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  1. #61
    The Patient
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    The only suggestion I would have is breaking the videos down into sections, and providing links to each section in the description for each "chapter" that you have at time breakpoints. Makes it far easier to navigate. Clicking the slide bar isn't incredibly inconvenient itself either. Probably just personal preference on my end.

    I've begun testing of the crit/haste build with GoSup in preparation for 5.2 just to see where it falls. It's a bit quicker and seems to be less reliant on proc management to empower CB's, since you throw around quite a few more of them. Might warrant a new set of videos, or at least a mastery build disclaimer. May not pan out to be better, or even equal, but I like to be prepared. Illidan still mocks me when I sleep

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Medieve View Post
    Might warrant a new set of videos, or at least a mastery build disclaimer. May not pan out to be better, or even equal, but I like to be prepared. Illidan still mocks me when I sleep
    He's only just realeased this one! I think 5.2 is far enough away, and the changes not set in stone enough to worry too much about the changes just yet.
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  3. #63
    Nice video. Love how I dont need to explain destro and just link this video.
    ||<>||<>|| Zvix - What Went Wrong - Talnivarr Eu||<>||<>||
    ||<>||<>|| Warlock Boss Movies -10m --> Nefarian, Al´Akir, Cho'gall and others!||<>||<>||
    ||<>||<>|| http://www.youtube.com/user/zvix01 ||<>||<>|| www.talnivarr.com ||<>||<>||

  4. #64
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by xskarma View Post
    He's only just realeased this one! I think 5.2 is far enough away, and the changes not set in stone enough to worry too much about the changes just yet.
    True, but no good deed ever goes unpunished . I've got no problem helping him out either, if it turns out to become overly demanding.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Medieve View Post
    The only suggestion I would have is breaking the videos down into sections, and providing links to each section in the description for each "chapter" that you have at time breakpoints. Makes it far easier to navigate. Clicking the slide bar isn't incredibly inconvenient itself either. Probably just personal preference on my end.

    I've begun testing of the crit/haste build with GoSup in preparation for 5.2 just to see where it falls. It's a bit quicker and seems to be less reliant on proc management to empower CB's, since you throw around quite a few more of them. Might warrant a new set of videos, or at least a mastery build disclaimer. May not pan out to be better, or even equal, but I like to be prepared. Illidan still mocks me when I sleep
    Did you check the description? Or are you referring to some other method?

    As for the haste build stuff, I'm gonna be redoing sections of the video that need updating once 5.2 changes are more set in stone. I'm hopeful that they don't nerf Sacrifice to the ground as it's the proc reliance that makes the mastery/sac builds fun for me.

  6. #66
    The Patient
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    I meant split the long video into shorter ones, with links to other sections in the description. Nothing fancy, but probably just a personal preference thing, nothing game changing or breaking.

  7. #67
    I see you use a fully upgraded DMF trinket, Brusalk. And Light of the Cosmos.
    I suppose the reason you don't want Essence of Terror is because the ICD is too long or maybe you don't want more haste as a proc?

    I simcrafted it with my character just fast once with the two you have, and with Light of the Cosmos and Essence of Terror, and indeed it shows your setup to be the best.
    Yet all I see is Essence of Terror beign BiS and super good etc. While Relic of Yulon beign somewhat bad according to most sites (like Icy Veins etc.).

    What's your take on all of it?
    And can I really take my simcrafting as proof that it is better? (I take it you know what you're doing seeign you rank high as s*it on all fights. )

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemie View Post
    I see you use a fully upgraded DMF trinket, Brusalk. And Light of the Cosmos.
    I suppose the reason you don't want Essence of Terror is because the ICD is too long or maybe you don't want more haste as a proc?

    I simcrafted it with my character just fast once with the two you have, and with Light of the Cosmos and Essence of Terror, and indeed it shows your setup to be the best.
    Yet all I see is Essence of Terror beign BiS and super good etc. While Relic of Yulon beign somewhat bad according to most sites (like Icy Veins etc.).

    What's your take on all of it?
    And can I really take my simcrafting as proof that it is better? (I take it you know what you're doing seeign you rank high as s*it on all fights. )
    Well it's a few things.

    1) We haven't killed Heroic Sha so comparing Relic to EoT Normal isn't much of a contest.

    2) The ICD on Relic times up amazingly with Engineering Gloves, LotC, Jade Spirit, etc. The combinations of those int procs all happening at the same time (and frequently at that, and often with Dark Soul) makes me like Relic over EoT.

    3) The Destro Simcraft APL doesn't attempt to stack procs and use chaos bolts for mini burns when lots of procs are up, so I'm of the opinion that simcraft is over-estimating the worth of EoT and under-estimating the value of Relic. (Since the haste proc has no stacking capability with other stuff, while Relic does).

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-28 at 02:06 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Medieve View Post
    I meant split the long video into shorter ones, with links to other sections in the description. Nothing fancy, but probably just a personal preference thing, nothing game changing or breaking.
    I see what you mean. I'll probably do that in the future as it'd make keeping the guide(s) updated much, much easier than having to redo everything every time something significant changes.

