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  1. #1

    [Arcane] 5.2 changes benefit or slight nerf?

    Has anyone done the math on this will we no longer have to leave I feel like the nerfs go both way and I haven't done any math to see if it will be about the same or better or worse, here at the changes I'm curious about.

    Underlined parts are the changes the numbers before them are the current live state.



    Arcane Blast Arcane Blast's damage is increased by 24% 25% per Arcane Charge, and its mana cost is increased by 125% per Arcane Charge. 75% per Arcane Charge. 1.5% 1.666667% of Base Mana.

    Rune of Power While standing in your own Rune of Power, your mana regeneration is increased by 100% 75% and your spell damage is increased by 15%.
    Last edited by Leon17848; 2012-12-22 at 03:20 AM.

  2. #2
    Elemental Lord Chickat's Avatar
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    Nerf in some ways. The mana nerf to arcane blast should be a dps increase while the rune of power nerf just makes the other talents good as well. In the end maybe a slight nerf to mages who picked rune, but nothing to worry about.
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  3. #3
    Dreadlord Spellweaver's Avatar
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    I'm pretty sure most of those changes are simply tooltip fixes for now, with a few exceptions. (think RoP is still 100% on live)

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  4. #4
    No matter how you look at it, it is a slight nerf. The biggest factor in all of this is "new" theorycrafting that will need to be done in order to find the next "optimal" rotation and setup, but I truly believe it will be a quality of life change, and since Arcane will more than likely play how Blizzard intended it to be played, we won't see any more nerfs for a good while.

  5. #5
    big big nerf
    no more scorch weaving
    rop regen to the ground.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by DreamSpyre View Post
    No matter how you look at it, it is a slight nerf. The biggest factor in all of this is "new" theorycrafting that will need to be done in order to find the next "optimal" rotation and setup, but I truly believe it will be a quality of life change, and since Arcane will more than likely play how Blizzard intended it to be played, we won't see any more nerfs for a good while.
    How will this change your "rotation" I feel like you play on the fly anyway based off AM procs. I don't see how it will change you opener at all to be honest overall the only thing that will change is weaving and how often or not you do it.


    Quote Originally Posted by invictusordead View Post
    big big nerf
    no more scorch weaving
    rop regen to the ground.
    This isn't a huge nerf if it is one at all, a big nerf was fire after 5.1 we need less people adding in useless comments like this it only attracts trolls.

  7. #7
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leon17848 View Post
    Underlined parts are the changes the numbers before them are the current live state.



    Arcane Blast Arcane Blast's damage is increased by 24% 25% per Arcane Charge, and its mana cost is increased by 125% per Arcane Charge. 75% per Arcane Charge. 1.5% 1.666667% of Base Mana.
    Erm, 25% Damage and 75% Mana Cost is actually on live right now... It was added since 5.1, but the tooltips didn't get changes, so that's purely a tooltip fix. The extra .16666666667% mana cost is a 5.2 change though.

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  8. #8
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
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    Let's clarify:

    Benefit per Charge is already 25% on live, this is just a tooltip change,

    Mana cost of blast is already increased by 75% per Charge, this is just a tooltip change.

    Mana cost of Blast increase is a slight nerf but not a drastic one, I can completely approve of it.

    Missiles damage increase per Charge is a tooltip change, it's already on live.

    Barrage damage increase per Charge is a tooltip change, it's already on live.

    The Rune of Power and Scorch changes are significant, they will completely disable our 6-charge camping gameplay. This is *expected*. Not necessarily welcome, but very much expected.

    I'm anxious to see what the Hotfix Passive (new) means. Edit: in the meantime I saw that all classes and specs have this same line in the code.
    Last edited by Shangalar; 2012-12-22 at 03:21 AM.

  9. #9
    Okay I guess I missed a couple posts I guess with hotfixes to arcane assumed these changes would of went in with 5.1 I guess I was too distracted with the whole fire nerf going on at the time.

  10. #10
    In agreement with Shangalar here, however, like i stated in another post on a different topic, i do think that its a wait and see, firstly about rotation, as i think that the Scorchweaving could possibly still be valid with alot of Haste, and secondly i'd also like to see what the other passive is too..

    Would be rather amusing if they nerfed RoP regen and gave us it back as a passive.

  11. #11
    For rune of power gameplay as arcane I just see this as moving us back to using barrage instead of scorching for procs. It was only like 600 DPS less anyway. You'll have to adjust but it's not going to be a serious nerf at all.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Leon17848 View Post
    How will this change your "rotation" I feel like you play on the fly anyway based off AM procs. I don't see how it will change you opener at all to be honest overall the only thing that will change is weaving and how often or not you do it.
    The rotation will change because you will be expected to Barrage at 6 stacks, we may fish with 1 or 2 extra AB's for missile procs, but we will be barraging in the rotation. That being said, That's what the RoP rotation will be.

