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  1. #1

    Have they fixed the codex yet?

    Once upon a time if you completed a series in the codex you would get a bonus of some sorts. But there has always been errors in one part or another so you could never complete a series to get the bonus.

    So have they fixed it yet?

  2. #2
    Bloodsail Admiral Jamos77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capt Froggy View Post
    Once upon a time if you completed a series in the codex you would get a bonus of some sorts. But there has always been errors in one part or another so you could never complete a series to get the bonus.

    So have they fixed it yet?
    No. They mentioned the codex system was going to be cleaned up a while ago. Though they didn't give a time estimate I imagine it's not high up on their priority list. I have every single possible codex entry and am anxiously waiting for BW to revamp the system or at least fix the many broken ones.

    I doubt we'll see anything on that front until after Makeb. A pity.
    SWG - Jamus Divinus - Bria 2005-2011

    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    There is plenty to criticize with the game and BioWares handling of it without resorting to exaggeration, so let's not do it : /

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Jamos77 View Post
    No. They mentioned the codex system was going to be cleaned up a while ago. Though they didn't give a time estimate I imagine it's not high up on their priority list. I have every single possible codex entry and am anxiously waiting for BW to revamp the system or at least fix the many broken ones.

    I doubt we'll see anything on that front until after Makeb. A pity.
    They should have scrapped the codex system for a true achievement system a long time ago. I always found it to be an ugly mess.

  4. #4
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    They should have scrapped the codex system for a true achievement system a long time ago. I always found it to be an ugly mess.
    Not trying to be overly critical, but the foundation of the game doesn't really lend itself to an achievement system. It's not open enough and there aren't 'real' professions to accomplish a lot of what other games have for achievements. Nor is space varied enough, nor is there enough 'extra' activities outisde of raiding and pvp.

    It's a pity too, because whoever designed a lot of rare experiences (like the +10 datacrons and some other unique datacrons, Theoretika, etc) would have done a great job if they were given free reign to design challenges just for an achievement system.

  5. #5
    A question about the codex system.

    Is there an entry for HK-51?

    IF there isn't, why not? It's very confusing to me how he works off both Aim and Cunning. Would cunning only be useful if put in his weapons or could all pieces get cunning? Would Aim Mods work in his rifle? I know now it can be either for all his gear, but I didn't see any codex entry for him and had to ask all of this of other players who probably just had to randomly experiment to find out.

    If Bioware ever was not lazy and allowed HK-51 gain affection off of quests, what would he appreciate?
    Speaking of which, I figured Bioware would be too stupid to make their affection system work with future companions but Bioware could of at least tweaked the daily quests to maybe allow some affection gain for HK-51... You would think they only hire programmers like fresh outta highschool or something with how hard, difficult and long it takes them to do anything.
    Last edited by Argroth; 2012-12-28 at 06:36 PM.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Not trying to be overly critical, but the foundation of the game doesn't really lend itself to an achievement system. It's not open enough and there aren't 'real' professions to accomplish a lot of what other games have for achievements. Nor is space varied enough, nor is there enough 'extra' activities outisde of raiding and pvp.

    It's a pity too, because whoever designed a lot of rare experiences (like the +10 datacrons and some other unique datacrons, Theoretika, etc) would have done a great job if they were given free reign to design challenges just for an achievement system.
    I disagree about the "foundation of the game". There are nooks and crannies on almost every planet. That would go toward exploration. Completing a certain number of quests. Killing bosses in Operations. Killing bosses in FPs. HKs in WZs. Winning WZs by a certain amount. Overcoming a deficit in a WZ. Hell, there are a ton of achievements that could be linked to Huttball by itself. But the biggest problem with the codex system, at least in game, is that you don't even know you've completed a codex entry until you've done it. It gives you nothing specific to aim for.

  7. #7
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    There are nooks and crannies on almost every planet.
    There is no amount of rationalization that can say this game has exploration. You can only go where they tell you that you can go. I really don't understand how hard of a concept it is to realize that if you can constantly not go anywhere b/c of invisible walls and insurmountable landmarks that there is no exploration in a game.

    I also said that there aren't enough extra activities to justify a real achievement system. Sure you could arbitrarily add achievements for PvP and Ops, but that doesn't have a lot of weight on its own. Also, not enough happens in most of the fights for there to be gimmicky, but fun achievements. The content is far too easy to actually achieve something in it.

    There aren't holidays, aren't side professions, aren't side activities, just now introduced pets and an explosion of mounts for the cash shop..but that used to not exist either. The structure of space doesn't allow for expanding achievements to it by doing things faster, or harder, or more skilled, because it's a straight shot through the same scenario over and over and over.

  8. #8
    Epic! OneSent's Avatar
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    Yeah, I honestly can't believe it's still broken over a year later. And I will never understand why they scrapped so many of the titles from beta at the last minute. It's not even that the Codex is broken really, it's just still full of a bunch of things that aren't even possible to achieve in the game any more. I spent a few weeks scouring the planets before I finally just gave up.

