because it sounds like monks are gaining an ability whilst rogues are losing one.

    Much more relevantly ARMS WARRIORS

    The thing is this- when you blade flurry, you lose energy regen. That means you progress slower through your cycles, and of COURSE it means you have less specials and less finishers. The payoff is that some of your damage- the physical part of your specials transfers to the second target. Of course, this isn't ALL your damage- deadly poison and deadly poison (dot) don't apply.

    If you have to kill targets A and B, my position is that, with a 25% blade flurry, you are better off not actually pressing it. Not having it on your bar. Remember that blade flurry also takes some effort- it's a narrow cone, so unless targets A and B are sitting 100% still the whole time, you are losing a decent amount of flurry hits. That's of course fine on live- blade flurry is very rewarding. But I think this change would make it "not a move".

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-22 at 09:00 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by whathump View Post
    I welcome this nerf. Blade Flurry has always been way too OP for cleave fights. This probably puts it even with Assassination for cleave fights, which is how it should be. I don't really enjoy feeling obligated to play Combat on every fight with two targets just because of a cleave that makes up 40% of DPS.
    Yea, it's much better to be forced to play assassination so you can at least dual rupture, being as blade flurry will probably be a damage loss- or about breakeven at best.

    I'm sorry you don't like switching specs to help your guild. Most of us enjoy helping our guilds!

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Verain View Post
    Yea, it's much better to be forced to play assassination so you can at least dual rupture, being as blade flurry will probably be a damage loss- or about breakeven at best.

    I'm sorry you don't like switching specs to help your guild. Most of us enjoy helping our guilds!
    I enjoy helping my guild, I just don't enjoy spamming Sinister Strike and Eviscerate with a random Revealing Strike and Slice and Dice every so often. Maybe if Combat was a more fun spec with less button spamming, I'd actually enjoy it.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by whathump View Post
    I enjoy helping my guild, I just don't enjoy spamming Sinister Strike and Eviscerate with a random Revealing Strike and Slice and Dice every so often. Maybe if Combat was a more fun spec with less button spamming, I'd actually enjoy it.
    which spec in this whole game are you referring to when you say "less button spamming"?

    assassination is spamming muti and envenom, with the random rupture thrown in - there's not even a revealing strike to mix things up.
    Last edited by Ssith; 2012-12-22 at 09:27 AM.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Ssith View Post
    which spec in this whole game are you referring to when you say "less button spamming"?

    assassination is spamming muti and envenom, with the random rupture thrown in - there's not even a revealing strike to mix things up.
    Assassination is all about timing, not spamming. Storing energy before envenom, not mashing dispatch the instant it procs if you don't need to mutilate again before envenom, even actually using anticipation so you can use more mutilates during envenom without having to cap energy or clip envenom. It makes no difference how you time your abilities as combat except waiting maybe two seconds before revealing strike if you're low on energy. Assassination at least requires somewhat of a brain to play properly.

  17. #17
    Herald of the Titans T Man's Avatar
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    They have given us rogues about 3-4 new shit to try out, they have to take something from us in return.
    IF by some stupid reason this makes it live, why would anyone play combat.

  18. #18
    I always thought blade flurry and the combination of it with combats cooldowns is the only reason why combat is fun to play because you pull huge dps... see stoneguard and garalon.

    I like assassination better anyway so meh. lets see if the new talents make up for this
    ~

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by whathump View Post
    I welcome this nerf. Blade Flurry has always been way too OP for cleave fights. This probably puts it even with Assassination for cleave fights, which is how it should be. I don't really enjoy feeling obligated to play Combat on every fight with two targets just because of a cleave that makes up 40% of DPS.
    this.

    I will have a good reason to be subtley for cleave fights (if I desired) without knowing I could do way more damage as combat.

  20. #20
    BF should be either removed or made so weak that Combat is NOT mandatory on every 2+ target fight.

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