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  1. #221
    Are the Forsaken Evil?

    Rank and file? - No.
    Leadership? - Yes.

    Really since the creating of the new plague it has been pretty clear that Sylvanas wants to be the next LK.


    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    It was stated that holy and discipline trees are avalaible to them purely because of gameplay reasons.
    True until Blizzard decided to make all races use the Light. Forsaken use it, Night Elves are hinted to use it. I sometimes think George Lucas is giving Bliz story advice.

  2. #222
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Absolutely. Prior to Cataclysm I kinda enjoyed their story.

    Prior to Cata we saw them as a race that was more or less breaking every moral code in the book for the sake of vengeance against the Scourge while being ravenously hunted by the Scarlet Crusade. At times they were rotten to the core and evil and were all to happy to stab their "allies" in the back at a moments notice, then they had moments where you did feel a bit of sympathy for these people who had been turned into walking corpses.

    Now they're evil. They're a race now pretty much hell bent on killing everybody who aren't one of their "allies" (for now). Plague everywhere, Necromancy and open betrayal of the Horde with their disregard for the use of a banned weapon. They're sadistic and really don't give a toss for who they kill. They're now content with raiding their foes into their sorry state of existence for the sake of conquering more land and keep Sylvanas alive.
    "The hunter is nothing without the hunt" pretty much sums them up atm imho, they've had their revenge on the Scourge and Arthas and now they've rather lost the plot.
    That's exactly what I think, too. I never played an Undead, because I hate their zombie-like appearance, but I always really dug their overall "feel". They really felt like the true underdog. The line I remember most was one of the NPC's saying something along the lines of "I don't know which bothers me more; that I don't have feelings for my family anymore, or that I simply don't care". You really felt like these were actual people, who had been changed by their experiences in undeath. Now, though, it's "I'm so goddamn evil, I'm going to murder a puppy, *foams at mouth*". They lack the haunting sense of despair and emptiness that made them so compelling to begin with.

  3. #223
    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    That's exactly what I think, too. I never played an Undead, because I hate their zombie-like appearance, but I always really dug their overall "feel". They really felt like the true underdog. The line I remember most was one of the NPC's saying something along the lines of "I don't know which bothers me more; that I don't have feelings for my family anymore, or that I simply don't care". You really felt like these were actual people, who had been changed by their experiences in undeath. Now, though, it's "I'm so goddamn evil, I'm going to murder a puppy, *foams at mouth*". They lack the haunting sense of despair and emptiness that made them so compelling to begin with.
    If I wanted to play as a desperate wreck I would roll a Night Elf.

  4. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by Claymore View Post
    That's exactly what I think, too. I never played an Undead, because I hate their zombie-like appearance, but I always really dug their overall "feel". .
    haha pretty much how I think

    Though I dont really dig the Forsaken just find them very interesting.
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  5. #225
    Stood in the Fire Shefu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    If I wanted to play as a desperate wreck I would roll a Night Elf.
    Haha, nice! But it's true on so many levels. People feel pity for the Forsaken, but take a look the Night Elves, they're still crying over their past. Even the BE's managed to get it together. Yet the Forsaken are "hateful!" right.

  6. #226
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shefu View Post
    Haha, nice! But it's true on so many levels. People feel pity for the Forsaken, but take a look the Night Elves, they're still crying over their past. Even the BE's managed to get it together. Yet the Forsaken are "hateful!" right.
    How are the Night Elves crying over their past in any way?

  7. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    How are the Night Elves crying over their past in any way?
    I guess he means their lost immortality,they are a bit whiny about it. Though I wouldn't call it crying, just very serious trouble to adapt to mortality.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  8. #228
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    No, it's not reasonable.
    Because for every shared trait between the Forsaken and the Scourge, I could come up with a trait shared with the Humans.
    That doesn't mean you can say they are becoming like the Scourge.

    I'm not even going to discuss this fallacy.
    Your opinion seems to be that, just because two groups, here the Forsaken and the Scourge, are both participating in the same "activity", here the killing of living people and the raising of said people into undeath, doesn't mean that they are the same. Your argument is that even if they share one trait, they are not 100% the same.

    No 2 groups are 100% the same. That's why they're different groups. That doesn't mean you can't compare them to each other.
    For example, if the humans make a pact with demons and invade a different world to conquer it, no matter how unlikely that is, it's perfectly reasonable to compare them to orcs. You can't say, that that comparison would be unjustified, because that's the only thing humans and orcs have in common.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    So? Just because Drek'thar has this opinion doesn't mean it's the truth.
    Even their own allies consider them vile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    To be fair Drek'thar is a bit biased just simply because he isnt undead

    To a living person decaying vegetation and fields of fungus and mushrooms is nasty and destruction of otherwise pristine land, but to a Forsaken thats not destruction of land but the better-ment of the land
    That is just fucking stupid. Rot and decay is rot and decay. "You just can't appreciate it because you are not undead!"

