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  1. #81
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shefu View Post
    So it's ok for Night Elves to be hateful of every other race in game, or for humans to conquer and secure their lands but its not ok for the Forsaken? Yeah. Ok. They're evil, sure.
    The Night Elves don't hate every other race in the game. And the Horde is the one that tries to conquer everything, not the humans or the Alliance in general. And it's not that conquering or that killing or that hating that makes the Forsaken evil. It's things like developing a plague.

  2. #82
    Brewmaster Zeverin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    They also had their life taken away by them in the first place.
    Which is normal in every war; people die.
    The difference is that the Forsaken have an huge advantage that the Alliance can only aspire to get: they can rise the dead, and convince them to join their clan.

  3. #83
    I am Murloc! Alenarien's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheWindWalker View Post
    I remember before Cataclysm the Forsaken were just assumed to be "evil" and any outlier were just that. Since the "1-60 remake" happened the Forsaken intro and starting zone paint a much more benign picture of their situation and focus on it being voluntary and a matter of redemption, vengeance and second chances.
    I disagree. Pre-Cataclysm they were a much more interesting race; lost souls trying to come to grips with their Undeath, either cowering in fear or confusion or else more dark and sinister in their demeanour/actions.

    Post-Cataclysm? We have a one-dimensional race of evil zealots, following Sylvanas blindly/loyally and either killing or plaguing everything in sight. Were I to roleplay a Forsaken i'd go for the Pre-Cataclysm style.
    The first thing I remember about the world — and I pray that it may be the last — is that I was a stranger in it.” - Malcolm Muggeridge, Apologia pro vita sua (1968)

  4. #84
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UcanDoSht View Post
    Happans if you're in war... whats your point? Do you suggest that people die during wars?!
    If I remember correctly those people were civilians, farmers and so on. Not soldiers. It's also hypocritical of the Forsaken to say that they have a right to claim in death what was theirs in life, when they go to the still living citizens of Loredaeron and take exactly that by force what belongs to them.

  5. #85
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Well the only real difference between the current and the past forsaken is, that they have embraced what they have become. They no longer see their state as a curse and act accordingly, ironically this mindset brings them a lot closer to the scourge. The only main difference between scourge and Forsaken is the forsaken keep their free will, wile most members of the scourge do not.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  6. #86
    Stood in the Fire Shefu's Avatar
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    You need to read up on some Night Elf role buddy (in reply to Nindoriel).
    Last edited by Shefu; 2012-12-30 at 03:22 PM.

  7. #87
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shefu View Post
    You need to read up on some Night Elf role buddy.
    Was that post meant for another thread? It makes no sense here ;P
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  8. #88
    Brewmaster Zeverin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    If I remember correctly those people were civilians, farmers and so on. Not soldiers. It's also hypocritical of the Forsaken to say that they have a right to claim in death what was theirs in life, when they go to the still living citizens of Loredaeron and take exactly that by force what belongs to them.
    The slained soldiers/civilians joined Sylvanas willingly, and they're now living in death, on their former life's land.

  9. #89
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeverin View Post
    The slained soldiers/civilians joined Sylvanas willingly, and they're now living in death, on their former life's land.
    Yeah after they've already been killed. Can't go back to being alive. That doesn't make it better that they've killed them in the first place. Just look at Lilian Voss. You have a Forsaken character that, if she had the choice, she would've preferred to never have been turned into one of them.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Yeah after they've already been killed. Can't go back to being alive. That doesn't make it better that they've killed them in the first place. Just look at Lilian Voss. You have a Forsaken character that, if she had the choice, she would've preferred to never have been turned into one of them.
    And then you have those that got much better in undeath.

  11. #91
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    And then you have those that got much better in undeath.
    In what way better? Their bodes are decaying and falling apart.

  12. #92
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    If I remember correctly those people were civilians, farmers and so on. Not soldiers. It's also hypocritical of the Forsaken to say that they have a right to claim in death what was theirs in life, when they go to the still living citizens of Loredaeron and take exactly that by force what belongs to them.
    Alliance forced the war with the Forsaken uppon themselves. And the Forsaken are also in full right to live in Lordaeron. Also, every pre and post Cataclysm Forsaken member has chosen to join them, and they're also free to decide to leave them at any point or disagree with the ressuraction at all.
    Most people do not realize the talent and skill it requires to be in a top guild. Many of you think its only about time invested, but that couldn't be further from the truth.

  13. #93
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    In what way better? Their bodes are decaying and falling apart.
    In theory every last forsaken could become a lich at some point, meaning their former body becomes meaningless.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    In what way better? Their bodes are decaying and falling apart.
    And they feel no pain, they dont tire and dont need to feed or drink. Advantages outnumber the disadvantages. You keep focusing on the aesthetics, yet you should focus on mental atributes.

    Not every individual is prepared for such drastic change, but those with strong will can adapt and prosper.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Bulletnips View Post
    What then? The Lich King is dead and so is their purpose to exist. Blizzard recognised this and shaped the forsaken's story away from tragedy and despair and into one of pure cruelty and borderline insanity/evil. They are no longer victims, but the perpetuators of horrific acts, they even gain pleasure from the suffering of others. The forsaken have now embraced undeath they see it as a gift, they exist only to secure their empire and eliminate the alliance and then the living from their lands.
    When you put it like that, the Forsaken are even more evil than the Scourge. Because the Scourge was meant as a weapon to defeat the Burning Legion. It's just that the rest of Azeroth didn't want to become part of it, choosing instead to follow their own methods.

  16. #96
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UcanDoSht View Post
    Alliance forced the war with the Forsaken uppon themselves. And the Forsaken are also in full right to live in Lordaeron. Also, every pre and post Cataclysm Forsaken member has chosen to join them, and they're also free to decide to leave them at any point or disagree with the ressuraction at all.
    If the Forsaken are in full right to live in Lordaeron, then so are the very people the Forsaken fight in Lordaeron.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    The Night Elves don't hate every other race in the game.
    Well, they did in Warcraft 3. Before WoW neutered them.

  18. #98
    Over 9000! Combatbulter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    When you put it like that, the Forsaken are even more evil than the Scourge. Because the Scourge was meant as a weapon to defeat the Burning Legion. It's just that the rest of Azeroth didn't want to become part of it, choosing instead to follow their own methods.
    What? The Scourge was a tool, created by the legion to weaken the races of Azeroth, so they could steamroll through.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    If the Forsaken are in full right to live in Lordaeron, then so are the very people the Forsaken fight in Lordaeron.
    True, this entire situation could be labelled civil war.
    He who sees his own doom can better avoid its path. He who sees the doom of others can deliver it.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    If the Forsaken are in full right to live in Lordaeron, then so are the very people the Forsaken fight in Lordaeron.
    The still living population of Lordaeron has all the rights to secure their homeland for themselves.

    Oh whats that, they cant because they are but weak remnants? Too bad.

  20. #100
    Well, I'd say the Forsaken have more right. When they claimed the land it was in ruin and abandoned (all the run-down buildings). The Forsaken rebuilt those structures after the Cataclysm.

    EDIT: The living can have all the Lordaeron land they want, they just have to die for it like the Forsaken did.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

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