    Invocation I think is very very close to being very viable. I've been playing with it even before these changes and I think that will end up being what I stay as if my testing keeps proving it's not a loss of DPS.

    I like these changes, it does exactly what Blizzard wanted Arcane to be like, Maintain close to 100% mana with RoP and constant 6 stack Barrage. Use Invocation as a Permanent Burn phase type of ability (Honestly, with haste and lucky missile procs, I'm sometimes hard pressed to even burn down low enough to warrant invocation before the buff disappears).

    IW is still in limbo, but it's a step in the right direction. The scorch weaving was never going to last.

  13. #13
    Elemental Lord Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    I'm anxious to see what the Hotfix Passive (new) means. Edit: in the meantime I saw that all classes and specs have this same line in the code.
    Actually, only DPS speccs did. Not sure if intended or not.

    The list is also a DATAMINED list. We won't know everything until January :\

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  14. #14
    To be honest I won't be that upset if we end up having to clear stacks, Scorch Weaving is fun but it's a shame not to cast Arcane Barrage every once in a while (when not under Alter Time anyway).
    It's such a nice looking spell! And it cleaves!

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Imnick View Post
    To be honest I won't be that upset if we end up having to clear stacks, Scorch Weaving is fun but it's a shame not to cast Arcane Barrage every once in a while (when not under Alter Time anyway).
    It's such a nice looking spell! And it cleaves!
    I have to agree, I love using Barrage. Now all they have to do is have Barrage refresh NT on any target it hits and I would be in heaven. Ah, Pipe dreams.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by DreamSpyre View Post
    The rotation will change because you will be expected to Barrage at 6 stacks, we may fish with 1 or 2 extra AB's for missile procs, but we will be barraging in the rotation. That being said, That's what the RoP rotation will be.

    Invocation I think is very very close to being very viable. I've been playing with it even before these changes and I think that will end up being what I stay as if my testing keeps proving it's not a loss of DPS.

    I like these changes, it does exactly what Blizzard wanted Arcane to be like, Maintain close to 100% mana with RoP and constant 6 stack Barrage. Use Invocation as a Permanent Burn phase type of ability (Honestly, with haste and lucky missile procs, I'm sometimes hard pressed to even burn down low enough to warrant invocation before the buff disappears).

    IW is still in limbo, but it's a step in the right direction. The scorch weaving was never going to last.
    I dunno about invocation, I just posted in the other thread but if passive regen is 50% for the 1 minute invoker's energy is up, that means you're not going to get back up to full mana, or even close, when you drop your stacks. Instead you would need to evocate every time you're forced to drop stacks which can be pretty soon if you happen to get unlucky with missile procs. Unless i'm mistaken I think we're still stuck with ROP and it's completely uncalled for nerf.

  17. #17
    Massive mage nerfs. The datamined 'buffs' are already in game like others posted. Invocation is still completely unviable for arcane because you'll drop down in mana like crazy because of piss poor regen. Additionally, a 1 minute invocation that gives 15% extra damage isn't a quality of life buff, it's a huge nerf to specs like fire which would prefer to have massive spellpower for the time when you are using all your powerups and combusting. Rune of Power change is simply a dps nerf to arcane. It means you're falling down in mana 25% faster than before which means less use of mana adept which means less dps. Not to mention, the scorch nerf that forces barrage use is a much, much bigger dps loss on live than the '600dps' people are claiming if you know how to scorch weave/alternate properly to keep mana near 99.99% at all times. I have 507 ilvl at the moment and 10 active wol top10 dps scores in tier 14.

    We're looking at a ~5-10% nerf to fire, 10-15% nerf to arcane while frost stays around break even (which is barely mediocre).
    Last edited by kensai666; 2012-12-22 at 07:40 AM.

  18. #18
    I loved the 6 charge camping style.

  19. #19
    Warchief Voyager's Avatar
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    The Scorch nerf is welcome, I never liked that kind of gameplay. Not that it was really better than the 1-6 gameplay anyway.
    But the "Arcane Blast 1.66667% of base mana." is ridiculous, as if Arcane isn't underpowered enough already compared to nearly every other class.

    Invocation should be much better now, IW is still a pesky annoying skill though. They either need to remove the mana penalty from the T6 skills, or change the Mastery to give a flat increase to the current 100% mana value without nerfing it's scale.

  20. #20
    I will say, invocation is not unviable even right now. It's working alright not always optimal over rune, but still doing great in it's own way, and perhaps even better than rune in some cases.

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