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-01 at 08:22 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    I guess he means their lost immortality,they are a bit whiny about it. Though I wouldn't call it crying, just very serious trouble to adapt to mortality.
    They're not whiny. They've accepted it to a great extent.

  9. #229
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    That is just fucking stupid. Rot and decay is rot and decay. "You just can't appreciate it because you are not undead!"[COLOR="red"]
    Rot and decay is important part of life, is it not?

    If anything, Undeath represents preservance.

  10. #230
    To me, it sounds like their will of vengeance from the first video has been completed, since Arthas is done for now
    Quote Originally Posted by kasath
    is anyone in this group under 18? my parole officer says I'm not allowed to play wow with anyone under 18

  11. #231
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    Rot and decay is important part of life, is it not?

    If anything, Undeath represents preservance.
    That doesn't mean you should bring it everywhere. Important part of life, because everything that lives, dies at some point. You might as well suggest we should kill everything or turn everything into undeath. Only makes you sound more like the Scourge.
    Last edited by Nindoriel; 2013-01-01 at 07:51 PM.

  12. #232
    Deathguard Dillinger:

    Speaking frankly, the Forsaken of yesteryear were a sniveling, pathetic group. We huddled together in decrepit old human buildings, hiding from the Scourge, cowering from the Alliance, and groveling at the foot of the Horde.

    Look before you now, and see the product of the new Forsaken. We have made our mark here on Azeroth, and that mark will grow. Our dominion will soon blanket the world!

    You want my advice? Speak with Magistrate Sevren in Brill, down this road. He runs that town.

    I think that describes well what were the Forsaken and what they are now

  13. #233
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zodrack View Post
    Deathguard Dillinger:

    Speaking frankly, the Forsaken of yesteryear were a sniveling, pathetic group. We huddled together in decrepit old human buildings, hiding from the Scourge, cowering from the Alliance, and groveling at the foot of the Horde.

    Look before you now, and see the product of the new Forsaken. We have made our mark here on Azeroth, and that mark will grow. Our dominion will soon blanket the world!

    You want my advice? Speak with Magistrate Sevren in Brill, down this road. He runs that town.

    I think that describes well what were the Forsaken and what they are now
    They weren't really hiding, cowering or grovelling before.

  14. #234
    I'm curious about what the High Elves think of the Forsaken. The Blood Elves are sympathetic because of Sylvannas. The High Elves have that same connection.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  15. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    I'm curious about what the High Elves think of the Forsaken. The Blood Elves are sympathetic because of Sylvannas. The High Elves have that same connection.
    If Quel'lithien and Quel'Danil are any indication, they don't get along.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-02 at 12:56 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    They're not whiny. They've accepted it to a great extent.
    Which is why they planted a second world tree, trying to regain it. ... I see ^^
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  16. #236
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post

    Which is why they planted a second world tree, trying to regain it. ... I see ^^
    Putting up a new world tree is not whining, it's doing something about it

  17. #237
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Putting up a new world tree is not whining, it's doing something about it
    Pretty sure there was a lot of whining when it didn't work.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  18. #238
    Stood in the Fire Shefu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    How are the Night Elves crying over their past in any way?
    I don't know why some of you Alliance players are so much in denial really. You practically frown upon the stuff some of your precious Alliance races having be doing all along, yet if 1 Horde race acts in a similar fashion it's truly horrendous.

  19. #239
    Old God Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Pretty sure there was a lot of whining when it didn't work.
    Pretty sure there was a lot of "whining" when the humans of Lordaeron were turned into undead. Where there's tragedy, there is grief. But the Night Elves don't constantly complain about how bad fate has screwed them over. The new world tree has been blessed some time ago, and while the Night Elves are still mortal, if you look into it just for a bit you'll find that Night Elves have already accepted it.

    ---------- Post added 2013-01-02 at 03:20 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Shefu View Post
    I don't know why some of you Alliance players are so much in denial really. You practically frown upon the stuff some of your precious Alliance races having be doing all along, yet if 1 Horde race acts in a similar fashion it's truly horrendous.
    Nice argument, really. Doesn't answer my question at all, but it was still a compelling read. So I ask again, where are the Night Elves crying over their past? Are they running around Darnassus "Oh, the Sundering of the world 10000 years ago, I still cannot understand, why does bad stuff happen to us?". Are masses of Night Elves breaking into tears in the middle of battle "Oh why was our immortality lost to us, why is fate so cruel to us?"

    The Night Elves are probably one of the toughest races on Azeroth. They've been there for a long time, they've witnessed a lot, they fought a lot of battles, they beat down many foes, they've faced many dangers and they brought forth a lot of skilled fighters.

  20. #240
    Illidan was a Night Elf. He stayed super emo for thousands of years about being imprisoned and Tyrande not loving him.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

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