    When I got 'War Hero' back in March, I never got the Codex or title for it. It was the only ticket I ever made in-game and I got that CSR droid telling me "Sorry for the inconvenience, keep an eye out on the patch notes for a fix." Well Mr. Protocol Droid U4-TO.... I'm still waiting!

    As far as an achievement system goes, also back in March, Damion Shubert mentioned in an interview that they were working on the internal designs for an achievement system. Achievements are simply a way to give purpose to otherwise monotonous tasks in-game. It makes something out of nothing, really. Kill 10,000 rats? There's an achievement for that!

    A proper achievement system would have given players something different to do and probably kept them interested in the game longer. I would resub today if they implemented one. But again, I'm still waiting for that too. EA/Mythic's Warhammer Online had an achievement system (where do you think Blizzard got the idea?), GW2 has one and Rift launched with one of the most robust achievement systems of any MMO.

    It's guess it's just another one of those "must-haves" that Bioware decided their game didn't need.
    Seeking wildness and solitude in a self-destructive world.

  9. #9
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneSent View Post
    EA/Mythic's Warhammer Online had an achievement system (where do you think Blizzard got the idea?)
    Uhh...from Microsoft. You know, where all companies got the idea from.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    There is no amount of rationalization that can say this game has exploration. You can only go where they tell you that you can go. I really don't understand how hard of a concept it is to realize that if you can constantly not go anywhere b/c of invisible walls and insurmountable landmarks that there is no exploration in a game.

    I also said that there aren't enough extra activities to justify a real achievement system. Sure you could arbitrarily add achievements for PvP and Ops, but that doesn't have a lot of weight on its own. Also, not enough happens in most of the fights for there to be gimmicky, but fun achievements. The content is far too easy to actually achieve something in it.

    There aren't holidays, aren't side professions, aren't side activities, just now introduced pets and an explosion of mounts for the cash shop..but that used to not exist either. The structure of space doesn't allow for expanding achievements to it by doing things faster, or harder, or more skilled, because it's a straight shot through the same scenario over and over and over.
    I understand your rationale behind the invisible walls, however, it isn't any different than WoW, Rift, etc. The walls set up in those games happen to be borders that take you into another zone. Hell, Diablo has walls but still allows for exploration. Using "invisible walls" or "insurmountable landmarks" as an argument why it CAN'T have any exploration isn't valid.

    Also, I agree that the content is easy, but that doesn't mean there can't be achieves to be had. For example, killing Soa without taking off any of his stacks during transition phases could have been an achievement. Just because the content is easy doesn't mean there can't be an achievement associated with it. Hell, other games have achievements for reaching max level. WoW has achieves for "/love"ing animals. How difficult is that?

    As for a lack of holidays, it's not like they CAN'T be implemented and achievements given for doing them. Rift didn't have a summer world event until they had the summer world event this past year. They created achievements to go along with that event. The point I'm getting at is just because it doesn't exist now doesn't mean it can't exist ever. Do they need to add more things? Of course. Would they need to add more things in order to have a more robust achievement system? Most definitely. Does that mean they can't have an achievement system for their current content? Hardly.

  11. #11
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    IDo they need to add more things? Of course. Would they need to add more things in order to have a more robust achievement system? Most definitely. Does that mean they can't have an achievement system for their current content? Hardly.
    But this is exactly my point for many reasons

    1) They are not going to put the effort into adding/modifying things to make a 'real' achievement system
    2) People would not be satisfied with a not 'real' achievement system

    It's very simple. If they put in an achievement system that doesn't match the depths of other MMOs, it fails. Just like all of their other features that didn't make it to par failed. This game would require so much more meat on its backbone to reinforce an achievement system you could predict the end of the world before they would start doing that.

    The point of things being too easy are that designing achievements after the fact won't feel very cohesive or challenging. When they design raids, they also design the achievements. I doubt achievements really affect the design of an encounter, but they are definitely created in tandom. This is apparent because the achievements have to be possible and are often specifically mechanic related. That is what doesn't exist in SWTOR because the encounters are too simple.

    Unlike WoW, where the achievements can often present a challenge in a raid setting...SWTOR's would run the risk of being arbitrary and incredible simple, or taking a simple encounter and making it ridiculously hard through poor achivement 'design' (since it wasn't made with the encounter in mind) ((admittedly this would please some people))

    Bottom line, it's more important that people wouldn't be satisfied with a half assed achievement system. Right now that is already in the game, they just call it a codex.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    *Snip*
    I think you're making a lot of assumptions there. Being able to link that you finished an Op on HM or NM would definitely satisfy people. Having it be more user friendly would satisfy people. Being able to see what achievements you HAVEN'T gotten would satisfy people. It would at least satisfy people more than the current system, which automatically makes it better.

    As for Ops bosses, just off the top of my head, I can think of two achievements associated with Karagga. 1) Nobody in your group takes damage from the little droids. 2 ) Kill Karagga without cleansing any gravity wells. For Bonethrasher : Kill Bonethrasher without more than 1 raid member getting hit by his swipe. There are others, but like I said, it's possible. It doesn't matter the level of difficulty. And that's just Ops achievements.

