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  1. #21
    Your mistake is assuming everyone works in the field that they studied. The reality is that few people who major in psychology (to borrow your example) actually become psychologists and so on. The reverse is often true as well, people who do what you would consider more useful degrees also don't necessarily take the job you're assuming, my own example is that I did pol sci then law, and I can confirm that from my own graduating class in law less than 10% have ended up in practice (I teach, which I enjoy more personally, but I certainly have never regretted getting the law degree), similarly I know plenty of people with general arts degrees working in business and so on. The choices made by teenagers about what they want to study don't really bind them for life. The idea is that a general education at that level, in absolutely anything, has a overall beneficial impact both on the person receiving it and the workforce as a whole.
    Last edited by Windfury; 2012-12-23 at 11:10 AM.

  2. #22
    Scarab Lord JfmC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windfury View Post
    Your mistake is assuming everyone works in the field that they studied. The reality is that few people who major in psychology (to borrow your example) actually become psychologists and so on.
    The reverse is often true as well, people who do what you would consider more useful degrees also don't necessarily take the job you're assuming, my own example is that I did pol sci then law, and I can confirm that from my own graduating class in law less than 10% have ended up in practice (I teach, which I enjoy more personally, but I certainly have never regretted getting the law degree), similarly I know plenty of people with general arts degrees working in business and so on.
    The choices made by teenagers about what they want to study don't really bind them for life. The idea is that a general education at that level, in absolutely anything, has a overall beneficial impact both on the person receiving it and the workforce as a whole.
    You do realize that when you follow studies in a good university, you don't only learn about the field you chose to study. You also learn to work in a group without the teacher holding your hand. You learn to understand things you study, not just blindly learn them out of the top of your head like secundary education (sadly) seems to do.
    You learn discipline, hard work and how to plan ahead and coördinate yourself. These are the most important things you learn in tertiary education, not the field you study (also important, but not as important)

  3. #23
    Mechagnome Lefeng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JfmC View Post
    You do realize that when you follow studies in a good university, you don't only learn about the field you chose to study. You also learn to work in a group without the teacher holding your hand. You learn to understand things you study, not just blindly learn them out of the top of your head like secundary education (sadly) seems to do.
    You learn discipline, hard work and how to plan ahead and coördinate yourself. These are the most important things you learn in tertiary education, not the field you study (also important, but not as important)
    Which is exactly why the OP's idea of the government capping college majors according to job market needs makes no sense. I studied music education, a very narrow field, and most of my former classmates are now club owners, professional musicians, automobile salesmen, etc. You can only cap university majors if you are assuming everyone will later enter the workforce in their original field of study and that's simply not the case.

    What about liberal arts majors? Their is no "need" in the job market for musicians, poets, sculptors, painters, writers, actors, or dancers. There is only the cultural obligation to produce great art. How on earth could you cap those? I know most universities do in order to maintain a standard of excellence within their programs but what data can be used to determine how many dancers are "needed" in the workforce?

  4. #24
    A culture change would be more effective, there's this thing now where US education doesn't stop until after college so most people just go there because they think they should.
    One cannot simply quit wow his way into Mordor.

  5. #25
    Scarab Lord JfmC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ugru View Post
    Which is exactly why the OP's idea of the government capping college majors according to job market needs makes no sense. I studied music education, a very narrow field, and most of my former classmates are now club owners, professional musicians, automobile salesmen, etc. You can only cap university majors if you are assuming everyone will later enter the workforce in their original field of study and that's simply not the case.

    What about liberal arts majors? Their is no "need" in the job market for musicians, poets, sculptors, painters, writers, actors, or dancers. There is only the cultural obligation to produce great art. How on earth could you cap those? I know most universities do in order to maintain a standard of excellence within their programs but what data can be used to determine how many dancers are "needed" in the workforce?
    Dansers are needed in the workforce, the entertainment business is a very big business. Don't lable workforce as people who perform labor with their hands (like lumberjacks and plumbers) workforce = everybody that has a job.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-23 at 01:41 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Felfury View Post
    A culture change would be more effective, there's this thing now where US education doesn't stop until after college so most people just go there because they think they should.
    There need to be more people with university grades. Unless you mean with culture change, make secundary education usefull and not a way to keep kids busy/of the street

  6. #26
    Bloodsail Admiral Decagon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Tertiary comes after secondary by definition.

    Trust Americans to screw English :-\
    We still use the term tertiary education, but we usually call it post-secondary as post-secondary refers to ANYTHING after high school such as a technical college, or a community college, tertiary here refers specifically to university.

    Anyways, I'm always and advocate of further subsidized education, but I don't know if the government could accurately predict exactly what majors would be needed by the time students finish those majors, or if it would even be a good idea to restrict funding to some areas of education based on not necessarily true economic predictions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Asmekiel View Post
    "And nothing was ever heard from Deca again"

  7. #27
    The Lightbringer slime's Avatar
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    I feel like the two best scenerios in life (in America) are to be a great success or an absolute failure, these two are rewarded the most. Successful is obvious why it's good, but total failure? I have many friends who have defaulted on their school loans because of no work or minimal work, yet I maintain a job (low paying) and if i stretch the dollars I can barely make it by w/o anything left. You think I wouldn't like to take a pass on my school loan? Maybe the person that is responsible and works hard daily should be getting rewarded? The new trend I see with this type of behavior in America is defaulting on tax payments or settling for like 10% of what you owe. So, you have a good year in your self employment business, and you have it set up to pay at the end of the year.. yet you don't. And wait a few years till your business isn't making you money anymore and you claim bankruptcy or you settle with the IRS for like 10% of what you owe and get away with it. So, again the person working hard, struggling with low pay - yet makes sure to pay his taxes in full gets screwed and the failure gets another free pass. America rewards extremes and rapes and lives off of the means.
    Last edited by slime; 2012-12-23 at 02:30 PM.

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