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  1. #21
    The Insane smrund's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    It was not professionally cleaned
    Which required between tenancies. Your fault.


    (loose framing on closets doors
    Loose frames, as silly as they may sound, can be dangerous. It is YOUR responsibility to fix such an issue.

    splits in tile in kitchen
    Which represent a hazard that can generate all sorts of problems and is YOUR responsibility to fix.

    light bulb out in bathroom (laughable),
    Alright, he can get off his whiny ass and get a new bulb.

    two electric outlets not operational
    Faulty or inoperable electrical outlets can be indicative of damaged wiring, which presents a clear and present danger to the tenant. And if YOUR responsibility to fix.

    holes in bathroom cabinet under the sink) while these are deficiencies for sure they do not make the place dangerous or uninhabitable.
    Define "holes".

    Uninhabitable? No, but you shouldn't be keeping your place just above "uninhabitable", some of them certainly do present a danger.

    If these concerns were deal breakers than his liaison friend should have brought them up upon viewing the condo. The fact is that condo is in prime condition for a 20 something year old like him, he is in walking distance to a huge bar scene and a 5 minute drive from downtown the only reason we held this place from him was because his references were immaculate and he was a young professional, I will not be bullied by him just because his mommy is a lawyer.
    You should be bullied by him because it sounds like you're trying to avoid fixing anything. Being young does not make his demands any less reasonable. If he gives two shits about the bar scene, that's irrelevant, if you're catering to people who like the "bar scene", you get what you ask for.
    Quote Originally Posted by Masark View Post
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    Sometimes life gives you lemons, other times life gives you boobies. Life is always better with more boobies.
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    And thus I give you: MALE contraception!

  2. #22
    High Overlord Zazzmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laize View Post
    Depends on the changes.

    Re-painting and sealing are essential. I'm not sure where you are, but in NJ all upper-level apartments must have carpeting. Cosmetic improvements (assuming they ARE purely cosmetic) are not usually on that list, however.

    What changes are we talking about here?

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-22 at 08:48 PM ----------

    Again, I don't know where you live but based on what I'm reading here:



    The place is, indeed, not to renting standards.

    Inoperative electrical outlets are unacceptable
    Kitchen tile splits represent a hazard that can spread.
    Holes in a cabinet
    Loose framing

    These are things he, as the renter, is neither obligated nor permitted to fix. It's not his place so the money to pay his costs is not for him to spend.

    The light bulb is stupid though. He can do that.

    You do, in fact, owe it to him to fix those problems even though they are "merely" cosmetic.

    You do NOT have an obligation, however, to return his security deposit and first month's rent.
    Laize is correct. I'm not sure where you think that something such as electric outlet issues is a 'cosmetic' issue. Split kitchen tiles not only weaken the surrounding tiles, they will also allow water to seep down into the floor and eventually those tiles will pop out of place. Loose framing might be a cosmetic issue but it takes 2 minutes and a hammer to fix. Holes in cabinets allow for critters to get in at the very least.

    You're not cut out to be in the landlord business if you think these are cosmetic issues. Hire a professional leasing company or sell the condo if you don't want to deal with these types of problems.

  3. #23
    Warchief Clevername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doom Panda View Post
    or sell the condo if you don't want to deal with these types of problems.
    is most likely our course of action, my wife and I have full time jobs and I can't be bothered with this bullshit anymore. We are definitely not cutout to be landlords and I hate being the bad guy in this situation.

  4. #24
    High Overlord Zazzmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    is most likely our course of action, my wife and I have full time jobs and I can't be bothered with this bullshit anymore. We are definitely not cutout to be landlords and I hate being the bad guy in this situation.
    Fair enough. It's definitely not everyone's cup of tea.

  5. #25
    Scarab Lord Roose's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    is most likely our course of action, my wife and I have full time jobs and I can't be bothered with this bullshit anymore. We are definitely not cutout to be landlords and I hate being the bad guy in this situation.
    You can always talk to some local property managers. Common rate is 10%. Well worth it if they can keep it occupied and in decent shape. I would not sell anything in this market unless you really have to.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    Well after reviewing the rental agreement, I believe he doesn't have a leg to stand on and will post here verbatim, thanks for all the comments though.

    10. CONDITIONS OF PREMISES. Tenant acknowledges that he has inspected the premises and agrees that the premises and the common areas are in a safe, fit and habitable condition. The electrical, plumbing, heating and air-conditioning system, if any, and any appliance furnished with the premises are in good working order.
    EXCEPTIONS: NONE

    and that is signed by him.
    Depending on the state of the condo that clause might be null and void. You can't rent out a shit hole and expect people to pay you to live there. If it really is just reasonable wear and tear then you're in the right. If it's much beyond that you're getting into slumlord territory and there are laws to protect people from that, regardless of the lease. Regardless of whether or not something's in a contract if it's illegal a court won't uphold it.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    is most likely our course of action, my wife and I have full time jobs and I can't be bothered with this bullshit anymore. We are definitely not cutout to be landlords and I hate being the bad guy in this situation.
    There's a simple solution.

    You don't have to sell the place OR give up the equity and rental income.

    Simply hire a leasing or property management company (I'm not sure prop management will handle condos but it's worth a shot).

    The company I use takes 10% of the rent per unit. You can find companies that will charge as little as 7% or 8% but the one I use has proven to be reliable and honest.

    If you rent the place for $1200, they'll charge you $120/mo and take the responsibilities of being a landlord off your shoulders. They handle delinquent tenants, decide whether keeping the security deposit is a good idea (based on the outgoing tenant's treatment of the apartment) and handle the logistics of all repairs. They also handle the screening of new tenants so you don't have to worry about hiring someone with a drug problem by accident.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-22 at 11:25 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    Well after reviewing the rental agreement, I believe he doesn't have a leg to stand on and will post here verbatim, thanks for all the comments though.

