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  1. #41
    The Lightbringer Lovestar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm glad you don't work for Blizzard. I'd reroll.
    And I'm glad you don't work for Blizzard, since the iterative design process would break down into a bunch of people throwing vague insults at each other and then wandering off to lunch.

    Seriously, I agree with Keren, the amount of useless snob replies here isn't fair. OP's ideas may not be perfect but they're thought-out and constructive. If you're going to respond with disagreement, at least explain the problem rather than hyperbolic insults to try to make yourself sound pro.

    Quote Originally Posted by klausistklaus View Post
    What's annoying is the amount of (short time) cooldowns you have to manage, nothing else.
    That's mostly valid, but it really depends on what you're doing. Hunter does have a lot of extremely obscure utility buttons (like Scare Beast, Scatter Shot, Flare, etc) which you need to utilize in the right environment (because why not?) but really do feel like kitchen-sinking.

    The problem is that the class is designed around all those little tics and knobs currently, so if you imagine just cutting them all out without compensation it's easy to make the argument "BUT THEN I'D BE BROKEN IN — ".

    Quote Originally Posted by Keren View Post
    SV should just get a unique ability for itself, like becoming more vulnerable to dots damage of hunters (SS and Explosive). That would provide an acutal timeable burst for SV and fit into the scheme...
    They could make Serpent Sting ticks proc Lock & Load and turn Black Arrow into Surv's signature CD. Would help BA feel less like "Uhm, hey, another button... I guess I'll press it" which it has felt like since introduction.

    I guess it's probably out of the question to imagine Black Arrow summoning skeletons like it did in WC3. :p
    Last edited by Lovestar; 2012-12-28 at 06:26 PM.

  2. #42
    I fully agree with the removal of readiness as a DPS cooldown. It's part of the reason we have so much clutter in our openings, which often results in nerfs as our burst becomes difficult to tune.

    Our 90 tier should be scrapped. All 3 could be made baseline or spec specific abilities with minor alterations. The tier could then be changed to have 3 different options for additional effects on Rapid Fire, to compensate for the DPS lost to Readiness.

    For example, Glaive Toss could be made into a cleave type filler ability that is tuned to replaced Arcane Shot as a filler when there are 2+ targets. We don't lose an "ability" from the exchange, but we do lose some rotational clutter.
    Last edited by Aertea; 2012-12-28 at 06:40 PM.

  3. #43
    I believe the intent behind GC's post was that we have to many buttons to push not necessarily to many abilities. Most likely what will happen is that they will make some talents more of a proc that you don't have to push a button. Most abilities that we have or that proc are used on CD, so if they could be merged so that they happen automatically upon proc, you free up a bunch of button pushing, and make things a bit less bloated. BM, when FF or BW proc you use them, generally you don't sit on them, you use them on CD, now before you jump all over me I know that there are times when you want to control them, but for the most part to maximize dps in a PVE environment, you use them on CD. So instead of having BW proc and having to push a button, it procs and happens automatically. This is just an example, but I believe what the intent of GC original post on the subject. They do have some abilities that need to be removed, but our basic tier abilities just need some tweaking in this fashion.

    On the aspects subject. I think they are old an outdated. Speaking from a PVE perspective I don't know of anyone that uses Pack other than as a utility for running back when you are dead, otherwise in combat it is pretty useless..DAZE.. Change it to a short CD ability similar to the Druid ability Stampeding Roar. The same can be said with Cheetah, in PVE its great that they gave us the glyph, but as soon as I take damage I lose the affects.. Well most PVE encounters have use taking constant damage of some sort so it cannot be used in combat. Change it to a short CD ability similar to the Rogue Sprint ability.. Neither of the other class abilities have the stupid restrictions that pack and cheetah have. Aspects are a dated concept that need to be removed.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis003 View Post
    you should try playing anything else in the game and you would see how much easier everything else is to play by comparison, thats the sad thing.
    Just to be clear - I was talking about PvE only.

  5. #45
    Hunters have a number of buttons, but I find it pretty manageable. Shaman on the other hand...

    My suggestion for PvE is to remove offensive abilities from Readiness (and double the length of Rapid Fire for MM). Resetting shots and CDs is the primary source of rotational clusterfuckage, especially at the beginning of fights.

    For PvP, just bake Widow Venom into something else already.

  6. #46
    I like readiness baseline, can't believe you'd want that removing, makes BM openers so much fun and hectic. I also like the number of buttons, probably the only thing that may help is increasing the cd on some abilities (like DB) and increasing the dmg they did. I'm happy with hunters, at least you need a brain to play them now .. anyone checked out mages, have an alt and I cannot believe how boring they are. Keep hunters as is, buff our damage a little and work on something to help us cleave. Merge WV with SrS and just keep the rest. I found the number of buttons over whelming during beta but with my add on to track timers, you get use to it and then start to like the class. I'm afraid OP your ideas are dumbing down a class that requires skill to play, I don't want to play a mage.