    ---------- Post added 2012-12-28 at 02:07 PM ----------

    Would there be interest from folks of my going through some of the kill videos I've recorded (I'm going to upload Amber Shaper and Garalon today) and doing some sort of running commentary where I describe why I did stuff, or if I did something wrong, explaining why it's wrong?

    Would that be helpful to people?

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Well it's a few things.
    Would there be interest from folks of my going through some of the kill videos I've recorded (I'm going to upload Amber Shaper and Garalon today) and doing some sort of running commentary where I describe why I did stuff, or if I did something wrong, explaining why it's wrong?

    Would that be helpful to people?
    Would definitely like that

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    Would there be interest from folks of my going through some of the kill videos I've recorded (I'm going to upload Amber Shaper and Garalon today) and doing some sort of running commentary where I describe why I did stuff, or if I did something wrong, explaining why it's wrong?

    Would that be helpful to people?
    Oh yes, I would very much like that!

  11. #71
    Great video, only really had time to skim it, but I have one suggestion:

    If you're going to play Destro you NEED some kind of weakaura/tellmewhen alert for Skull Banner. It increases crit damage by 20%, so it is bar none the best CD to cast CB on while in between DS. So if DS is down and you have a couple embers you'll want to be using CB when Skull Banner goes down, as no other buff with give you 20% more damage. I just use a basic one to track when I have the buff, which is very reactionary, but you could probably find a more advanced addon to track the CD of each Warrior's Skull Banner, and if you know they will drop it on CD then you can potentially line up both DS and Banner for some insane damage.

    You mentioned Skull Banner briefly in your video, but I feel that more emphasis is needed because it's such a powerful CD, and because it comes from an external source additional help is needed to track it most of the time.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by neubs986 View Post
    Great video, only really had time to skim it, but I have one suggestion:

    If you're going to play Destro you NEED some kind of weakaura/tellmewhen alert for Skull Banner. It increases crit damage by 20%, so it is bar none the best CD to cast CB on while in between DS. So if DS is down and you have a couple embers you'll want to be using CB when Skull Banner goes down, as no other buff with give you 20% more damage. I just use a basic one to track when I have the buff, which is very reactionary, but you could probably find a more advanced addon to track the CD of each Warrior's Skull Banner, and if you know they will drop it on CD then you can potentially line up both DS and Banner for some insane damage.

    You mentioned Skull Banner briefly in your video, but I feel that more emphasis is needed because it's such a powerful CD, and because it comes from an external source additional help is needed to track it most of the time.
    20% crit is not all that much compared to the damage increase provided by 2+ int trinket/temp procs. That said the reason why I don't specifically track skull banner is because the two times I ever want to cast a few Chaos Bolts in a row is either under DS (with a bunch of trinket procs), or about a minute after/before a DS where all the trinket/temp procs are up again and I use engineering gloves. Not to mention the warrior(s) in my raid always call out when they use it or /say macro it so I know when it's up.

    I wouldn't argue it's a requirement to have some sort of weakaura or alert for it, but I'm not gonna say that it's not helpful.

    Also you should avoid not casting DS on CD unless you know that not doing so won't cost you a DS in the fight. (For example there's only 2 mins left in the fight, you might as well save it up for your last big burn section with temp buffs)

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    20% crit is not all that much compared to the damage increase provided by 2+ int trinket/temp procs. That said the reason why I don't specifically track skull banner is because the two times I ever want to cast a few Chaos Bolts in a row is either under DS (with a bunch of trinket procs), or about a minute after/before a DS where all the trinket/temp procs are up again and I use engineering gloves. Not to mention the warrior(s) in my raid always call out when they use it or /say macro it so I know when it's up.

    I wouldn't argue it's a requirement to have some sort of weakaura or alert for it, but I'm not gonna say that it's not helpful.

    Also you should avoid not casting DS on CD unless you know that not doing so won't cost you a DS in the fight. (For example there's only 2 mins left in the fight, you might as well save it up for your last big burn section with temp buffs)
    20% crit damage is FAR superior to a single Int proc. 20% crit damage for CB is roughly equivalent to 20% crit chance, which is about 12,000 crit rating. Using the normalized stat weights for Destro on simcraft, that translates to roughly 5400 int. The BEST int proc is only 3935, making Skull banner vastly superior to any individual proc. Therefore, unless the stars are going to align and give you 10 seconds of 2+ Int procs outside of Skull Banner, it's probably the better call to cast CB with a proc or two + Banner than to wait for ALL your procs to line up. I mean, it's great that YOU are an engineer and have that to work with, but keep in mind that not everyone is.