    10. CONDITIONS OF PREMISES. Tenant acknowledges that he has inspected the premises and agrees that the premises and the common areas are in a safe, fit and habitable condition. The electrical, plumbing, heating and air-conditioning system, if any, and any appliance furnished with the premises are in good working order.
    EXCEPTIONS: NONE

    and that is signed by him.
    That clause seems very nonstandard and probably will not hold up in arbitration.

    It's unreasonable to expect a tenant to perform a qualified and complete inspection of the premises; especially electrical and plumbing.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Roose View Post
    You can always talk to some local property managers. Common rate is 10%. Well worth it if they can keep it occupied and in decent shape. I would not sell anything in this market unless you really have to.
    This. I rent from Carolina One down here. They handle pretty much everything for the owners. Finding renters, background checks, contracts, maintenance, exterminators, etc. I'm not sure what % or rate they charge but I bet the owners still pocket some money after mortgage and property management fees. Carolina One covers all maintenance up to a certain amount. I've had a new garage door opener, dishwasher worked on and light fixtures fixed and the property managers covered it all. The only time the home owners had to pay for anything was when my toilet had been leaking. It had been leaking for a good while apparently and they had to replace some of the boards in between the floors. The owners had to pay for that repair but I believe they used their home owners insurance to cover the cost.

  9. #29
    Get a lawyer. A lawyer knows the laws better than you and its the only way you can get out of the situation (if your laws are like the ones we have here).

    smrund did a pretty decent run down...Tenants usually have the upper hand, and in this gas you tenant my be coming off like a dick but he isn't wrong. Actually it would be better for you to negotiate with him. Cut him a deal on his rent or something.

  10. #30
    OK, it would seem my initial post was massively wrong, due to the short-comings you have now put.


    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    IIt was not professionally cleaned
    It should have been - Between lets, it should always be deep cleaned. Not contract breaking though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    loose framing on closets doors,
    This is your responsibility, as it is your wardrobe, not their's. Any furniture supplied at let, is to be maintained by you. However, is not an issue if you didn't. They couldn't complain, as even though you have to maintain, you let as seen. So, bleh to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    splits in tile in kitchen
    Hazardous and again, your responsibility, but not contract breaking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    light bulb out in bathroom (laughable)
    OK, this 1 is a joke. They replace light bulbs

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    two electric outlets not operational
    VERY MUCH up to you! Faulty electrics, even to a switch not working, could result in massive issues to health (Fire/Shorting out/etc) Get that sorted ASAP!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    holes in bathroom cabinet under the sink)
    Meh, this is a 50/50. Again though, it's your's, so you would want it sorting as it reflects on future tenants.





    Quote Originally Posted by Clevername View Post
    I hate being the bad guy in this situation.
    Sadly, in this case, you are. But sounds as though you have a bit of a dick of a tenant as well. Sorry
    Last edited by Telila; 2012-12-23 at 10:11 AM.

  11. #31
    He signed a lease that including a provision regarding the state of the condo. Regardless of physically seeing the condo, he signed a legally binding document. He wouldn't fare well with these details in small claims court.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Maharisha View Post
    He signed a lease that including a provision regarding the state of the condo. Regardless of physically seeing the condo, he signed a legally binding document. He wouldn't fare well with these details in small claims court.

    That is so wrong it's unreal. You can't just let a property to a tenant in any state and say in their contract "as is" it doesn't work like that. Standard of living is a requirement, and they would fare very well in court....normally.

    However, the issues (other than the electrics) are not that seriously. They would still win, most likely, but wouldn't be worth the effort against lost rental income for fixing the issues.

  13. #33
    Banned Jayburner's Avatar
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    I haven's seen my landlord in 3 months? Why the heck doesn't he want my money?

  14. #34
    Sorry for hijacking this thread for a moment but does anyone know who's responsibility is noisy neighbors? I live in a 3 apartment terraced building and the tenant to the left is some 30 year old man who doesn't work, so he sleeps during the day and is usually up till 2-6 am, making noise. Loud music, fixing something, banging etc. or has some women over.

    I can't call the police because the noise is not that loud(it probably cant be heard on the street), it's just that the wall between my and hes apartment is fairly thin so I can hear everything and can't sleep. Talking to him obviously doesn't work, talking to the landlord doesn't work either. He sent him a few notices at first but that did nothing. I also don't want to move out because I've already sunk a lot of my own money into the apartment and things that I cant take with.

    Is this the landlords responsibility? Or is there something I can do about it, legally (or otherwise).

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Lizbeth View Post
    Sorry for hijacking this thread for a moment but does anyone know who's responsibility is noisy neighbors? I live in a 3 apartment terraced building and the tenant to the left is some 30 year old man who doesn't work, so he sleeps during the day and is usually up till 2-6 am, making noise. Loud music, fixing something, banging etc. or has some women over.

    I can't call the police because the noise is not that loud(it probably cant be heard on the street), it's just that the wall between my and hes apartment is fairly thin so I can hear everything and can't sleep. Talking to him obviously doesn't work, talking to the landlord doesn't work either. He sent him a few notices at first but that did nothing. I also don't want to move out because I've already sunk a lot of my own money into the apartment and things that I cant take with.

    Is this the landlords responsibility? Or is there something I can do about it, legally (or otherwise).
    Yes it is your landlord. if they do not do anything about it or it continues after your landlord has issued notices you call the police.

    Most things you won't have much to stand on, but playing loud music or having a party (of two), the 5-0 will come over and let them know.

    I would suggest to your landlord that you would split the cost of sound proofing insulation for the wall and double up on the drywall in the effected rooms. maybe do a 30/70,60/40 or a few months free rent.

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