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  1. #381
    Quote Originally Posted by khalltusk View Post
    Oh boy I almost PMSL.

    3 drakes as said earlier were tank and spank, the 1st of which we used the line of sight tactic to avoid getting too many debuffs.
    vael was tank and spank. He really was.
    Broodlord was tank and spank.

    thats 5 bosses, leaving Chrom Raz and Nef. Did you do BWL?
    Look it up all bosses in BWL have at least 5 abilities. True that the last 2 drakes were pretty lame, but it doesnt even come close to a LFR where its just a big zerg with 0% of dying.

    By your definition tank and spank is a fight requiring a tank, that's pretty all encounters in the game.

    http://www.wowhead.com/zone=2677#comments

  2. #382
    If you're trying to argue that the BWL fights were anywhere near as complex as current raids -- which it seems you are -- you are really flat out wrong. BWL fights were mostly very simple, and you're counting boss "abilities" like summoning a player to them if no one is in melee range.
    Any heroic fight in Mogu'Shan is more complex than the most complicated BWL fight (Nef). And trying to compare the dumbed-down LFR versions isn't fair in the least.
    No matter what your opinion is of this game, claiming that encounter design hasn't progressed for the better since Classic is downright silly.
    Help control the population. Have your blood elf spayed or neutered.

  3. #383
    Well anyway I dont really care anymore, I hated Dragon Soul and canceled my sub after that, and I am not the only one. Think what you want, there is no way you can design the same amount of complexity for a 40 man raid then for a 10 man raid, it's not the same feeling at all.

  4. #384
    Quote Originally Posted by Vladar View Post
    Well anyway I dont really care anymore, I hated Dragon Soul and canceled my sub after that, and I am not the only one. Think what you want, there is no way you can design the same amount of complexity for a 40 man raid then for a 10 man raid, it's not the same feeling at all.
    um ok bye??? why were you even aruging in the first place then??? mindblown

  5. #385
    Quote Originally Posted by Vladar View Post
    Well anyway I dont really care anymore, I hated Dragon Soul and canceled my sub after that, and I am not the only one. Think what you want, there is no way you can design the same amount of complexity for a 40 man raid then for a 10 man raid, it's not the same feeling at all.
    So why bother complaining about the current state of the game?You are not even playing anymore

  6. #386
    While I'm a little dissappointed about no new 5 mans, thats purely because i enjoy having new content and new things to run when im not raiding. (i dont particularaly like questing)
    i personally prefer the constant progression approach to raiding, start at the beggining and work through them one at a time. the idea of stopping a raiding tier early and farming a new dungeon to fill in any loot gaps just seems stupid and makes no sense... Would you really look at algalon from ulduar and think, "You know what? You're not that scary and dangerous, but this jousting thing... THAT needs my attention!"

    The way ive always looked at the tiers and my attitude to going through them is similar to levelling. you dont start a new toon, get to 89 and then jump straight into MSV, you get to 90 first.
    while levelling you progress from one dungeon onto the next as your ilvl and actual level both rise, so why should this pattern stop once you begin raiding. Would you just skip levels 80-84 because it was too low gear for you? No, you settle down and work your way through it, either solo (equivilant 90 for raiding gear would be earning rep?) you could run the dungeons (current/previous LFR at cap?) or dungoen boosts (alt runs/guild raid of previous tier at 90?) It's almost as if each tier is a secret behind the scenes level up.
    At Level 90 you had access to heroics, you gear up to 463 and gain acess to to the first tier of current raiding content, or 'level 91'. when 5.2 comes out, ill be treating that as level 92 with the 2nd tier. i wouldnt expect myself ot be able to purchase access to it, but i would work towards the next level by completeing my current content raids.

    Wrath had this content skipping ability and it sucked massively. my guild were in no way server competative, but we did our best and enjoyed it, but we rarely got to complete an entire tier before we felt forced to move onwards. Ulduar we only ever got to general Vexx once and never did any hard modes either then totc came out ulduar may as well have been deleted from the game. While i got to experience most of ulduar/totc and all of ICC we had lots of new members and alts that never got to experience what challenges we faced until catas release, at which point it was all faceroll, and i feel sorry for them.

    Old content just wasnt needed anymore with the easy access to much better gear for 1/10th of the effort, it also hurt the learning ability new players would get. Being able to jump straight from being OP in aoe fest dungeons, to not having a clue in much harder raids hurts the community as a whole, as you get people who honestly think they know what to do because they successfully killed something that one time in that one dungeon.

    Being required through some means to progress one tier at a time is a good thing, as it allows people to learn how to play their class properly in a much more managable situation that being dropped into the absolute latest content. It teaches them how raiding mechanics work, how to conserve mana/maintain dps, when to burst/spam heal and how to manage your cooldown in a very real, but less pressurised situation - and msot importantly, what fire looks like so they can get the hell out of it!

    Anyway, back on topic...
    While 5mans are a nice idea and are good fun, if they were to introduce them in the way your asking for, as a stepping stone from 463 to 5.2 raids, its too much content skipped and experience lost. ideally, (if i were to make them) i would have the dungeons at 2-3 mini tiers. the first being a stepping stone from heroics to LFR (so higher than 463, but lower than 483 gear) then have the higher tier dungeon being the steeping stone from current LFR to the new LFR - That way it wouldnt skip any content, but would allow for a faster gearing process, as you wouldnt need to get as much gear from any single source before being able to progress, but allowing the player to get enough experience in any given medium and get to sample all content available in the expansion, which is what i believe blizzard are aiming for.
    Last edited by Agzarah; 2013-01-10 at 04:37 PM.

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