    However, WoW implemented their achievement system after the original game and Burning Crusade. For those raids, all you have to do was finish them to get an achievement. Once they finally DID implement the achievement system, they started to design their achievements around their raid encounters. So why wouldn't TOR be able to do the same thing?

  13. #13
    They could design an achievement system, but even for WoW I still don't think its worth the effort they put into it. Granted I'm not a big achievement person, mainly because other than the few titles and mounts, it doesn't really do anything. Always wished the points were worth something, might get me to actually care.

    I kind of agree with Kitty though, at this point and time, what would be the real need for it? I mean I guess you could use it prove you finished something, but they would need to add so much more open world things to really make it useful. WoW's were fairly basic early on, but now it at least feels like they develop the achievements and content together.

    If they just got the codex working it would pretty much be all this game currently needs.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Armourboy View Post
    They could design an achievement system, but even for WoW I still don't think its worth the effort they put into it. Granted I'm not a big achievement person, mainly because other than the few titles and mounts, it doesn't really do anything. Always wished the points were worth something, might get me to actually care.

    I kind of agree with Kitty though, at this point and time, what would be the real need for it? I mean I guess you could use it prove you finished something, but they would need to add so much more open world things to really make it useful. WoW's were fairly basic early on, but now it at least feels like they develop the achievements and content together.

    If they just got the codex working it would pretty much be all this game currently needs.
    You're admittedly not an achievement person, so of course you would have this kind of mindset. For somebody who IS an achievement person, it's much more user friendly than the current codex system. Also, it's not about using it to acquire things. It's about the feeling of accomplishment. Once again, you're not an achievement person, so you wouldn't understand. If it wasn't worth the effort, PS3 wouldn't have introduced trophies, WoW, Rift, LotRO, etc. wouldn't have implemented achievements, so on and so forth. XBox 360 proved that there is a rather large demographic that find it to definitely be worth the effort.

  15. #15
    Titan Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notorious98 View Post
    However, WoW implemented their achievement system after the original game and Burning Crusade. For those raids, all you have to do was finish them to get an achievement. Once they finally DID implement the achievement system, they started to design their achievements around their raid encounters. So why wouldn't TOR be able to do the same thing?
    Do you really need an answer to that question? Why haven't they been able to do x,y,z,a,b,c,1,2,3, or 4 in a correct and timely manner? Incompetence was the previous answer, greed might be the past and present answer, but wasting time for the cash shop is definitely an answer now. Unless they let you purchase an achievement system from the Cartel Market, I don't expect to see one.

  16. #16
    would be nice if they actually fixed the codex. I am missing 3 pvp achievements and 2 titles, I have scoured every single planet. I have found everything I think I can possibly find on my main char but Im still way short of the amount of codex entries because some are class specific but still included int he class of my main. I am stuck at 693/819 codex entries on my BH. It has been months since I have done a sweep of the galaxy to see if they have put in the missing ones. Maybe I'll do another sweep, but I'm pretty sure bioware has just given up at this point.

  17. #17
    There are loads and loads of "named" or "rare" mobs some are challenging if done on they level, I always had fun in finding them and killing while leveling chars.

    For a max level they drop shit loot but they could made fun like Bounties for they heads, interesting drops or vanity etc etc etc
    Warlock / IA Operative / Wizard / Engineer

  18. #18
    Bloodsail Admiral Jamos77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Do you really need an answer to that question? Why haven't they been able to do x,y,z,a,b,c,1,2,3, or 4 in a correct and timely manner? Incompetence was the previous answer, greed might be the past and present answer, but wasting time for the cash shop is definitely an answer now. Unless they let you purchase an achievement system from the Cartel Market, I don't expect to see one.
    There's hope though. SOE made more of a mess of SWG than BW could ever hope to make with TOR. I'm sure the whole MMO world has heard of the NGE and it's fallout. Incompetence? greed? SOE had been there and done that. However already a year after the NGE the development team at SWG started to improve their quality of output and within a short time had implemented some fantastic ingame features (one of which was a comprehensive achievement system). Noone who played from 2005 to 2011 can say the game didn't get progressively better and better with nearly every update outdoing the previous one.

    If SOE could come back from such a nightmare as the NGE was then surely there's hope for TOR. Now, I wouldn't bet my mortgage on it, lol but imo there's a good chance the content quality will improve over time.
    SWG - Jamus Divinus - Bria 2005-2011

    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    There is plenty to criticize with the game and BioWares handling of it without resorting to exaggeration, so let's not do it : /

  19. #19
    Keyboard Turner
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    Why does anyone still play this game?

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Do you really need an answer to that question? Why haven't they been able to do x,y,z,a,b,c,1,2,3, or 4 in a correct and timely manner? Incompetence was the previous answer, greed might be the past and present answer, but wasting time for the cash shop is definitely an answer now. Unless they let you purchase an achievement system from the Cartel Market, I don't expect to see one.
    That's not the point I'm getting at. This isn't a "Why the hell does EA/BW suck?" rant. It's merely pointing out that it's not an insurmountable task to put an achievement system in place and there's enough in the game currently to be able to give a number of achievements.

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