    Also, when I said delay casting it, I meant by a matter of seconds. In the long run, a few seconds of waiting for a proc will not cost you the use of 1 more DS.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by neubs986 View Post
    20% crit damage is FAR superior to a single Int proc. 20% crit damage for CB is roughly equivalent to 20% crit chance, which is about 12,000 crit rating. Using the normalized stat weights for Destro on simcraft, that translates to roughly 5400 int. The BEST int proc is only 3935, making Skull banner vastly superior to any individual proc. Therefore, unless the stars are going to align and give you 10 seconds of 2+ Int procs outside of Skull Banner, it's probably the better call to cast CB with a proc or two + Banner than to wait for ALL your procs to line up. I mean, it's great that YOU are an engineer and have that to work with, but keep in mind that not everyone is.

    Also, when I said delay casting it, I meant by a matter of seconds. In the long run, a few seconds of waiting for a proc will not cost you the use of 1 more DS.
    I never said use it for one Int proc. In the current tier with Relic, LotC, Lightweaving, Jade Spirit, and Engineering Gloves it's very, very easy to have 2, 3, even 4 int procs up at once around every minute (as everything is around a 50sec ICD with a non-100% proc chance)

    I'm not disagreeing with you that Skull Banner is a good thing to know about and take use of when it's there, which is why I mentioned it in the guide, but the vast majority of warlocks will have 2 or more of those int procs up at once multiple times between DS burns. I'm writing a written version which will have a section on skull-banner, but I don't think it warrants a change to the video guide at this point.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Brusalk View Post
    I never said use it for one Int proc. In the current tier with Relic, LotC, Lightweaving, Jade Spirit, and Engineering Gloves it's very, very easy to have 2, 3, even 4 int procs up at once around every minute (as everything is around a 50sec ICD with a non-100% proc chance)

    I'm not disagreeing with you that Skull Banner is a good thing to know about and take use of when it's there, which is why I mentioned it in the guide, but the vast majority of warlocks will have 2 or more of those int procs up at once multiple times between DS burns. I'm writing a written version which will have a section on skull-banner, but I don't think it warrants a change to the video guide at this point.
    I understand what you're saying. I think that perhaps for some locks (those that are Engineering/Tailoring) then Skull Banner isn't as good as having everything up at once. However, for those with only, say, Relic (3261 Int with full upgrades), Jade Spirit (1650 Int), and Light (3935 Int on heroic with full upgrades), then Skull Banner (approx. 5400 Int equivalent) becomes extremely important. Skull Banner on its own is just as good as (if not better than) Jade Spirit + 1 other proc. Therefore, the only combination of procs that beats a lone banner is both trinkets, or both trinkets + Jade Spirit. However, Skull Banner + Jade Spirit is just a hair under both trinket procs, and Skull Banner with just the Relic is only slightly under the combination of all three without the banner. Therefore, the only time you might want to even CONSIDER not casting CB when Banner goes down is if you have 0 other procs, and feel as though you might get all three fairly soon. In any other circumstance though, Banner + 1-2 procs is just as good as, if not better than, full procs.

    I'm not saying that your video needs to be changed, I just wanted to start a dialogue about it here to make people aware of how powerful a cool down it is, especially for the non tailor/engineers.

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Elanas View Post
    While I'm asking questions, when it comes to picking a weapon with the sha-touched socket, is there an advantage to staff over 1H + offhand, or vice versa?
    The wisdom has long been that 1H/OH is superior to 2H, because you end up with a bit more primary stat with the OH enchant. However, I think that the new item upgrade mechanic may upset this wisdom. It costs the same 1500 VP/CP to upgrade a 2H or a 1H, but the 2H gets an upgrade equivalent to upgrading both the 1H and the OH. Comparing an upgrade of Loshan vs Jin'ya -

    Loshan: +40 Int, +542 Spellpower, +53 secondary stats
    Jin'ya: +142 Int, +542 Spellpower, +123 secondary stats

    Given the low weekly point caps, I think what's effectively a free 1500 VP item upgrade makes a 2H the superior choice now. Of course, it's not a big enough difference to turn down a clear item upgrade. But if given the choice I think that the 2H staff is now a compelling option, especially in PvP where you have complete control of which you get.
    Last edited by Kirroth; 2012-12-31 at 09:02 PM.

  17. #77
    Stood in the Fire Bloodfire's Avatar
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    Guess i'm doing smth wrong...
    75k dps in LFR.
    Something isn't right.
    If Conflag is on cd, what's better, spam RoF on target multiple times or use Fel Flame?

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodfire View Post
    Guess i'm doing smth wrong...
    75k dps in LFR.
    Something isn't right.
    If Conflag is on cd, what's better, spam RoF on target multiple times or use Fel Flame?
    I'd consider using Incinerate.

  19. #79
    Stood in the Fire Bloodfire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonkura View Post
    I'd consider using Incinerate.
    So RoF shouldn't be wasted on a single target?

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodfire View Post
    So RoF shouldn't be wasted on a single target?
    I believe he was referring to your description of your rotation where your filler seemed to be spamming RoF/FF, hence suggesting the use of Incinerate which is considered the optimal filler spell. You may use RoF single target, but you don't ever spam it, multiple RoF in the same area don't stack.

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