  7. #47
    Hectic != Fun. Hectic = Poorly developed.

    Having to make intelligent decisions about what abilities to use, when is fun. We have so many abilities in our primary rotation that the damage per ability is watered down to the point where it makes minimal difference which order you press them in.

  8. #48
    I agree with the consolidation of Widow Venom and Serpent Sting. I also agree with Fervor and/or Dire Beast becoming procs-- especially since they have such short cooldowns at the moment that they feel rotational and not "cooldown"-y.

    I think right now the major issue is with with many of our talents giving us "new" short-cooldown abilities that need to fit into our rotation.
    Last edited by Daetur; 2012-12-29 at 02:20 AM.

  9. #49
    The Patient Varum93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daetur View Post
    I agree with the consolidation of Widow Venom and Serpent Sting. I also agree with Fervor and/or Dire Beast becoming procs-- especially since they have such short cooldowns at the moment that they feel rotational and not "cooldown"-y.

    I think right now the major issue with with many of our talents giving us "new" short-cooldown abilities that need to fit into our rotation.
    Dire beast proccing would be good and a bit of randomness to our rotation as we will get getting focus at random times not when selected.

  10. #50
    The Lightbringer SL1200's Avatar
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    I think hunters would be just fine if Rediness wasn't a baseline talent. I'd rather not have to deal with rediness and the extra complication to the short rotation that it causes. So i'd like to see them make it a talent choice.

  11. #51
    The Patient Varum93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spinachsandwich View Post
    I think hunters would be just fine if Rediness wasn't a baseline talent. I'd rather not have to deal with rediness and the extra complication to the short rotation that it causes. So i'd like to see them make it a talent choice.
    without readiness th rotation is so linear and boring atleast it wakes you up every 5 mins.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Yavania View Post
    without readiness th rotation is so linear and boring atleast it wakes you up every 5 mins.
    Like i said if you think hunters are easy, play any other DPS class and you will want to kill yourself, most every other class uses half the skills that hunters do for their rotation, and many of them being even easier to play do more damage.

    Its just terrible that the devs are so inept at this point that a poorly played mage can match a well played hunter in the same quality of gear.

  13. #53
    The Patient Varum93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nemesis003 View Post
    Like i said if you think hunters are easy, play any other DPS class and you will want to kill yourself, most every other class uses half the skills that hunters do for their rotation, and many of them being even easier to play do more damage.

    Its just terrible that the devs are so inept at this point that a poorly played mage can match a well played hunter in the same quality of gear.
    i prefer having something to do ret pally is just too easy and that was my alt.

  14. #54
    "something to do" should come from an awesome boss fight, not from standing 40y away and mashing complicated rotation

  15. #55
    The Patient Varum93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tokas View Post
    "something to do" should come from an awesome boss fight, not from standing 40y away and mashing complicated rotation
    but on hcs you very rarely stand at 40y and just do rotation.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Aertea View Post
    Hectic != Fun. Hectic = Poorly developed.

    Having to make intelligent decisions about what abilities to use, when is fun. We have so many abilities in our primary rotation that the damage per ability is watered down to the point where it makes minimal difference which order you press them in.
    I find it fun, I also think theres space for intelligent decision making with in all the mayhem that is a BM opener, learning it, perfecting it certainly makes it fun for me, also tweaking it for particular bosses also adds variety. As I said I like it, got nothing against those who don't, I didn't when MoP hit but have come to love how hunters work now.

  17. #57
    Pandaren Monk Serpent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yavania View Post
    but on hcs you very rarely stand at 40y and just do rotation.
    That was his point.

  18. #58
    The best way to fix hunters is to remove readiness and compensate rebuffing abilities accordingly. Readiness fucks everything up. Period.

  19. #59
    The Patient Varum93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanielBrems View Post
    That was his point.
    then whats wrong it means youve always got something to and are not bored which was my point?

  20. #60
    I find Readiness awesome and it should not be removed or nerfed. I think what gives hunters headaches are the lot of new 'rotational' cooldowns, like Focus Fire, Dire Beast, Fervor, Glaive Toss (not sure if it was intended to be part of our rotation), and also the Tier 5...

    What could be done is make some skills passive, like Focus Fire.
    Raise the CD or turn them in Procs, like Fervor and Dire Beast.

    And for GOD SAKE, get rid of Widow Venon... It should be baked already in srp sting for a long time ago... x.x

    Also, it really bothers me that Powershot is in its current state for so long... It is terrible if compared to the other 2 skills on the tier (at least G. Toss). I would totally pick it in any non-raid situation if it had half CD, half cast time and of course half damage.



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